Vengeance Producer Suite - AVENGER - 1.8.5 the main thread

[loachm]

....thanks for the link with the manual, Manuel - very well written in a straight-forward manner.

However, a few things still aren't quite clear to me. I'm aware, that the following is quite case-specific and thus couldn't probably be covered in a kind of "overview" type manual, that isn't supposed to have hundereds of pages with explanations for serveral use cases. I've read the sections, that interested me and I also watched the videos again, but I still can't figure these things out. So I'd be glad, if it would be possible, that you could answer a few of them. Thanks!


Resample/Wavetables:
If I move the play range of the wave in the resampler, there is no snap to zero function, so I'd have to look for a zero-crossing myself. But I guess, the Adapt knob is supposed to cover for that, so that I don't have to do the fiddly work, correct?

If I import a sample with a pitch drift, is there a function to flatten the pitch or should I prepare the samples beforehand in something like Melodyne, for instance?

Currently it isn't possible to create a wavetable for multiple sound sources/singe cycle files. At first I'd have to cut them together in a wave editor, is that correct?


Samples:
I guess I can import my own samples into the Sample stacker (not sure, if I've missed this in the videos), but can I set loop points for the samples and can I modulate these?


FFT Editor:
Can the single harmonics in the FFT Editor be modulated by any modulation source (not just the random VSpeed/VStrength)?


Arpeggiator:
Can I load patterns from different files into one Arpeggiator (for pattern A-D) or can I compensate this by loading them into another Arp and then copy and paste what I want?

Would it be possible to program & control the Arp completely via midi (via step entering notes & velocites)
and controlling the values via midi CC? Could I switch between the Arp tabs via midi? Can the patterns of an Arp be triggered via midi CC or key-switches? I know, that Avenger is rather a comprehensive studio workstation, but due to its massive feature set, it might also be a very cool live instrument.


Thanks for all the explanations & comprehensive videos - it's a really interesting and very ambitious instrument and I hope, everything will work for you guys, like you have planned it. The more I think about it, I realise, Avenger could be used for the majority of my synth and even sample work. I'm quite conservative about the usage of instruments and I rather like to use a few than many. At first I thought Avenger is a feature overkill, thanks to all the info, you've given, I'm seriously considering Avenger as a new centrepiece of my setup.

[goleat]

Hi, Is there a manual in spanish?

[Touch The Universe]

I assume there will be a demo?

dp casually converted to a semi-legitimate question

[Touch The Universe]

Would be great to give all participants to this thread a 50% discount.
That is to the loyal fans.

That went horribly wrong with the Rapid thread...

What happened ?

The dev gave a few discounts to a select bunch of people who participated in the thread. Those who weren't picked were obviously upset. I was one of the lucky ones.

The synth is still overpriced but that's another subject.

Rapid is my favorite synth, I would of paid twice and been happy.

Mine too, and me too It took a few weeks messing with it full time for it to place at the top, for those just casually demoing, a lot would be missed. I just hope avenger is half as good and I'd be a happy customer, and by all accounts it looks like it could well be a more powerful synth. Super happy to have both though

[db3]

Hi, Is there a manual in spanish?

No I believe Manuel's only available in German

[msvs]

Resample/Wavetables:
If I move the play range of the wave in the resampler, there is no snap to zero function, so I'd have to look for a zero-crossing myself. But I guess, the Adapt knob is supposed to cover for that, so that I don't have to do the fiddly work, correct?

no, snap to zero would make no sense, since it would result in different tablesizes. But in a Wavetable all tables must have the same size. So you would have to enter the PITCH of the tone/sample manually in the Resampler module. + The increment can be set. Also you can enter as window size 1024, 2048 samples instead of a PITCH, or any other number (this imports Serum Wavetables for example, I guess they use all 2048)

If I import a sample with a pitch drift, is there a function to flatten the pitch or should I prepare the samples beforehand in something like Melodyne, for instance?

no you should use melodyne or autotune to even it before. This gives better results. For small pitch drifts or Vibrato, the Adapt feature of Avenger works.

Currently it isn't possible to create a wavetable for multiple sound sources/singe cycle files. At first I'd have to cut them together in a wave editor, is that correct?

yes

I guess I can import my own samples into the Sample stacker (not sure, if I've missed this in the videos), but can I set loop points for the samples and can I modulate these?

both not. The Loop points should also be in the wav (I use Wavelab for example, any audio editor will do)

Can the single harmonics in the FFT Editor be modulated by any modulation source (not just the random VSpeed/VStrength)?

no, this would have been too CPU intensive. Furthermore you would have 256 modulation targets. But we have a "shift" knob, which works quite well to add additional movement.

Can I load patterns from different files into one Arpeggiator (for pattern A-D) or can I compensate this by loading them into another Arp and then copy and paste what I want?

yes you can copy paste into any Pattern A B C D

Would it be possible to program & control the Arp completely via midi (via step entering notes & velocites)
and controlling the values via midi CC? Could I switch between the Arp tabs via midi? Can the patterns of an Arp be triggered via midi CC or key-switches? I know, that Avenger is rather a comprehensive studio workstation, but due to its massive feature set, it might also be a very cool live instrument.

no, then we would have a DAW, not a Synthesizer

[msvs]

here is another video for you, showing the MIDI learn, as promised

[Cinebient]

Just saw the new video about midi learn and that is another great workflow. Better than that common right click, activate learn, move your knob etc.
Avenger seems to have so many great little tricks and fast workflow that i think it will have a very important thing.....it will be easy, fast and fun to create patches. Now i just hope my little cpu can handle it (better as Falcon at least).

[zvenx]

You really think so?
Whats the advantage of this method?
It strikes me as re-inventing the wheel and making it not a complete circle but still getting the job done.

rsp

[Ingonator]

Resample/Wavetables:
If I move the play range of the wave in the resampler, there is no snap to zero function, so I'd have to look for a zero-crossing myself. But I guess, the Adapt knob is supposed to cover for that, so that I don't have to do the fiddly work, correct?

no, snap to zero would make no sense, since it would result in different tablesizes. But in a Wavetable all tables must have the same size. So you would have to enter the PITCH of the tone/sample manually in the Resampler module. + The increment can be set. Also you can enter as window size 1024, 2048 samples instead of a PITCH, or any other number (this imports Serum Wavetables for example, I guess they use all 2048)

I imported Icarus wavetables using the size of 2048 samples too and those wavetables work nicely. You are able to import WAV wavetables with up to 256 waveforms which is the maximum in both Icarus and Serum (and AFAIK no wavetable synth has more waveforms than this).

[Cinebient]

You really think so?
Whats the advantage of this method?
It strikes me as re-inventing the wheel and making it not a complete circle but still getting the job done.

rsp

For me it will be faster and i like it more this way.
Of course that doesn't mean that others find it useful too since it might be personal preference.

[Sampleconstruct]

This seems to be a promising instrument.

[loachm]

Hey Manuel, thanks a lot for answering all the question - I really appreciate it!

no, snap to zero would make no sense, since it would result in different tablesizes. But in a Wavetable all tables must have the same size. So you would have to enter the PITCH of the tone/sample manually in the Resampler module. + The increment can be set. Also you can enter as window size 1024, 2048 samples instead of a PITCH, or any other number (this imports Serum Wavetables for example, I guess they use all 2048)

...my bad - I should have written the sample start and I guess, I have mixed up the resampler mode and the wavetable mode. I was thinking about the part in the video where you're changing the play range of the whole wavefile in the resampler. There a snap to zero function might come handy and I guess, from that point on the engine could choose an appropriate range for the wavetable frames in accordance with the root pitch to compensate for that (if it doesn't do that already). I guess, it already works that I just use a range, convert it to a wavetable and, if I hear clicks, I use the Adapt knob. Usually, it's no big deal to look for a zero-crossing manually, but if you work on a number of files, such a snap function is quite useful, as you just set your range and you don't have to zoom in anymore, as you know, it's just right. And like I said, the engine could adjust the play range according to the frame size and interpolate the end, if needed.

no you should use melodyne or autotune to even it before. This gives better results. For small pitch drifts or Vibrato, the Adapt feature of Avenger works.

...that's what I meant with preparing beforehand.

no, this would have been too CPU intensive. Furthermore you would have 256 modulation targets. But we have a "shift" knob, which works quite well to add additional movement.

...again - my bad, as I should have been more precise (was simultaneously checking videos and the manual when I wrote this, just to make sure, and it obviously made my wording sloppy - sorry). Of course, I meant just the harmonic bands and not every single one of the 256 bands. Since these are already grouped harmonically, I imagine, it might be possible to adress these 25 (?) as modulation targets.

Would it be possible to program & control the Arp completely via midi (via step entering notes & velocites)
and controlling the values via midi CC? Could I switch between the Arp tabs via midi? Can the patterns of an Arp be triggered via midi CC or key-switches? I know, that Avenger is rather a comprehensive studio workstation, but due to its massive feature set, it might also be a very cool live instrument.

no, then we would have a DAW, not a Synthesizer

...no. sorry, that wouldn't be a DAW. What I described would be like having up to eight 303 type sequencers, that would provide step-entering notes and could be controlled with just one midi controller.

I guess, the ten controls below the arp sequence can already be mapped to midi. Additionally, you'd just need a (midi) control for "next/previous step", one for the note length of the current step (since they can already be adjusted individually). The note and the velocity for the current step could be entered via the midi notes. You could also make your two pattern shift functions available to midi cc as well as the four patterns. So that would be a total of 15 controls to control one Arpeggiator, I guess. If I now would allow a 16th midi cc to switch between the eight Arps (so that only the one that's currently displayed can be edited), I could control all eight with just 16 midi controls. I think, something like that is totally feasible and would be welcomed both in the studio as well as live, I assume. Anyway, just a suggestion.

[msvs]

..again - my bad, as I should have been more precise (was simultaneously checking videos and the manual when I wrote this, just to make sure, and it obviously made my wording sloppy - sorry). Of course, I meant just the harmonic bands and not every single one of the 256 bands. Since these are already grouped harmonically, I imagine, it might be possible to adress these 25 (?) as modulation targets.

yes, only the bands from the harmonic mode could be possible. We will check if its feasible in one of the next updates

I guess, the ten controls below the arp sequence can already be mapped to midi. Additionally, you'd just need a (midi) control for "next/previous step", one for the note length of the current step (since they can already be adjusted individually). The note and the velocity for the current step could be entered via the midi notes. You could also make your two pattern shift functions available to midi cc as well as the four patterns. So that would be a total of 15 controls to control one Arpeggiator, I guess. If I now would allow a 16th midi cc to switch between the eight Arps (so that only the one that's currently displayed can be edited), I could control all eight with just 16 midi controls. I think, something like that is totally feasible and would be welcomed both in the studio as well as live, I assume. Anyway, just a suggestion.

yes, ok I think a step sequencer could be implemented in a future update, should not be a big problem

[loachm]

You really think so?
Whats the advantage of this method?
It strikes me as re-inventing the wheel and making it not a complete circle but still getting the job done.

rsp

For me it will be faster and i like it more this way.
Of course that doesn't mean that others find it useful too since it might be personal preference.

...I quite like the midi mapping in Kontakt - there you'll have a list with all midi cc's and you can drag it to a parameter. The cool thing there is, that you can map one midi cc to multiple controls with different modulation strengths and polarities. It's basically that the midi controls can act as macro controls. So incorporating the midi mapping into the mod matrix or having a seperate midi tab in the mod matrix would be really cool...