KVR Audio

Sascha Franck · Post by **Sascha Franck** » Mon Dec 06, 2004 10:40 am

Midiworks wrote: Sascha is right, there should be a way to enter the
velocity that will be uses for dumping a 0-127 layer.

Nono, it's OK as it is, it was only meant to adress Sickle's question.
End value of velo layer will be the exported value.
You do however not need two values to define a velocity layer, because there's only one velocity exported along with each layer anyways. So, as 0-127 will export at 127 anyways you can just leave the "0" out.
Would be quite OK just to enter the "end values" of each layer. You may go for 30, 50, 70, 90 and 110 then, for example. No need to type in the ranges at all.

OK, what's missing most to bring it up to "Chainer" level:
- Realtime playability, sound device and MIDI setup to play the thing in realtime.
- Chaining and mixing VSTis (and FX, if possible).
- Broader export formats (mono/stereo, 24bit).

Then the thing which would REALLY get me into it:
- Autolooping.

Seriosly, if you manage to do the autolooping part properly, it'll be KICKASS! You just won't believe how many hours I spend on looping things properly, it's horrible!

- Sascha

Midiworks · Post by **Midiworks** » Mon Dec 06, 2004 11:48 am

Midiworks wrote: Sascha is right, there should be a way to enter the
velocity that will be uses for dumping a 0-127 layer.

No no, it's OK as it is, it was only meant to adress Sickle's question.
End value of velo layer will be the exported value.
You do however not need two values to define a velocity layer, because there's only one velocity exported along with each layer anyways. So, as 0-127 will export at 127 anyways you can just leave the "0" out.

Thats what I mean, "0-127 will export at 127 anyways", thats not good.
Many times 127, if not all the time is too much !
A work around would be to be able to lower the velocity of the VSTi directly,
or to specify the end-velocity of a 0-127 dump.
(and for this layer velocity only!)

Would be quite OK just to enter the "end values" of each layer. You may go for 30, 50, 70, 90 and 110 then, for example. No need to type in the ranges at all.

No, the way it is now, is VERY GOOD like it is.

NO CHANGE HERE PLEASE !
But to be able to specify the end-velo of a 0-127 dump, would be nice.

Seriosly, if you manage to do the autolooping part properly, it'll be KICKASS! You just won't believe how many hours I spend on looping things properly, it's horrible!

Yes, I agree !

But what you want is already there Sascha.
http://www.discodsp.com/highlife/
sfz export but no sf2 export.
Dumper, does velo splits better because the ranges
are user defined, NOT FIXED values like Highlife.
Highlifes autolooping is... "ok",
but we can get it much better, smoother than that.

When Dumper would be able to do velocity splits over
several different VSTi and great autolooping,
then it will become the best tool,
for to do such things !!!

I am sure CCT is up to the task.

MRT · Post by **MRT** » Mon Dec 06, 2004 12:30 pm

Wanted to thank up you for your work on this project. This has a lot of potential but wanted to mention again that I am not able to import the fonts created in Dumper into the sampler in Energy XT. As I mentioned before it seems that there does not appear to be instrument and sample names in the exported fonts? I have an early free version of Extreme Sample Converter(1.3), that I often use to pull wave files out of sound fonts. When attempting to load Dumper fonts I get an error "This file has incorrect format. Please use Vienna to correct chunks".
The Good news is that the files work correctly in Sfz and they also load without error in VSampler. VSampler also allows SF2 export and if I save your fonts out of VSampler they then load correctly in both XT and this early version of ESC.
I thought that maybe this info might help you identify what was happening.

Again thanks for the cool app.

MRT

AndreasE · Post by **AndreasE** » Mon Dec 06, 2004 1:01 pm

Sascha Franck wrote:OK, what's missing most to bring it up to "Chainer" level:
- Realtime playability, sound device and MIDI setup to play the thing in realtime.
- Chaining and mixing VSTis (and FX, if possible).
- Broader export formats (mono/stereo, 24bit).

When having included this we finally will have the long awaited Chainer update.

Sascha Franck · Post by **Sascha Franck** » Mon Dec 06, 2004 1:03 pm

Midiworks wrote: Thats what I mean, "0-127 will export at 127 anyways", thats not good.

Yeah. So just enter another value but 127 and you're there. Where's the problem?

No, the way it is now, is VERY GOOD like it is.
NO CHANGE HERE PLEASE !
But to be able to specify the end-velo of a 0-127 dump, would be nice.

Why in the world? There's only one single velocity exported per layer anyways. So one value would be sufficient as well.
In case you need to export more layers, well, set them up and enter their value again. Still no need for 2 numbers per layer.

But what you want is already there Sascha.
http://www.discodsp.com/highlife/
sfz export but no sf2 export.

Yeah well, I just don't own it and the demo won't save anything. Let alone that I'd need at least SF2 to be exported, as I would use anything in either EXS or Kontakt.

When Dumper would be able to do velocity splits over
several different VSTi and great autolooping,
then it will become the best tool,
for to do such things !!!

Defenitely!

I am sure CCT is up to the task.

Let's hope so!

Cheers,
Sascha

duncanparsons · Post by **duncanparsons** » Mon Dec 06, 2004 1:24 pm

sascha, I'm not entirely sold on your ideas about the layers.

eg. if the particular preset sounds really sweet at velocities of 60-80, but really harsh at 127, you would want to export at, say, 70, but have that mapped across 0-127 for the sf2.

equally in each layer, specifying just the endpoints makes a great deal of sense, however, you may wish to specifiy which velocity to use to get the sample for that layer. Again for layer 40-80, vel53 may sound better than vel80. The option to play with this would be VERY attractive...

DSP

Sascha Franck · Post by **Sascha Franck** » Mon Dec 06, 2004 1:52 pm

duncanparsons wrote:.
eg. if the particular preset sounds really sweet at velocities of 60-80, but really harsh at 127, you would want to export at, say, 70, but have that mapped across 0-127 for the sf2.

Oh, ok, now I see what you and Midiworks are on about! I would strongly agree on this for SF2 export as well!

Thing is, I actually just thought about wavefile export (thus doing the mapping job my myself). For that task only the "end velocity" (which would be the one used to trigger the sounds) would be relevant.

But as said, for SF2 export you and Midiworks are indeed spot on.

CCT · Post by **CCT** » Mon Dec 06, 2004 3:10 pm

So the way of exporting layers you mentioned was implemented

Now i am working on chainer so next release in about 2-7 days
http://audiolabz.com/chain.jpg

thanx for help

Sicklecell666 · Post by **Sicklecell666** » Mon Dec 06, 2004 3:25 pm

Fantastic!

Midiworks · Post by **Midiworks** » Mon Dec 06, 2004 10:01 pm

CCT wrote:So the way of exporting layers you mentioned was implemented

Right, it can also stay that way using multiple VSTi's.
Just make sure you add to each VSTi slot a Min & Max velocity range.
(exemple: set to 55-88, the VSTi will only play when it recieves notes in this velocity range.)

CCT wrote: Now i am working on chainer so next release in about 2-7 days
http://audiolabz.com/chain.jpg

Now take a look at this:

The blue sqares are ment to be the memory buttons for:
keybord split notes (top)
velocity splits (bottom)

Save, could be done by 'right mouse click' of the button.
Recall, by left clicking.
Or however...

Just an idea...

Lets take a look at Chainers way to load multiple VSTs:

Here we see:
Arrow: for loading VSTs and other things
Button: to turn on/off the VST
100: level
[C]: pan
100: wet (works like an aux way for the next VSTs in the chain.)
0: transpose (+/-36)
1: open editor
2: open editor (no gui) (not nessesary)
Patch selector: (always wished for a popup menu here)

So far so good, lets extend that now with:
Velo low
Velo high
(exemple: set to 55-88, the VSTi will only play when it recieves notes in this velocity range.)

Something like this would be extreamly cool !

I hope I did not forget anything...

Great work so far CCT !!!

Sicklecell666 · Post by **Sicklecell666** » Mon Dec 06, 2004 10:16 pm

Midiworks wrote: I hope I did not forget anything...

Great work so far CCT !!!

Maybe the velocity layer section would need to be dynamic & display info for the selcted VSti when multiple VSTi are loaded..So by having like 3 velocity layers you can split them between 3 synths, but you only see the velo info for the currently highlighted synth in the chain..

make sense?

Midiworks · Post by **Midiworks** » Mon Dec 06, 2004 10:23 pm

Sicklecell666 wrote:make sense?

Yes ! Very good idea.

EDIT: But what when we have velocity overlaps ?
(this would be one cool use.

)
Maybe some kind of lamps flashing on and off...

Poor CCT !

Sicklecell666 · Post by **Sicklecell666** » Mon Dec 06, 2004 10:46 pm

Midiworks wrote:
Sicklecell666 wrote:make sense?
Yes ! Very good idea.

EDIT: But what when we have velocity overlaps ?
(this would be one cool use. )
Maybe some kind of lamps flashing on and off...

Poor CCT !

It wouldn't matter. Say all 3 synths are set to 0-127. In this case, you dump all three synths' output in unison to a single wav file per key..

Sascha Franck · Post by **Sascha Franck** » Mon Dec 06, 2004 11:11 pm

Exporting multiple synths to multiple layers automatically would be quite a thing to have...

But, we should give that dude a break for now!

Personally, for me the most exciting thing would be some sort of autolooper. That'd just rule my world!

CCT · Post by **CCT** » Mon Dec 06, 2004 11:20 pm

No break

http://audiolabz.com/vd04.jpg

Chaining is almost done

To do -> config load/save, move up/move down, delete button

I think the best will be per vsti duration setting.

Autoloop is on the way too

I did some drawings at school hehe

edit:
Hmm so i throw out preset dialog, and add context menu to select presets. Bypass button for each vsti. Memory buttons is a good idea

VSTi -> sf2