Best VST instrument for relaxation, Ambient, sounds

[himalaya]

I find it awkward to read so many comments in the vein "lots of reverb/fx mangling on anything = ambient". Sure, reverb is essential in creating a sense of space, but so it is for any genre. The tails are just longer, but squeezing whatever random noodlings into a mile-long fx chain doesn't really result in particularly interesting music with long term value. It makes me wonder if these commenters make much ambient music, or like, at all.

You are right in that reverb is not the panacea for all such sounds, I tried to convey that pages ago.

But equally, a well crafted FX chain with reverb inserted at strategic places, can create deep, ambient washes of sound which would be impossible to create otherwise. It's never just about 'slapping' some reverb on a bus and sending all sounds to it, either. Once created, such a deep atmospheric sound needs to be set in the track with the rest of the sounds, if such are used, and these extra sounds may not need so much reverb, or any at all.

And do we make music? Myself, of course! commercial releases too.

But don't look to us as proof that copious amounts of effects are practical and actually used by artists releasing (ambient) albums. 'The Magnificent Void' album discussed throughout the last few pages is based on such FX-chains, without which it would not exist as we know it.

Having said that, there are ambient albums that do not use effects in such drastic ways.

And what comes to KVR's endless and pointless filter fetishism, it's just one part of a synth. I have synths with standard old DSP filters, I have synths with cutting edge ZDF filters, I have real analogs and one of m favourite synths doesn't even have a filter in it's signal path. I use them all together, and the idea of ranking them by their filters is just absurd as it has no connection whatsoever with their value as musical instruments. Filters are overrated.

In this context of ambient music, I fully agree.

[elassi]

I think that .jon's comment was more directed to the missing 'idea' (I'd rather say concept) of an ambient track when you just stack sounds/FX onto each other and then call it 'ambient' because it sounds like it.

[ghettosynth]

And why this tone again, of whether I am 'qualified' or not? You see how easy you fall into this aggressive style?

I'm talking about synths, you're talking about me. Are you hoping for some nudes or something? Seriously, you owe me an irony meter.

In fact, the audio example I posted pages ago uses a bog standard phaser in Warmverb and to my ears it provided all that I wanted from a phaser.

There you go.

Omnisphere can't hold a candle to Uhe synths for great analog pads.

Sure, but that's not what Omnisphere is about, equally, none of the U-he synths can do what Omni can with its multi-layered sample+synthesis stuff, for obvious reasons.

Completely wrong. There is no cross layer interaction in Omnisphere so it's rather trivial to do "multi layer" sample+synthesis stuff with better synthesizers and better samplers and better effects. There' no reason for Uhe synths to also be the sample layer when there are any other number of interesting choices that fill that role.

You are easily bamboozled by overpriced cheap tricks.

[ghettosynth]

I think that .jon's comment was more directed to the missing 'idea' (I'd rather say concept) of an ambient track when you just stack sounds/FX onto each other and then call it 'ambient' because it sounds like it.

I think that's inventing something that isn't here. I don't think that anyone has really stated much about process, no?

And I'm not buying this quality doesn't matter in every context in which you might want to exploit it either. Hell, I have HARDWARE synths with no filters, they sound like what they sound like, but, Omnisphere and Absynth are NOT synths without filters so what does that have to do with anything. Of course we don't judge synths without filters by their absent filter, but you better believe that it's fair to consider the quality of a filter in a synth when it's being argued that said synth is "top quality."

[layzer]

Maybe not quite as "pristine" and brilliant as some 200 € reverbs

you mean with a little more boost in the highs with an equalizer?

That's awesome news. You really should call Exponential Audio, Eventide, and 2C Audio, and tell them about it. I'm sure they will be greatly relieved that they don't have to spend any more tedious effort and work into that last 10% of sonic quality, when bedroom producers can achieve all that with applying some extra EQ. Nice find, homeboy.

you should try it "homeboy" it could save you lots of money.
never mind, keep catering to the companies targeting people
just like you.

[elassi]

I think that .jon's comment was more directed to the missing 'idea' (I'd rather say concept) of an ambient track when you just stack sounds/FX onto each other and then call it 'ambient' because it sounds like it.

And I'm not buying this quality doesn't matter in every context in which you might want to exploit it either.

Confused again?

[ghettosynth]

I think that .jon's comment was more directed to the missing 'idea' (I'd rather say concept) of an ambient track when you just stack sounds/FX onto each other and then call it 'ambient' because it sounds like it.

And I'm not buying this quality doesn't matter in every context in which you might want to exploit it either.

Confused again?

Is that all that you have to contribute to the conversation?

[elassi]

I think that .jon's comment was more directed to the missing 'idea' (I'd rather say concept) of an ambient track when you just stack sounds/FX onto each other and then call it 'ambient' because it sounds like it.

And I'm not buying this quality doesn't matter in every context in which you might want to exploit it either.

Confused again?

Is that all that you have to contribute to the conversation?

What else should I say when you quote me and start bitching about something that another person said (wrote)? I have no horse in your filter debate so why do you drag me into it?

I know the answer: You are on 100.000 Volt (again) and thus mix users and their statements. Not for the first time - as the word "again" underlines.

[ghettosynth]

I think that .jon's comment was more directed to the missing 'idea' (I'd rather say concept) of an ambient track when you just stack sounds/FX onto each other and then call it 'ambient' because it sounds like it.

And I'm not buying this quality doesn't matter in every context in which you might want to exploit it either.

Confused again?

Is that all that you have to contribute to the conversation?

What else should I say when you quote me and start bitching about something that another person said (wrote)? I have no horse in your filter debate so why do you drag me into it?

I know the answer: You are on 100.000 Volt (again) and thus mix users and their statements. Not for the first time - as the word "again" underlines.

You were discussing .jon's comment, not that I care, it's just a conversation. If you can't switch contexts then try the kids table.

[wagtunes]

I think that .jon's comment was more directed to the missing 'idea' (I'd rather say concept) of an ambient track when you just stack sounds/FX onto each other and then call it 'ambient' because it sounds like it.

And I'm not buying this quality doesn't matter in every context in which you might want to exploit it either.

Confused again?

Is that all that you have to contribute to the conversation?

Well, if you're not, I sure am. What exactly is it that we're arguing about? I was doing ambient music (back then we just called it experimental) before ambient music was even a thing. Look up all the so called "artists" who are considered ambient musicians. The list is a mile long and the styles as diverse as Philip Aaberg to Yanni, Yeah, go on and laugh. I love Yanni.

Point is, all these artists have used just about any synth imaginable and some no synths at all. So when I look at the title of this thread "Best VST instrument for relaxation, ambient, sounds"

1. We don't even necessarily have to be talking about synths.

2. How good or bad a filter is has nothing to do with making ambient music. You can make "good" ambient music with crappy filters just like you can make "bad" ambient music with great filters. Good and bad both being very subjective terms as I know tons of people who both love and hate Yanni.

So again, I gotta wonder just what the hell we're arguing about.

Yeah, I am totally confused.

PS - If you want to hear some of my early ambient music I'll have to kill you afterwards.

[elassi]

I think that .jon's comment was more directed to the missing 'idea' (I'd rather say concept) of an ambient track when you just stack sounds/FX onto each other and then call it 'ambient' because it sounds like it.

And I'm not buying this quality doesn't matter in every context in which you might want to exploit it either.

Confused again?

Is that all that you have to contribute to the conversation?

What else should I say when you quote me and start bitching about something that another person said (wrote)? I have no horse in your filter debate so why do you drag me into it?

I know the answer: You are on 100.000 Volt (again) and thus mix users and their statements. Not for the first time - as the word "again" underlines.

You were discussing .jon's comment, not that I care, it's just a conversation. If you can't switch contexts then try the kids table.

Keep on fighting, Ghetto Child, keep on.

[himalaya]

And why this tone again, of whether I am 'qualified' or not? You see how easy you fall into this aggressive style?

I'm talking about synths, you're talking about me. Are you hoping for some nudes or something? Seriously, you owe me an irony meter.

If all you were doing was talking about synths, it would be so nice !

In fact, the audio example I posted pages ago uses a bog standard phaser in Warmverb and to my ears it provided all that I wanted from a phaser.

There you go.

Well, of course! Has it escaped you that I write from my own experience, expressing my own point of view? You are not new to the internet forums, are you?

Omnisphere can't hold a candle to Uhe synths for great analog pads.

Sure, but that's not what Omnisphere is about, equally, none of the U-he synths can do what Omni can with its multi-layered sample+synthesis stuff, for obvious reasons.

Completely wrong. There is no cross layer interaction in Omnisphere so it's rather trivial to do "multi layer" sample+synthesis stuff with better synthesizers and better samplers and better effects. There' no reason for Uhe synths to also be the sample layer when there are any other number of interesting choices that fill that role.

No it's not wrong. Oh man, you are such a strange person! Omnisphere can do sounds that U-he synths can not. It a fact. And it's ok. It's as it should be with an instrument which uses samples.

The fact that you can buy and add sample based synths to complement the U-he synths (or any other non-sample synths) does not invalidate what I wrote in that quote! What skewed logic on your part! You really are a stubborn individual, hell bent to be 'right' at any cost, even when you make no sense! Talk about rising the goal posts: "Cross modulation...."

You are easily bamboozled by overpriced cheap tricks.

Are you saying that Omnisphere does some card tricks?

[ghettosynth]

I think that .jon's comment was more directed to the missing 'idea' (I'd rather say concept) of an ambient track when you just stack sounds/FX onto each other and then call it 'ambient' because it sounds like it.

And I'm not buying this quality doesn't matter in every context in which you might want to exploit it either.

Confused again?

Is that all that you have to contribute to the conversation?

Well, if you're not, I sure am. What exactly is it that we're arguing about? I was doing ambient music (back then we just called it experimental) before ambient music was even a thing. Look up all the so called "artists" who are considered ambient musicians. The list is a mile long and the styles as diverse as Philip Aaberg to Yanni, Yeah, go on and laugh. I love Yanni.

Point is, all these artists have used just about any synth imaginable and some no synths at all. So when I look at the title of this thread "Best VST instrument for relaxation, ambient, sounds"

1. We don't even necessarily have to be talking about synths.

2. How good or bad a filter is has nothing to do with making ambient music. You can make "good" ambient music with crappy filters just like you can make "bad" ambient music with great filters. Good and bad both being very subjective terms as I know tons of people who both love and hate Yanni.

So again, I gotta wonder just what the hell we're arguing about.

Yeah, I am totally confused.

PS - If you want to hear some of my early ambient music I'll have to kill you afterwards.

I was simply commenting on the relative limitation of Absynth and Omnisphere as compared to high quality modern synths. This is, after all, a recommendation thread. So, if you're going to say "Omni's great because high quality blah blah" then you're going to have to deal with someone calling that out and saying "I don't think that it is, and here's why." The problem that some guys seem to have is that they really can't counter the "here's why" with anything of substance and they get all butthurt.

When that doesn't work they want to talk about me, because more butthurt, and they're willing to try anything to get me to take back the mean words about Omni.

If you want to sound like a cliche in outdated DSP clothing, get Omni.

[himalaya]

If you want to sound like a cliche in outdated DSP clothing, get Omni.

The hurt and resentment in this one is strong.

[wagtunes]

I think that .jon's comment was more directed to the missing 'idea' (I'd rather say concept) of an ambient track when you just stack sounds/FX onto each other and then call it 'ambient' because it sounds like it.

And I'm not buying this quality doesn't matter in every context in which you might want to exploit it either.

Confused again?

Is that all that you have to contribute to the conversation?

Well, if you're not, I sure am. What exactly is it that we're arguing about? I was doing ambient music (back then we just called it experimental) before ambient music was even a thing. Look up all the so called "artists" who are considered ambient musicians. The list is a mile long and the styles as diverse as Philip Aaberg to Yanni, Yeah, go on and laugh. I love Yanni.

Point is, all these artists have used just about any synth imaginable and some no synths at all. So when I look at the title of this thread "Best VST instrument for relaxation, ambient, sounds"

1. We don't even necessarily have to be talking about synths.

2. How good or bad a filter is has nothing to do with making ambient music. You can make "good" ambient music with crappy filters just like you can make "bad" ambient music with great filters. Good and bad both being very subjective terms as I know tons of people who both love and hate Yanni.

So again, I gotta wonder just what the hell we're arguing about.

Yeah, I am totally confused.

PS - If you want to hear some of my early ambient music I'll have to kill you afterwards.

I was simply commenting on the relative limitation of Absynth and Omnisphere as compared to high quality modern synths. This is, after all, a recommendation thread. So, if you're going to say "Omni's great because high quality blah blah" then you're going to have to deal with someone calling that out and saying "I don't think that it is, and here's why." The problem that some guys seem to have is that they really can't counter the "here's why" with anything of substance and they get all butthurt.

When that doesn't work they want to talk about me, because more butthurt, and they're willing to try anything to get me to take back the mean words about Omni.

If you want to sound like a cliche in outdated DSP clothing, get Omni.

Well, I'm no Omni fanboi and make no mistake about it. Had I not sold a bunch of hardware that I was never going to use again to buy it (cost me nothing in the long run) I wouldn't have because I think $500 for a soft synth is insane.

Having said that, here is why I think Omni is fine for ambient music especially if you don't want to roll up your sleeves and make your own sounds.

The programmers did an excellent job of getting the most out of the synth and there are tons of patches that cover the ambient genre. The tagging system in the browser is excellent so they're easy to find.

A sound doesn't make something cliche. It's what you do with it. If that weren't true, we wouldn't have romplers to begin with. The music director of The Young and the Restless uses Omnisphere. The way he uses it, you wouldn't know it's Omnisphere. So don't blame the synth. Blame the musician.

As to your statement that Omnisphere's filters are old technology, I'll take your word for it. Still doesn't change my feelings on using the synth. And, as a challenge, I dare you or anybody to listen to my ambient and experimental tracks and pick out the Omnisphere patches. Trust me, you can't. Again, it's not the synth. It's the person using it.

That doesn't mean I think Omnisphere is the greatest thing since sliced bread. I think it's overpriced. You're essentially paying for the programming and the samples. Falcon can do way more. The problem with Falcon is you have to work at it way more.