Future of Logic Pro and Cubase on Mac

[apoclypse]

So we are starting to see some performance and test vids for music production software. So far LPX performs almost as well as a 10-core iMac in certain scenarios. Performs like crap in FLStudio using Rosetta (Not a surprise, FLStudio is written in Delphi most likely the framework needs to be updated to get better performance but it's very tied to x86 if I'm not mistaken). Reports are that Ableton 10 performs almost as well as it did on Intel using Rosetta, there could be issues with plugins. NI plugins doesn't install at all since Native Access gives an error. Have not heard anything on Bitwig or Cubase yet.

[jonljacobi]

The scenario I'm looking to see tested is where lots of samples need to be loaded into memory, such as Kontakt being used for orchestral playback. That's the one example I can think of where the relative small amount of memory might be a real hindrance.

[jonljacobi]

So we are starting to see some performance and test vids for music production software. So far LPX performs almost as well as a 10-core iMac in certain scenarios. Performs like crap in FLStudio using Rosetta (Not a surprise, FLStudio is written in Delphi most likely the framework needs to be updated to get better performance but it's very tied to x86 if I'm not mistaken). Reports are that Ableton 10 performs almost as well as it did on Intel using Rosetta, there could be issues with plugins. NI plugins doesn't install at all since Native Access gives an error. Have not heard anything on Bitwig or Cubase yet.

Where are you seeing this?

[jonljacobi]

Geez, I love all these stories about buying M1 that are dated before even the announcement. What won't people do to get clicks and views? Sheesh.

[pdxindy]

The scenario I'm looking to see tested is where lots of samples need to be loaded into memory, such as Kontakt being used for orchestral playback. That's the one example I can think of where the relative small amount of memory might be a real hindrance.

Yeah... that is the main question as far as capability. My impression is that the AS Macs make more efficient use of RAM and the SSD's are really fast, but 16GB is still 16GB

Maybe someone will load some big sample libraries in Logic's sampler and do some tests. Who knows when there might be an AS native version of Kontakt to test.

[apoclypse]

So we are starting to see some performance and test vids for music production software. So far LPX performs almost as well as a 10-core iMac in certain scenarios. Performs like crap in FLStudio using Rosetta (Not a surprise, FLStudio is written in Delphi most likely the framework needs to be updated to get better performance but it's very tied to x86 if I'm not mistaken). Reports are that Ableton 10 performs almost as well as it did on Intel using Rosetta, there could be issues with plugins. NI plugins doesn't install at all since Native Access gives an error. Have not heard anything on Bitwig or Cubase yet.

Where are you seeing this?

[apoclypse]

The scenario I'm looking to see tested is where lots of samples need to be loaded into memory, such as Kontakt being used for orchestral playback. That's the one example I can think of where the relative small amount of memory might be a real hindrance.

Yeah... that is the main question as far as capability. My impression is that the AS Macs make more efficient use of RAM and the SSD's are really fast, but 16GB is still 16GB

Maybe someone will load some big sample libraries in Logic's sampler and do some tests. Who knows when there might be an AS native version of Kontakt to test.

Kontakt can stream samples from disk, though I think there is a specific format for that. With fast storage I'd imagine it wouldn't be much of an issue. The large cache should help considerably here but let's see what that looks like in practice.

[tooneba]

So we are starting to see some performance and test vids for music production software. So far LPX performs almost as well as a 10-core iMac in certain scenarios. Performs like crap in FLStudio using Rosetta (Not a surprise, FLStudio is written in Delphi most likely the framework needs to be updated to get better performance but it's very tied to x86 if I'm not mistaken). Reports are that Ableton 10 performs almost as well as it did on Intel using Rosetta, there could be issues with plugins. NI plugins doesn't install at all since Native Access gives an error. Have not heard anything on Bitwig or Cubase yet.

Apple's in-house application was already working significantly better than 3rd party before M1.

[apoclypse]

So we are starting to see some performance and test vids for music production software. So far LPX performs almost as well as a 10-core iMac in certain scenarios. Performs like crap in FLStudio using Rosetta (Not a surprise, FLStudio is written in Delphi most likely the framework needs to be updated to get better performance but it's very tied to x86 if I'm not mistaken). Reports are that Ableton 10 performs almost as well as it did on Intel using Rosetta, there could be issues with plugins. NI plugins doesn't install at all since Native Access gives an error. Have not heard anything on Bitwig or Cubase yet.

Apple's in-house application was already working significantly better than 3rd party before M1.

That great but has zero to do with my point. The M1 is performing almost as well as a Core i9 iMac. If you watch the videos I posted the comparisons are between a Mac mini and an iMac.

I wasn’t making a statement about how much better LPX performs than Ableton or FLStudio just pointed out that FLStudio may have some issues due to the development platform they chose. It’s the same reason FLStudio took so long to get a Mac version. They were waiting for Delphi to be updated/ported to MacOS. My intent was to let FLStudio users know that there are issues at the moment.

Even so another video from that channel I posted has FLStudio performance comparison on M1 vs Intel and it seriously underperforms.

[tooneba]

So we are starting to see some performance and test vids for music production software. So far LPX performs almost as well as a 10-core iMac in certain scenarios. Performs like crap in FLStudio using Rosetta (Not a surprise, FLStudio is written in Delphi most likely the framework needs to be updated to get better performance but it's very tied to x86 if I'm not mistaken). Reports are that Ableton 10 performs almost as well as it did on Intel using Rosetta, there could be issues with plugins. NI plugins doesn't install at all since Native Access gives an error. Have not heard anything on Bitwig or Cubase yet.

Apple's in-house application was already working significantly better than 3rd party before M1.

That great but has zero to do with my point. The M1 is performing almost as well as a Core i9 iMac. If you watch the videos I posted the comparisons are between a Mac mini and an iMac.

I wasn’t making a statement about how much better LPX performs than Ableton or FLStudio just pointed out that FLStudio may have some issues due to the development platform they chose. It’s the same reason FLStudio took so long to get a Mac version. They were waiting for Delphi to be updated/ported to MacOS. My intent was to let FLStudio users know that there are issues at the moment.

Even so another video from that channel I posted has FLStudio performance comparison on M1 vs Intel and it seriously underperforms.

What I'm waiting is more 3rd party software XYZ vs. XYZ on different machines. Third party software is more accurate and fair than their full-control environment comparison for the reason they have been able to throttle their smartphone as they like. But I understand it's LPX vs. LPX on different machines.

[Tronam]

Reason will probably be the first M1 optimized 3rd party DAW to be released next. I can’t imagine how long it will take for Ableton and Steinberg to fully migrate.

[pdxindy]

What I'm waiting is more 3rd party software XYZ vs. XYZ on different machines. Third party software is more accurate and fair than their full-control environment comparison for the reason they have been able to throttle their smartphone as they like. But I understand it's LPX vs. LPX on different machines.

There is a native build of Reaper now in beta. Haven't seen any side by side tests yet.

There is also non audio software like the Affinity apps (Photo, Designer and Publisher) that is AS native now. I have not seen any side by side tests. Affinity says the new M1 is much faster for their software. That is more GPU.

[pdxindy]

Reason will probably be the first M1 optimized 3rd party DAW to be released next. I can’t imagine how long it will take for Ableton and Steinberg to fully migrate.

Bitwig is working on it but no time estimate was given.

[tooneba]

What I'm waiting is more 3rd party software XYZ vs. XYZ on different machines. Third party software is more accurate and fair than their full-control environment comparison for the reason they have been able to throttle their smartphone as they like. But I understand it's LPX vs. LPX on different machines.

There is a native build of Reaper now in beta. Haven't seen any side by side tests yet.

There is also non audio software like the Affinity apps (Photo, Designer and Publisher) that is AS native now. I have not seen any side by side tests. Affinity says the new M1 is much faster for their software. That is more GPU.

Cool. Thanks for the info.

[Ploki]

Apple's in-house application was already working significantly better than 3rd party before M1.

Logic didn't really.
And in any case, "NewLogicBenchmark" results are impressive.
Mini i7: 82 tracks
13" i7:~40 tracks
M1 native: 99 tracks
M1 rosetta: 70 tracks