Do the monitors even matter in an untreated room? Debating JBL 305P MkII vs PreSonus Eris 4.5 or 3.5

[Unaspected]

Yes, studio monitors will make a difference in an untreated room but only up to a point. There's little reason to be parting with crazy money (>+£1K) if you're not putting a professional studio together but as far as debating whether to get some JBL speakers over the other choices - just get them.

You'll thank yourself later.

[licasto2]

Low playback volume equals inaudible reflections.

But also skewed frequency balance in what you hear because of the Fletcher-Munson's curve.

Correct, that's why I mentioned the low end bit in my post.

[licasto2]

if you listen at a really low, like whisper quite low, volume and really know your speakers you can get good results. I've done it before and my ears don't have magical powers. Low playback volume equals inaudible reflections. It takes longer to get the low end sorted out but you can use decent headphones for that.

That likely won't work because with nearfield monitoring you rely on the output from the speakers dominating your perception. Any problematic reflections will be in proportion to the output volume, so while you may be minimising reflections, you're also not doing enough to drown them out.

I've done it before and it HAS worked. BUT... I have been using the same near fields for almost 20 years (Dynaudio BM6A Mk 1's) and they are well broken in and I know them like the back of my hand.

[BONES]

Which means none of it matters any ore, which is what I've been saying all along.

[ON BEATS]

They weren't individual stems. From memory, I think we gave him 6 rendered parts to play with - kick, bass, drums, lead, vox and everything else. Or something like that. What we got back didn't sound as good as the rough masters I'd done a few months earlier, although I'm sure it was technically perfect and looked great on a spectrum analyser. And this was 2003, when he should have had a massive technical advantage over me.

you are deep... and I also believe your mix was better. the problem with mastering is that the person doing it isn't you.

this problem has been on youtube and a producer said the same thing!

i don't master anything. i mix it my way then give to the rapper/company etc. i've never had bad feedback.

i am now looking at the Eris 3.5 but they are rear ported. i think i want front ported for nearfield.

last friday in a studio in Germany i used the active KRK speakers in there and they were really good! i'm waiting to find the model specs but am just as happy using my cheap ass earphones for now.

[_leras]

The room is about 13' x 21', and is completely untreated - it just has regular room stuff like bookcases a couch and chairs. I'm not going to be doing any professional work, and I have a decent pair of headphones - Philips Fidelio X2. I'd be using the monitors primarily for monitoring - playing along with a drum track or existing tracks.

That's not a bad size room at all if you can set up on the long dimension. A couch will absorb a bunch of stuff and a book shelf will help diffract. Should be absolutely fine for just monitoring to play along with things.

Get the best speakers you can afford. I'd suggest saving and trying to double your budget if you can.

[BONES]

i am now looking at the Eris 3.5 but they are rear ported. i think i want front ported for nearfield.

Rear ported is perfect for nearfields, unless you are placing them against a wall. I'm pretty sure every pair of monitors I've ever had have been rear ported, from my ancient Edirols, my big Wharfedales, my Erises, JBLs and now my Genelecs.

[ON BEATS]

ah man I just read this!

i've literally just left musicstore.de website, i bought the iLoud micro with the hope that they won't buzz or make clicking noises

[Ploki]

i am now looking at the Eris 3.5 but they are rear ported. i think i want front ported for nearfield.

Rear ported is perfect for nearfields, unless you are placing them against a wall. I'm pretty sure every pair of monitors I've ever had have been rear ported, from my ancient Edirols, my big Wharfedales, my Erises, JBLs and now my Genelecs.

except if you don't have more than a meter of space from the wall, slamming them against a wall is always an acoustically better option.

Also there's plenty of front-ported nearfields:
Adams, Focals, Neumanns, ATC's and so on.

There's cons and pros to both design approaches.

[BONES]

You don't need anything like a metre, 20-30cm is plenty. And of coruse there ar eplenty of front-ported speakers, no-one suggested there weren't.

[Ploki]

20-30cm causes SBIR, which directly translates to dips in low end frequency response

[El°HYM]

C'mon BONES you're surely my favorite angry aussie on #kvr but putting rear ported speakers near to the wall, especially in a small Room wont do you any Good and surely cause much more Trouble than Benefits. Isnt there also a front ported, smallish Eris - Version anyway?

[ideny]

I got adam 2 * t7v and the t10s sub last month . 70 cm distance to the monitors.

The sound ist overwhelming, compared to my old big hifi speaker.

The room is untreated , small , with couch and shelfs.

The JBL or what else what was discussed would give me great sound as well.

With the t10s, the t5v are actually enough.

This setup provides me good bass with low volume. In the room the sound ist great. In the next room , you barely hear music.

So yes any of the listed soeaker will help in an unthreatened room unless it is totally empty.

[BONES]

20-30cm causes SBIR, which directly translates to dips in low end frequency response

No, it doesn't. SBIR is a made up term to make some dickhead seem like he knows something you don't. It's bullshit. It's something that might be an issue for normal hi-fi speaker placement but a) it is just as much an issue for front and rear ported speakers and b) it is EXACTLY the kind of thing that nearfield monitoring takes out of consideration. As long as the port is clear and can suck the air in and out, it's fine.

C'mon BONES you're surely my favorite angry aussie on #kvr but putting rear ported speakers near to the wall, especially in a small Room wont do you any Good and surely cause much more Trouble than Benefits

20cm is not 'near" to a wall. It's far enough away to allow the ports to do their thing, which is all that matters. If you don't believe me, try it for yourself and you'll see, but don't believe something just because you read it online.

Why do you guys make everything so f**king difficult for yourselves? The concept of nearfield monitoring is just about the easiest thing to get your head around in th eentire production process, but it seem sto illude so many of you. It's common sense and as soon as someonen starts explaining it to you, you shoudl get it straight away.

Let me go over it one more time -the point of nearfield monitoring is that it doesn't matter if the room is big or small, if the speakers are near a wall or anything else because all you hear is what comes out of the front of the cabinet. Because you place the speakers really close to your ears - I can lean back in my chair and still place my fingers on top of my Genelecs - everything else is drowned out and becomes irrelevant. Surely this is completely obvious to anyone? Stop overthinking it, it really is as straightforward as it seems.

[El°HYM]

20-30cm causes SBIR, which directly translates to dips in low end frequency response

No, it doesn't. SBIR is a made up term to make some dickhead seem like he knows something you don't. It's bullshit. It's something that might be an issue for normal hi-fi speaker placement but a) it is just as much an issue for front and rear ported speakers and b) it is EXACTLY the kind of thing that nearfield monitoring takes out of consideration. As long as the port is clear and can suck the air in and out, it's fine.

C'mon BONES you're surely my favorite angry aussie on #kvr but putting rear ported speakers near to the wall, especially in a small Room wont do you any Good and surely cause much more Trouble than Benefits

20cm is not 'near" to a wall. It's far enough away to allow the ports to do their thing, which is all that matters. If you don't believe me, try it for yourself and you'll see, but don't believe something just because you read it online.

Why do you guys make everything so f**king difficult for yourselves? The concept of nearfield monitoring is just about the easiest thing to get your head around in th eentire production process, but it seem sto illude so many of you. It's common sense and as soon as someonen starts explaining it to you, you shoudl get it straight away.

Let me go over it one more time -the point of nearfield monitoring is that it doesn't matter if the room is big or small, if the speakers are near a wall or anything else because all you hear is what comes out of the front of the cabinet. Because you place the speakers really close to your ears - I can lean back in my chair and still place my fingers on top of my Genelecs - everything else is drowned out and becomes irrelevant. Surely this is completely obvious to anyone? Stop overthinking it, it really is as straightforward as it seems.

You are making Assumptions Sir 'angry' BONES, I had a pair of BX5's back in the days sitting right on my Desk. Still my Opinion and also Experience is that the smaller the Room, the smaller the Speaker should be. Also, if there is really just 20 cm's from rear to the Wall, you will certainly be better off with some front ported Speakers.

I totally agree that reducing the Stereo - triangle with maybe like 80 cm's in Between, so pretty much the Position where you can sit back and still be able to touch your Monitors, is often your best Bet in an untreated and smallish Room, as you will get more of the direct Signal than of everything else, just keep in Mind that the Stereo - field will also be reduced.