Rick Rubin on AI (& now Graeme Revell, too)

[eassae]

You are just drawing an arbitrary line. You're clearly frightened and/or intimidated by the thought that maybe a machine is better than you are. You seem oblivious to the fact that there are machines all around you that are better at one thing or another than you, that it was inevitable that they would one day be better than you in every way. Welcome to the future, embrace it or fade into irrelevance. Master the technology or let it consume you. The choice is yours.

Well, I guess the day wasn't over. You win.

[CinningBao]

typical BONES abrasive, insulting spewings

Man you are impossible. I'm so glad I don't know in the real world; you're a flippin nightmare! You make quick, brash assumptions about people, which are mostly incorrect, and believe your opinion is the only one that matters.

I'm not going to reply to your madness, except to say this; drink a chammomile tea or something, calm down and stop telling other people how to think like you're that smartest person alive.

All you can do is throw insults around. What a winner guys. We have a winner for life here! It kind of speaks volumes about you as a person if you're only recourse is to try to belittle and insult the others around you.

I'm sure you're happy in the moment but will you look back on your life and realise actually, you were a bit of dick? Probably not.

You're such a smart man. Really, very very smart.

[BONES]

You have no f**king idea whether my assumptions about people are correct or not. That's just one big, fat assumption of your own, you hypocrite. And I don't even think about people, I respond to what's written. It's pretty simple, really, if you don't want people to think you're stupid, don't write stupid things.

Seriously, how much time have you actually spent using any music AI? We've been neck-deep in it for more than two months now, getting great results, and you want to pretend that you know more than I do about it? Why, because you've read a few posts on social media? How f**king full of yourself would you have to be to think like that? You are EXACTLY the kind of person Graeme Revell is talking about. Oh, and by the way, do you even know who Graeme Revell is? You might try having a glance at his Wikipedia page before you summarily dismiss what's he's saying, just because you don't agree with it.

[CinningBao]

You have no f**king idea whether my assumptions about people are correct or not. That's just one big, fat assumption of your own, you hypocrite. And I don't even think about people, I respond to what's written. It's pretty simple, really, if you don't want people to think you're stupid, don't write stupid things.

Sorry I forgot how uber-smart you are! "And I don't even think about people" - that about sums it up.

Seriously, how much time have you actually spent using any music AI? We've been neck-deep in it for more than two months now, getting great results, and you want to pretend that you know more than I do about it? Why, because you've read a few posts on social media? How f**king full of yourself would you have to be to think like that? You are EXACTLY the kind of person Graeme Revell is talking about. Oh, and by the way, do you even know who Graeme Revell is? You might try having a glance at his Wikipedia page before you summarily dismiss what's he's saying, just because you don't agree with it.

This paragraph captures exactly why I have no interest in your spewings. You're telling me who I'm supposed to revere? Your judgement of "great results" is the variable here. You assume my exposure to AI music is somehow minimal compared to you just because I don't release albums of my AI generated bilge? You know bilge? I expect you do.

Anyway, if you want to practise prompting you do that. I hope it somehow captures the essence of your pain-of-existence.

[luciansyn]

A real musician studies for years at Julliard to master a real instrument like the tuba. Not this newfangled noise the kids are calling "rock and roll". It makes me sick. What is society coming to? The future is going to be unbearable if this rock music were to become popular. Lucky for us it is just a passing fad. A bubble about to burst.

[Bombadil]

One thing about this shite:
I cannot imagine, in any way, shape or form, wanting to admit when asked: „did you do that all yourself?“ „I prompted AI a few times!“

To my mind, that‘s fraudulent. Or worse, taking credit for what AI spews out. Poseurs, all.

[VOODOO U]

A real musician studies for years at Julliard to master a real instrument like the tuba. Not this newfangled noise the kids are calling "rock and roll". It makes me sick. What is society coming to? The future is going to be unbearable if this rock music were to become popular. Lucky for us it is just a passing fad. A bubble about to burst.

Now now, settle down. If anyone here is going to make smart-ass comments that individual will be me.

[VOODOO U]

how much time have you actually spent using any music AI? We've been neck-deep in it for more than two months now, getting great results

I hate to bring up a sensitive topic but how do you guys manage to go around the terms for using Tunee's output under the free plan? Even re-recording what Tunee puts out is still utilizing the composition itself. Under copyright protection this would be form PA, which protects the composition itself as opposed to the sound recording (SR form).

[VOODOO U]

Holy shit i just signed up at Tunee and gave a shot on a song for the kicks. This thing really does come up with good ideas! It took a few tweaks for the output I wanted but that's expected.
It's great for taking snips and pieces and building your own song from it.
Kind of like here's the demo now re-record it to your satisfaction.
Hopefully it doesn't end up being redundant because it's given me a good start!

[BONES]

Here you go, this is what I was talking about. Give it a go and see how you can use it to your advantage. Thank f**k there's at least one person here with an open mind.

Sorry I forgot how uber-smart you are! "And I don't even think about people" - that about sums it up.

None of us here know anyone else, we can only respond to what has been written. If you want to take it all personally, that's on you, nothing is written with that intent. Similarly, I'm not going to couch things in terms that consider people's fragile egos. It's imply not helpful to anyone.

This paragraph captures exactly why I have no interest in your spewings. You're telling me who I'm supposed to revere?

No, I'm giving you an opportunity to learn and grow from someone who has been far more successful, far more innovative and creative than the likes of you and I could ever hope to aspire to. Of course, if he doesn't agree with you, than I'm sure all his achievements and experience count for nothing in your eyes. Who loses out there?

Ultimately, why do you come to a place like this? I come here to learn and to share what I've learned with others. I want my opinions to be challenged, I want to be exposed to different points of view, so I can learn and grow as an artist. You just seem to be looking for an echo chamber, validation that all your decisions are the correct ones. How does that help?

Your judgement of "great results" is the variable here.

And if it was mine alone, you might have a point but it's not because I don't sit in my bedroom all day by myself, I collaborate with someone else, and he's even more excited about this than I am. And do you understand why we are excited? It's because we're actually doing it, we have first-hand experience to draw upon.

Combined, we have more than 70 years experience with this stuff. We started when the technology we rely upon was in its infancy and we've grown and adapted as it has become exponentially more powerful and capable. AI might seem like a completely new thing to you but from our much longer perspective it's just the next logical step from where we were last year. Things like Spotify are, from my perspective, doing far more damage to artists like us (you and I) than AI. But the big difference is that there is actually a way we can all leverage AI to our advantage, something Spotify doesn't really offer. If you want to close yourself off to that opportunity, go ahead but understand that the thought processes around that decision are deeply flawed, based on a completely separate consequence of AI.

To use an analogy, you may hate the current government of your country but if they offered you a $1000 tax credit, you wouldn't turn it down, would you? Think of AI in a similar way - you may hate what it's doing to the music industry but if there is some way you can use it to your advantage, why wouldn't you do that? At least that way you might get some benefit from it before everything turns to custard.

You assume my exposure to AI music is somehow minimal compared to you just because I don't release albums of my AI generated bilge? You know bilge? I expect you do.

I asked you what your experience was and instead of providing an answer, you gave us an evasion. What conclusion would you come to in that situation? I'm just trying to be helpful, to encourage you to have a go, put it a bit of effort and see for yourself. When I started this thread I assumed, in my naivete, that is what everyone who was interested in the subject might go and do. Then they'd come back here and recount their experiences. In a sane world, that's how thing like this should work.

[BONES]

One thing about this shite:
I cannot imagine, in any way, shape or form, wanting to admit when asked: „did you do that all yourself?“ „I prompted AI a few times!“
To my mind, that‘s fraudulent. Or worse, taking credit for what AI spews out. Poseurs, all.

I don't see it as any more or less fraudulent than clicking notes into a piano roll with a mouse. And in your example, he/she wasn't taking credit for what the AI did, because they admitted where it came from. But, of course, in that situation, a few prompts is unlikely to yield decent results. I mean, you'd probably get good sounding songs from it but it takes a lot of time and effort to get something that is a true reflection of your intent, much the same as it is when writing a song in a DAW or an MPC or any other way you might want to do it. If a song starts as a simple musical idea, you spend hours, days, weeks, even months refining and building on that initial idea until you have something you are happy to share with the world. Working with AI is the same - you can have something to share with your bandmates in an hour or two but it takes hours, days, weeks, even months of hard work to get it into a shape where you're happy to share it with the world.

AI can definitely be a shortcut to mediocrity but if you put the effort in and can be a powerful tool in achieving your musical goals.

I hate to bring up a sensitive topic but how do you guys manage to go around the terms for using Tunee's output under the free plan? Even re-recording what Tunee puts out is still utilizing the composition itself. Under copyright protection this would be form PA, which protects the composition itself as opposed to the sound recording (SR form).

I have no idea what you're talking about, we just make the songs and use 'em. Tunee gets a co-writing credit and if that's not enough for 'em, good luck getting any money out of us for it. I'm a poor, retired pensioner barely scraping by, just having a bit of fun with a free online tool.

[Greenstorm33]

I see AI music as the ethical equivalent of making music with pirated loop libraries and calling it your own, except it takes even less effort. Acknowledging where you got the sounds from doesn't make it any better, nor does it somehow give you the ability to claim the results as your actual artistic output. It's also just really boring honestly.

[Leander Hawthorne]

As listeners, what should we do when faced with a massive amount of AI-generated music?Will our listening experience be ruined by a large amount of low-quality music?

[Leander Hawthorne]

AUTO-ADMIN: Non-MP3, WAV, OGG, SoundCloud, YouTube, Vimeo, Twitter and Facebook links in this post have been protected automatically. Once the member reaches 5 posts the links will function as normal.

As listeners, what should we do when faced with a massive amount of AI-generated music?Will our listening experience be ruined by a large amount of low-quality music?

Vibe Coding is now incredibly powerful, capable of creating a website directly, significantly lowering the barrier to entry for website creation. For example: https://iris.findtruman.io/ai/tool/trump?share=W (https://iris.findtruman.io/ai/tool/trump?share=W)
This game is entirely made using AI.

[BONES]

I see AI music as the ethical equivalent of making music with pirated loop libraries and calling it your own, except it takes even less effort. Acknowledging where you got the sounds from doesn't make it any better, nor does it somehow give you the ability to claim the results as your actual artistic output. It's also just really boring honestly.

I assume, then, that you don't approve of people doing cover versions? I mean, if they didn't write the song, what right do they have to perform it? And what is the 20, 30, 40 or more hours you spend crafting and refining your prompts with the AI worth, then? Nothing? I'd suggest it's a skill few people possess. Much like musicianship, once you master the art, it allows a person to craft exactly the idea they had in their head.

As listeners, what should we do when faced with a massive amount of AI-generated music?Will our listening experience be ruined by a large amount of low-quality music?

What makes you think AI generated music will be "low quality"? I think it's the opposite, it will be very high quality, at least on the same level as most professional producers are capable of creating. The suggestion is that it won't connect with people in the way a song written by a human can but my experience has been quite the opposite - the music my bandmate has been crafting with AI is the best music I've ever heard in my life. Not all of it, not even most of it, but if you're discerning, patient and persistent, there is a lot of good music to be had out of AI.