new sequencer (Sequitur)

[hackbod]

sorry, I used the wrong word - the eraser (rubber is the word I attempted to write but somehow didn't) is what I meant...

Oh hey, look at that! That tool really shows the "painting MIDI events" inspiration, doesn't it? I never even noticed this because for some reason I've gotten into the habit of deleting with the delete key. Having it delete the entire selection does seem like a good idea, though.

[jens]

Jens, are you asking to have it immediately send a note off when you release the mouse button instead of letting the note play for its entire duration?

yes, as it is now the note auditioning always plays the note with it's actual length - you click it once just for minor changes (say e.g a bit of manual quantization) and have to endure a whole orchestration of auditioned notes - that's not funny if you are (say) trying to quickly edit a few two bar long organ notes...

[dpitchmen]

yes, as it is now the note auditioning always plays the note with it's actual length - you click it once just for minor changes (say e.g a bit of manual quantization) and have to endure a whole orchestration of auditioned notes - that's not funny if you are (say) trying to quickly edit a few two bar long organ notes...

...or you can add the Quantize tool after your midi device and have sequitur do it for you (you tell the tool to snap to the nearest 1/4, 1/8..etc..)

As someone who uses long fx samples quite a bit, I've never found the audition annoying. Often while trying to align something up, I'll have the pencil tool mapped to the first mouse button, but will quickly go to the middle mouse button (where the edit tool is mapped by default) and tame the velocity of the note. I don't feel interrupted laying down midi events when I don't have to move my mouse from the note to change the pitch, velocity, duration or position, and I like hearing the audition every time I modify the note because then I don't feel like I'm doing blind (or deaf, rather) editing.

Here's a slick workflow hint: If you have a couple of tracks all containing notes, while editing you'll see the other notes in the background...ghost notes. Map the 'Select Track' tool to one of your mouse buttons. (it's the tool at the end of the first group...there's an arrow pointing to a 't'). Now, click on one of those ghost notes with the Select Track tool and, swwoosh, that track is now in focus, ready to be edited.

On a related note, I'm glad to hear people have starting thinking about workflow. Mapping tools to different mouse buttons is extremely handy, but it's totally understandable getting used to a new way of working. Careful though, you might start middle-clicking and mousing up and down on notes in Cubase wondering for a second or two why the hell the velocity isn't changing

-daniel

[dpitchmen]

Talking about work-flow in my last post got me thinking about something I don't think I've seen mentioned yet. I recommend to everyone having a look at setting up macros for your midi controller in the Preferences. All you have to do is select a line in the MIDI tab, and move whatever knob you want on your controller. You can use knobs to control the velocity of the note, the pattern of the echo system tool (Macros A, B and C), the slope of the Bloom tool which you use to create CC ramps (volume swells, pitch bends, etc.. also Macro A)

-daniel

[jens]

yes, as it is now the note auditioning always plays the note with it's actual length - you click it once just for minor changes (say e.g a bit of manual quantization) and have to endure a whole orchestration of auditioned notes - that's not funny if you are (say) trying to quickly edit a few two bar long organ notes...

...or you can add the Quantize tool after your midi device and have sequitur do it for you (you tell the tool to snap to the nearest 1/4, 1/8..etc..)

I think you misunderstood me - I meant manual quantizattion as in manual - using the quantize tool would be automatic quantization - if I'm doing manual quantization it's because I don't want it to be automatic - are you suggesting I should change my workflow and my music just because the note-auditioning annoys and disturbs me?

As someone who uses long fx samples quite a bit, I've never found the audition annoying.

that's good for you but doesn't help me one tiny bit.

[muzycian]

Do you have any plans to make Sequitur a VST plugin as well as a host, kind of like Sonicbytes' ERA and Phrazor? In these days of modular environments, a sequencer plugin is very useful. I know I'm still interested in trying alternative sequencer plugins to use in Plogue Bidule.

That's an interesting statement.

But i wonder: how do you sequence your modular environment?

I mean: When it comes to making sounds, a modular system is great.

But if you want to make a song/track, then the root object must always be a sequencer, right?

[Caleb]

That's an interesting statement.

But i wonder: how do you sequence your modular environment?

I mean: When it comes to making sounds, a modular system is great.

But if you want to make a song/track, then the root object must always be a sequencer, right?

Usually yes. You use the host sequencer as a master to the modular/sequencer plug-in.

For something like Sequitur (which I haven't been able to operate yet because of various issues which I'm slowly resolving), you might find that the additional compositional tools offered beat the midi composing quality of REAPER for example.

So you'd use REAPER mainly for your audio work (where it excels) and complete you midi composition inside Sequitur (if it's a plug-in of course).

Sequitur would slave to REAPER.

EnergyXT already offers a similar kind of proposition to what I believe is being proposed here, although EnergyXT is quite a bit more than just a sequencer plug-in.

I like sequencers as plug-ins because it sometimes removes the either/or proposition of composing. Integration is cool.

Regards
Caleb

[dpitchmen]

are you suggesting I should change my workflow and my music just because the note-auditioning annoys and disturbs me?

definitely not. I'm coming from the position of trying to help people understand ways to work in sequitur by offering workflow examples and explanation of the tools.

I spoke to eric this evening and we were talking about the audition during edits -- Sequitur should stop playback when you release the mouse button...looks like that's broken in the current beta.

[jens]

are you suggesting I should change my workflow and my music just because the note-auditioning annoys and disturbs me?

definitely not. I'm coming from the position of trying to help people understand ways to work in sequitur by offering workflow examples and explanation of the tools.

I spoke to eric this evening and we were talking about the audition during edits -- Sequitur should stop playback when you release the mouse button...looks like that's broken in the current beta.

very cool - thanks!

[blurk]

But i wonder: how do you sequence your modular environment?
[...]
But if you want to make a song/track, then the root object must always be a sequencer, right?

Well, I guess I haven't actually completed a lot of work this way, but what I am after is to have sequences triggered by other events and the possibility of these sequences being further processed in the modular environment. You could think of it as sort of a combination of algorithmic and sequenced. So, the root object is necessarily the sequencer; the sequencer just provides some of the components of the overall sound.

But maybe I like thinking of the sequencer being embedded in the modular environment because one of the things I like about the modular environment is that I can see little graphical wires connecting components.

[muzycian]

Sure, i do understand and appreciate the benefits of a modular environment. It's a wonderful world

Thanks for your enlightenings, Caleb and Blurk.

Will give Sequitur a try!

[exh]

the eraser doesn't erase multiple-selections

That's by design. At one point it erased whatever the current selection was, but in practice I found it disconcerting and unexpected. The current thinking is, there are multiple ways to delete the selections, either via the delete key or cutting, but if you just want to erase a single event this is the fastest way to do it (also, once upon a time, the erase could be set to 'blot out' events, i.e. hitting a note with the erase would just decrease the velocity, hitting it repeatedly would decrease it until it disappeared. this was cute but I'm not sure it was ever terribly useful).

Anyway, if you find the current behaviour of erasing a single event disconcerting and unexpected, let me know. I don't want to lose the current behaviour but it can be an option.

[exh]

For something like Sequitur (which I haven't been able to operate yet because of various issues which I'm slowly resolving)

If those issues involve VST scanning, you might want to try the latest beta1.0.3. The scanning process has been cleaned a little and some cases that were causing crashing have been fixed. The easiest thing to do if you've had a previous version is to run the included Uninstaller, which just wipes out the folders sequitur created so you start with a clean slate.

Oh, and if they don't involve VSTs I'd be curious to know what's causing you problems.

Also, it's worth noting that a doc describing the echosystem tool has been posted.

thanks,
eric

[Caleb]

Had an initial problem with Windows which I corrected. Then it was a scanning issue which I resolved by limiting my scan.

However, my file structure is set up in a way that might be a bit of a headache for this kind of scanning. I've been spoilt by using problems that let you manage plug-ins differently.

I haven't given it a real go yet though - been busy.

Regards
Caleb

[sinkmusic]

2 very little ideas, as the crashing pugin scan during the first installation has been a show-stopper for me (still interested, but waiting for another more stable release) :

- Having a program that crashes even before you put your hands on it can be very frustrating, so why not install without asking the VST path, adn then make a "preferences" fodler for the user to select his VST folder.
You might say that it doesn't change anything, but it is "psychological" : at least, you begin with a "not crashing" program, and can try to "take a tour" (without vst for the very short beginning, but at least without carshing before starting)... (just my 2 cents).

- make a thread in the Wiki "known to work / known to crash VST plugin", it ocud be useful both for the users, the seq dev team, and the concerned plugin's dev... That way, too, i coudl be able to make a "beta test" folder with just a doen of "known to work" plugins, and have fun with sequitur...