Record: New DAW from Propellerheads

[christianmusicmaker]

Am I supposed to fork out $499 because the screenshots look pretty?

I am sure Apple would not complain

[Stupid American Pig]

While ReWire works for me I don't really see the point either.

Agreed, but I can at least link reason to audio without rendering the track before its finished. It is silly though, and probably political that rewire is sticking around...

[X-Soul]

Does Reason have anything to compete with Stylus RMX, Omnisphere, Zebra, etc.?

Most of the sounds can be recreated with Thor at least relatively close. Not a big deal for me, I dont use romplers which sounds is overused mostly anyway.

Reason does have many synth TYPES, but each synth type is quite limited compared to other things out there.

They arent limited. You forgetting about endless routing possibilities again. How about Thor/Malstrom oscs going to Scream (pick some more effects for your taste), then another thor with filters. Or how about raw oscs samples from Virus TI in NN-XT, waveshaped with misc reason fxes and then going to Thor? If Reason oscs miss some sound palette (but only small amount), samples delivers it. Turn on your imagination really. I forgot what it is when I've used Cubase.

There is no very high quality reverb that competes with Altiverb and Breverb and others, for instance.

You really will hear the difference in the final mix? Nope, you don't.

The plugins in Reason, even the good ones, lack flexibility and options.

Reason is a modular. Lack flexibility, huh? Think out of your vst box.

You won't find any complex visualization

Ears helps a lot.

no noise reduction

Pfff. Never used it. There are better tools for vinyl, tapes restorations. You can use gates and filters in reason tho.

no audio tuning of any kind

Finetune in sampler. Yeah, you right tho, you dont have all those sound analysers like in melodyne, which do everything for you.

Reason and/or Record lack any type of tuning,

see upper

spectral management

see upper

and editing

Umm, sorry? You cant shape finished sounds effectively with filters, compressors, eq's, and stereo imager so they'll fit perfectly in the mix?

has no groove quantize

You really have seen last Reason version, huh?

no way of pocketing tracks(which is done on almost every commercial release these days)

Pocketing tracks?

no visualization or advanced metering

Pfff.

no way to tame clipping

Now i'm absolutely sure that you havent seen Reason 4. Even 3.

do anything else that requires sample level editing, etc. It goes on and on. No advanced crossfading, no nothing. VERY limited. These are things that DO affect sound and the quality of the recordings.

Now thats funny.

And again, if you are making some electronic, pattern based music, or whatever, Reason may be sufficient.

I'm making EDM, ambient and orchestral music.

But as I said above, let's not pretend it can do things it can't.

I dont saying that it does have all features that Cubase have. But I do pretend that you can make the track in electronic styles with any level of complexity there with huge amount of available sound palette in the synthesis world and have top-notch pro sound in the end.

And the quality of sample libraries for Reason are nowhere near the quality of things like VSL, Chris Hein/Scarbee, EWQLSO, WIVI, and others.

I'm not talking about Reason libraries. And yes they're sucks, at least for my production needs. Thats why I almost never use them.

I'm talkikng about effects like dBlue Glitch, Supertrigga, LiveCut, etc, which (among other things) rearrange in real time the content of audio files as they play (for example). No, you obviously can't do that with Reason's synths.

Oh, never heard about them. So, dont care. I'm about music after all, not for useless glitch fx crap. Electronic music just become more soulless and repetitive nowadays with tons of this shit around. You can make most of this shit with RV7000 reverse algo plus misc fxes added.

That's possible, yes, but a fair amount of work. Especially compared to simply dragging a well-made auto-filter onto a track.

What Combinator presets for? Do it once, save and be happy. And I've never used auto-filter in Cub anyway. Because its just useless.

After much work he created a replacement that didn't cause these problems - a very big job.

Well, dunno how much he have spent, but I can do it in a few mins with some compressors and sound imagers (they have good frequency cuts) without any phasing problems.
And we have it now in Reason Factory Bank. Just load it and its done. I dont need multiband comp anyway in Reason nor in Cubase. I never make mastering there. I have a mighty Sound Forge + Waves VST's for that.

+ Surgical type linear phase parametric EQ (much more precise than MClass one, for removing unwanted frequencies/noise)

You know how much eats Waves one? Its not for realtime processing. And filters do most of the job just fine.

+ De esser

There's De-Esser in Reason 4.

+ Convolution Reverb
+ Bespoke multimode filter

You know, never used it and don't planning to.

+ Multitap Delay with pan/modulation controls per stage

Easy. Open RV7000 and choose multitap alg. Automate misc controls in sequencer if really needed.

True. But in many cases the use of this routing potential is just to spend time building combinator units which are basically workarounds for the lack of standard basic features other programmes have.

Nope. Mostly for creative stuff. Other fx'es (multiband, de-esser..) is exist in comb patches already in Reason Factory Bank.

It would also mean that you could still use those great MClass Mastering units post-mixer.

Insert them in master bus. I havent tried Record yet, but seen alot of vids. Downloading open beta currently.

Any sound can be maded with Reason/Record + some good sample libs, just it fully depends on your experience and knowledge of tools you use.

[robogone]

That's far too much to read.

[X-Soul]

[sockofgold]

Geez, dude...

Just accept that Reason/Record is limited. He's not even saying it's a bad thing. But, by the very definition of the word, Reason is a very limited program.

Yes, you can route things every which way, but routing is not going to give you, for instance, a disk-streaming sampler. (I know, that's just one example, but your "infinite routing" argument can only go on for so long.)

[headquest]

Having a closed environment can be a very good thing. Having a closed mind can't.

I think that what most people want is fast, easy solutions that really work well and sound great. The mixer in Record does offer that, but the way the rest of the programme is tacked onto that really doesn't. Anyone with much experience in the audio recording world is going to find it frustrating. But as I said before, I'm glad you like it

[headquest]

I have a mighty Sound Forge + Waves VST's for that.

Again I say, good for you (and interesting that you realise the need, considering all your other comments). I have Audition.

But Record is alegedly aimed at those who DON'T have such luxuries (and - by implication - would be too stupid to use them anyway, because they are "musicians" and not "engineers" - how patronising is that!!).

Record claims to be a complete solution for these potential users. It isn't.

[X-Soul]

I'm not close minded, but those who yelling that Reason is VERY LIMITED in sound capabilities (and i'm talking only about them). They're too lazy to connect a few devices or just unimaginative, preset users or have low skills? Well, each to their own.

[headquest]

I'm not close minded, but those who yelling that Reason is VERY LIMITED in sound capabilities (and i'm talking only about them). They're too lazy to connect a few devices or just unimaginative, preset users or have low skills? Well, each to their own.

I use Reason as a primary sound source and love it. That doesn't mean that I think Record is a good solution for musicians who want to buy their first and only music software and get into recording.

We're not discussing Reason 5... we're discussing Record, and considering whether it delivers the goods as a full-featured standalone audio recording solution. Seriously, I don't think it does. YMMV. Peace.

[koalaboy]

I'm not close minded, but those who yelling that Reason is VERY LIMITED in sound capabilities (and i'm talking only about them). They're too lazy to connect a few devices or just unimaginative, preset users or have low skills? Well, each to their own.

Nobody said it's VERY limited. However it is limited by design, because it's a closed system. You obviously think it's perfect as it is, and it doesn't need any improvement, but you'll find that most people like to be able to choose.

It may be the best thing ever for you - that doesn't mean it can't be improved.

Whilst you may think people are just being lazy, or can't tell the difference, I have a suspicion that many orchestral composers, for example, may prefer VSL and software with score notation. Or perhaps somebody interested in ambient soundscapes wants the acoustic qualities of a particular church they were in once, where they recorded some impulse responses. There may even be EDM producers who want very complicated sequenced polyrhythms, and perhaps think Numerology would be a better choice.

Tools For The Job - Use the right ones.

Reason is very good at what it does. That doesn't mean it's the solution for everything.

Record is not bad at what it does, but unfortuately isn't as good as other options. Cheaper ? Maybe, but in the same way you seem to think that most people won't "hear the difference in a final mix" between the Reason reverb and some more expensive VSTs, I doubt most people at this price point will hear the difference between the SSL emulation and basic mixer with EQ and compression.

It seems to be competing for the market share of the budget DAWs (Cakewalk Home Studio, Magix Music Maker, Garageband), and may succeed there if they bundle GB of loops, etc. Otherwise, it's just an upgrade for Reason users, who probably would have been happy for it to be Reason 5 (with audio).

[headquest]

It seems to be competing for the market share of the budget DAWs (Cakewalk Home Studio, Magix Music Maker, Garageband), and may succeed there if they bundle GB of loops, etc.

Unfortunately there would be no point, because it doesn't even fit imported loops to the project tempo .

[thorau]

I beta-tested Record too and think it's a good DAW to get into recording with excellent tools and sound quality. I don't know Reason that much, but it doesn't have an audio recording option, right? The only real disadvantage for me is the dongle protection if though it's very flexible here.

[koalaboy]

It seems to be competing for the market share of the budget DAWs (Cakewalk Home Studio, Magix Music Maker, Garageband), and may succeed there if they bundle GB of loops, etc.

Unfortunately there would be no point, because it doesn't even fit imported loops to the project tempo .

I thought it did if they had the tempo information already embedded ? I must admit that I had no joy with the audio warping right from the start (having been spoiled with Live), and even following the tutorials ended up with a mess.

[X-Soul]

Again I say, good for you (and interesting that you realise the need, considering all your other comments). I have Audition.

I never said that Reason is great for mastering. And I use SF/Waves for mastering few years already, so its perfect for me for what it does.

I use Reason as a primary sound source and love it. That doesn't mean that I think Record is a good solution for musicians who want to buy their first and only music software and get into recording.

We're not discussing Reason 5... we're discussing Record, and considering whether it delivers the goods as a full-featured standalone audio recording solution. Seriously, I don't think it does. YMMV. Peace.

Well Record as standalone is pretty weak indeed. I'm only interested in SSL mixer there. Audiotracks limited editing isn't a problem for me, because I rarely use them or record something.