KVR Audio

Johnny Cherry · Post by **Johnny Cherry** » Fri Sep 30, 2005 2:48 pm

Has anyone got Live to run any waves plugins? I tried the demo and it didn't seem to support them so Live is a no no for me.

Rabid · Post by **Rabid** » Fri Sep 30, 2005 2:50 pm

headquest wrote:
Cabinfever wrote: Most often you see Ableton used with one of the other main hosts, and that is *the* crucial indicator of the limited scope of Ableton.
I'm surprised you think that Cabinfever. On the Ableton forum there are loads of folks who have abandoned their previous host and just use Ableton Live 5, including seasoned professionals who have abandoned Pro Tools, DP, Logic and the others..

Are you a Live user yourself, or are you expressing an opinion as a non-user here? I'm just asking because I think the OP invited Ableton users to say what attracted them to Live, rather than FL/Cubase/etc users (who may only have a very limited experience of Live anyway) to come and say why they don't.

I remember when a lot of people supposedly abandoned their hosts for Reason, FL, and lots of other mini-studios. The truth is, you will not see many professional releases that are limited to any of these programs. There is nothing in the contract that says "If you use Ableton Live you are restricted from using any other host or DAW."

There is more to the world than repetitive loop-based electronic music. Hey, a lot of electronic music is not repetitive or loop based.

Beardedone · Post by **Beardedone** » Fri Sep 30, 2005 2:52 pm

Live and Sonar are complementary apps for me. Each stimulates completely differing ideas that work well when taken from one to the other. I don't find the same process applies going from FL ST Studio to Sonar. In fact FL Studio is still the only host where I can go from soup to nuts in arranging a sorftsynth based track as long as I don't have do any audio recording.

Live is excellent for recording and comping audio ideas - for me this means guitar loops or sections. I can easily vary tempo without badly mangling audio quality. This is worth price of admission alone IMO. And Live has so much other good stuff that I have barely even looked at.

Best,
Goron

headquest · Post by **headquest** » Fri Sep 30, 2005 2:54 pm

Johnny Cherry wrote:Has anyone got Live to run any waves plugins? I tried the demo and it didn't seem to support them so Live is a no no for me.

Yes, I've run the demo version of the Waves Platnum bundle version 5 inside Live 5 without any issues at all.

headquest · Post by **headquest** » Fri Sep 30, 2005 2:56 pm

Rabid wrote: There is more to the world than repetitive loop-based electronic music. Hey, a lot of electronic music is not repetitive or loop based.

Huh

It would be very uninformed to suggest that all music done in Live 5 is either repetitive or electronic (in the strictest sense). A lot of guitar bands, classical and jazz musicians use it

I really agreed with your previous post, but this time I'm not sure what your point is?

funkster1 · Post by **funkster1** » Fri Sep 30, 2005 3:02 pm

I agree to certain degree to cabinfever here:
for me, the limitations are in the MIDI realm. If I really need/want to edit MIDI parts, LIVE is not really gonna cut it. The very extended MIDI tools from e.g. Cubase SX are still priceless. However, I have sold my copy of SX to upgrade to LIVE 5 & Reason 3. LIVE 4 has been offered to me as a birthday present from a bunch of friends of mine, and at first I didn't really get it. You have to "unlearn" certain ways of doing stuff and be open for new ways. After working through the tutorials I thought "Wow, nice tricks to learn here". I don't rely on prefab loops neither, but I do loop my own playing. Jam around in arrange view (Keys & Guitar), cut up some loops of my own playing, put them into session slots, jam around some more, but this time with song structures, etc.
And for this LIVE works incredibly fast, much faster then creating a MDI track in SX, open the VSTi window, choose an instrument..............

you get the picture.
In short, once you get used to it, it's simply amazing. Fortunately I sold my SX to a friend wich lives really very close to my house. We see each other 4-5 times a week for music making, so I have the best of both worlds

Regards
Raphael

Johnny Cherry · Post by **Johnny Cherry** » Fri Sep 30, 2005 4:06 pm

headquest wrote:
Johnny Cherry wrote:Has anyone got Live to run any waves plugins? I tried the demo and it didn't seem to support them so Live is a no no for me.
Yes, I've run the demo version of the Waves Platnum bundle version 5 inside Live 5 without any issues at all.

Hmm ok I need to really look into this then.

Lunatique · Post by **Lunatique** » Fri Sep 30, 2005 4:34 pm

It really depends on the kind of music you compose. If you're a composer who does symphonic works where meticulous orchestral arrangements are the norm, and working linear is the standard method, a host like Live wouldn't make life any easier for you.

flex42 · Post by **flex42** » Fri Sep 30, 2005 4:50 pm

official snippet of info about the Waves problems:
http://www.ableton.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=25171

original flipper · Post by **original flipper** » Fri Sep 30, 2005 5:04 pm

HI

A few 'tools' that have impressed me over the last year or so include Live, XT and Tracktion.

I do agree with another poster that Live's midi implementation is still in need of improvement (unfortunately imo - this is the case for Tracktion as well) but hopefully as time goes by these aspects will improve.

I think that the single screen gui works well for Live - although it is really a 2 page flip between the arrangement and sequencer set's.

What I would like to see for both T2 and Live is a well thought out dual monitor mode that doesn't just stretch the gui - Live handles this better than T2 but the midi piano-roll looses resolution (you can only minimize to half the degree of piano-roll resolution on dual monitors as you can on a single monitor)over 2 screens and hinders midi editing.

Live took a LONG time for me to get comfortable with - I still could not use it exclusively, but it grows on you slowly (well, for me it did) - I found Tracktion 'hit' me once I understood it (did not take long) but I quickly faltered once I moved from audio to trying to edit (for instance) a bunch of 64 bar guitar solo's, it became unusable for such intricate and detailed editing - this is mirrored to some extent in Live as well - I mean by 'unusable' that getting around the piano roll and editing is tedious, the 'fixed' state of the piano-roll is restrictive and getting a full screen view is not possible or only partially acheived to name some of the issues.

But there is something about Live that just 'feels' good, right or comfortable - the way you can open up and close of parts of the interface can give you a nice clean gui - I am sure this will get better and possibly end up with more user definable screen set's that maybe even allow a seperate full pian-roll or the ability to mix and match screens - who knows?

Flipper.

headquest · Post by **headquest** » Fri Sep 30, 2005 5:11 pm

flex42 wrote:official snippet of info about the Waves problems:
http://www.ableton.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=25171

I think it's mostly the AU versions that people have had issues with. I've noticed that there are problems with Waves being reported with some other hosts too (Tracktion and FL spring to mind).

As I said earlier though, I didn't have any problems with crashes when demo'ing Waves Plat 5 (although I couldn't justify the cost of the Waves plugs, and opted for alternatives, but that's another story

). Usually the reverse is the case - if something CAN crash on my computer it usually does

.

headquest · Post by **headquest** » Fri Sep 30, 2005 5:15 pm

original flipper wrote: I mean by 'unusable' that getting around the piano roll and editing is tedious, the 'fixed' state of the piano-roll is restrictive and getting a full screen view is not possible or only partially acheived to name some of the issues.

I agree with nearly everything you said, but just wanted to point out that a full screen piano roll is easily available in Live 5. Simply drag the central divider upwards until it snaps to the transport... giving you full screen editing.

(Also of course you might want to shut the browser).

braj · Post by **braj** » Sun Oct 02, 2005 2:04 am

Beardedone wrote: Live is excellent for recording and comping audio ideas - for me this means guitar loops or sections. I can easily vary tempo without badly mangling audio quality.

This is exactly the way I use Live. Nothing I've tried was as good of a practice and compositional tool for a guitarist. I can easily get ideas down and get multipart arrangements busted out in no time at all. Every guitarist should definitely try Live. Nothing else has made me feel like I have immediate control over audio in the same way most sequencers have control over midi.

Amberience · Post by **Amberience** » Sun Oct 02, 2005 2:11 am

Live gives me the freedom I need. I want to record a track of guitar and then overdub it with a (very poorly played!) solo ?? Live will do that easily. Oh shit!! I made a mistake, I hit a bum note!! Punch in/out markers... phew!

I want to fire up a synth.. no problem.. I want to use that synth to give me a pedal melody that I can then improvise over the top with one Sampletank's EP piano's ?? Easy as pie.

I want to set up some compex routing, scream COCKASS into a microphone, and have Live give me a 5 minute decaying sound from that one-shot of my voice? EASY!

I want to fire up EnergyXT and make some good ol' 80's arpeggiated loops. Piece of piss!

In short: It adapts.

bluedad · Post by **bluedad** » Sun Oct 02, 2005 2:59 am

Live is so great to me for many of the same reasons stated already.
Recording audio is so freakin' easy!
I sold Orion Platinum, can't sell FL Studio or I would, haven't reinstalled SX2 and don't miss them at all.

What's so special about Ableton Live 5?