KVR Audio

Ben H · Post by **Ben H** » Sun Feb 18, 2007 12:06 am

You beat me to it Yoss

mw wrote:what about sampling a hardware VA? can you name the samples and patch the same as the original hardware VA presets?

You can sample a hardware VA, but you would still get into trouble for copyright from naming the manufacturer

mw · Post by mw » Sun Feb 18, 2007 12:40 am

so is it legal to name it something "similar" i.e. i have seen 9x9, 8x8, etc.

Ben H · Post by **Ben H** » Sun Feb 18, 2007 3:46 am

mw wrote:so is it legal to name it something "similar" i.e. i have seen 9x9, 8x8, etc.

Yes it is.

Realistically it wont stop their "ceast and desist" letters, but at the end of the day there is not a lot that they can do.

jens · Post by **jens** » Sun Feb 18, 2007 3:56 am

ben_horwood wrote:possibly jail.

Ben H · Post by **Ben H** » Sun Feb 18, 2007 4:16 am

jens wrote:
ben_horwood wrote:possibly jail.

Wow. Looks like someoene needs to learn how to use use their dictionary!

Possibly = potentially. I.e you CAN face jail.

It doesn't mean you will, and it doesn't mean that anyone has.

It is just another option to them, other than sticking you with a massive fine.

sinister1 · Post by **sinister1** » Sun Feb 18, 2007 5:11 am

Hi Ben Im new to the forum a couple of questions.i have no interest in sampling ,just making music.when I use a VST rompler drum machine(battery) synth whatever do these people have the permission to have 808 or 909 drumkits is it okay for them to sample them?vst emulations like Arturias is it legal for us to use them do they have the permission to sell them?when I buy a royalty-free sample c.d. and it has drum hits from vintage hardware drum machines is that okay to use?last when i buy a sample c.d. and it is royalty -free and it has basslines on it aren't those basslines suppose to be made from the persons own original presets and not ones from the synth.how do we know if this is true?please help.i wish there was a book or something to clear this up

jens · Post by **jens** » Sun Feb 18, 2007 2:19 pm

sinister1 wrote:Hi Ben Im new to the forum a couple of questions.

are you sure he's an expert?

I've got another question as well:

If Eric Persing told everyone it ain't a big deal to sample hardware which has got a sample-based sound generation, would that mean it also wasn't a big deal to sample his own products which are all sample-based as well?

In other words:

wouldn't the business-man in him have a lot of interest in generating as much fear as possible, regardless of what the real situation might be?

So is Eric Persing really the ideal expert to consult in regards to this?

Just a thought...

edit: typo

jens · Post by **jens** » Sun Feb 18, 2007 2:20 pm

ben_horwood wrote:
jens wrote:
ben_horwood wrote:possibly jail.

Wow. Looks like someoene needs to learn how to use use their dictionary!

Possibly = potentially. I.e you CAN face jail.

It doesn't mean you will, and it doesn't mean that anyone has.

It is just another option to them, other than sticking you with a massive fine.

SampleScience · Post by **SampleScience** » Sun Feb 18, 2007 2:47 pm

jens wrote:
sinister1 wrote:Hi Ben Im new to the forum a couple of questions.

are you sure he's an expert?

I've got another question as well:

If Eric Persing told everyone it ain't a big deal to sample hardware which has got a sample-based sound generation, would that mean it also wasn't a big deal to sample his own products which are all sample-based as well?

In other words:

wouldn't the business-man in him have a lot of interest in generating as much fear as possible, regardless of what the real situation might be?

So is Eric Persing really the ideal expert to consult in regards to this?

Just a thought...

edit: typo

100% agree... the people who always spread fear about sampling copyright issues are those who live of sample libraries they sell (Hollow Sun, Spectrasonic, etc...). If you listen to them there's no chance to take, even if fair use exist in the law & that I have clearly read in my state's copyrights law book that you can re-use a recording in a creative way (in my state/country which is Quebec, Canada anyway, dunno about other countries!).

Jake Jackson · Post by **Jake Jackson** » Sun Feb 18, 2007 2:49 pm

(You understand that the legal issue here is distribution of copyrighted material, yes? You can sample anything and use it in your own work as much as you want. You are not taking anything from the people who did the work. Only if you profit from sales of or give away the property of the original creator of the work are you in violation of US copyright law. It's exactly the same as book publishing or musical performances: you can make copies for yourself, but if you give them away or sell them, you are competing unfairly with the original creator, impinging upon their ability to profit from their original creation...)

SampleScience · Post by **SampleScience** » Sun Feb 18, 2007 3:28 pm

Anyways... there's always someone who "profit" from the works of others, even those who claims to be 100% legit are not because there is no materials that can claim to be 100% orginal. These copyrights laws are utopic because it's utopic to think that someone can come up with something 100% new & never heard before.

Music is an intellectual art form in constant evolution. Asking money for it is just to be able to continue in this evolution.. going behond that is pursuing another goal.

Vonbrucken · Post by **Vonbrucken** » Sun Feb 18, 2007 7:18 pm

i think that you can sample hardware as long as you don't sample usine presets , but if if it's your own presets go with it ...
then said as far as the library use the name of a renown company thus it can be considered as unfair as it takes advantage of someone else popularity ...
But note that famous content library companies such as ZeroG if they most of the time use some well known hardware will never make a dvd called "the sound of roland " or "the sound of korg " etc though they specify what materials were used to make the content .
So simply change the name of your library and that's all , not wanting to do so is a clear proof that by calling it like this you want to take advantage of this famous name making it more appealing and sexy , and this is really far from the simple "fair use " , wich is merely there for educational purpose , in usa in canada , in the Uk AFAIK ;burp !

sinister1 · Post by **sinister1** » Sun Feb 18, 2007 7:42 pm

I'm still very confused

maybe worse off.

SampleScience · Post by **SampleScience** » Sun Feb 18, 2007 7:47 pm

Is advertising sample cds with famous manifacturers models numbers is fair use?

Yamaha had been the top of the tree for some years in the '70s...

If one product was responsible for toppling the monopoly held by the DX7 and D50 during the early eighties, it was the legendary Korg M1

The Oberheim Matrix-1000 was a direct descendent of the powerful Xpander and Matrix 12...

Fair use of model names & brands?

jens · Post by **jens** » Sun Feb 18, 2007 8:04 pm

sinister1 wrote:I'm still very confused maybe worse off.

yes, it's all a bit confusing - but it's generally like this:

the first consequence will always be a cease and desist letter from a lawyer.

Only if you don't react as requested further consequences might follow.

But if you look at how many free sample-programs (mainly soundfonts) are available which contain samples from sample-based hardware my conclusion is that the meal by far isn't eaten as hot as it is served.

Take the warnings with a grain of salt.

RolandSessionSet for Wusikstation