The "Undone" Production diary

[Kim Lajoie]

After listening to all the versions (slow day at work)....I have to say, I like Day One the best.

It started off with kind of an intimate but edgy "PJ Harvey" vibe and ended up with a "Heart does Garbage (The Band...not trash )" vibe.

I guess in the end you were wanting more of a mainstream radio type of track.

I don't know Heart (I'll have to check them out), but I'm a big fan of Garbage - especially Version 2.0. Go Butch Vig!

I'm definitely going for a "radio" sound.

-Kim.

[Kim Lajoie]

In response to those of you who prefer Day 6 (post mix, pre master) over the final mastered version...

I'm just listening to both at the moment, and I must say I MUCH prefer the final master (discounting level differences, of course). Day 6 sounds so empty and plain in comparison to the final master. It's a bit more dynamic, and it has a lot more space between the sounds... but that's not the aesthetic I'm shooting for. Notice how the snare and the vocal both sound so lonely in Day 6! It sounds like they want to get excited but just can't get it up. Notice how the 2nd part of the 3rd verse just don't SLAM enough!

As I've posted earlier, I'm definitely going for a "radio-ready" sound, rather than an "audiophile" sound. The final master sound much thicker and more exciting. Hear how the sound is much more "glued" together. In day 6 each instrument sounds more separate. I don't think I've mashed the dynamics of the song too much either. The quiet sections are still quieter than the loud sections - I didn't push it to the point of "small loud". I pushed it so that the loudest sections were being limited a healthy amount but the quiet sections remained less processed.

However, like I said earlier, mastering is HARD. I'm happy with the direction I've taken, but I've no doubt a professional could do a better job.

-Kim.

[kilroy]

...mastering is HARD.

Right... I'll have a go, then.

http://www.headroomproductions.com/Mast ... ttempt.mp3


Err, sorry, Kim...I realize this will sound quite different from what you envisioned for this tune, but after listening to the Day 6 track, I just had to try an interpretation of how I heard this mastered up. Tis a bit more of an open, "hi-fi" approach, but there is still plenty of dirt and grunge in here...I just shaped the track to bring it out in slightly different frequency ranges. Went for a punchy, aggressive feel...lively and exciting, and attempted to carve some space across the mix for more separation and depth on the instruments. Tried for a more natural sound on your sister's voice, as well. Blimey...she has just an amazingly Bjork-ish vocal timbre, right down to her growls.

You will have to overlook the general quality of this file. I tried to high cut the top enough to keep the mp3 shriek down to a barely tolerable minimum...but working on a compressed format has unavoidable consequences. Anyroad, bit of a different take on a cool track.


And dear me, man...but you sure do like your distortion.

[Jeremy_NSL]

Besides all the mixing details etc. I like this track. Nice voice, nice groove. Verges on over-produced however (too many elements in the chorus I think) Cool diary too - thanks for sharing!

[Kim Lajoie]

...mastering is HARD.

Right... I'll have a go, then.

http://www.headroomproductions.com/Mast ... ttempt.mp3

Err, sorry, Kim...I realize this will sound quite different from what you envisioned for this tune, but after listening to the Day 6 track, I just had to try an interpretation of how I heard this mastered up. Tis a bit more of an open, "hi-fi" approach, but there is still plenty of dirt and grunge in here...I just shaped the track to bring it out in slightly different frequency ranges. Went for a punchy, aggressive feel...lively and exciting, and attempted to carve some space across the mix for more separation and depth on the instruments. Tried for a more natural sound on your sister's voice, as well.

You made it acoustic! You turned it into "Undone - unplugged"! You're right that it's not what I envisioned for this. What did you do? I'm hearing a lot of emphasis on the mids (and de-emphasis on the bass). Is there some stereo widening (or K-Stereo) at work too? You've brought out the reverb quite a bit...

Interesting interpretation of yours. Much respect. I can definitely see this treatment working on a more "real" or "believable" sound. For my tastes, it's just not amped enough.

Blimey...she has just an amazingly Bjork-ish vocal timbre, right down to her growls.

Anyroad, bit of a different take on a cool track.

And dear me, man...but you sure do like your distortion.

Glad you enjoyed it. My sister's had lots of people telling her she sounds like Bjork. I'm not sure she's entirely comfortable with that.

And, yes I do like my distortion. Very, very much.

-Kim.

[Kim Lajoie]

Besides all the mixing details etc. I like this track. Nice voice, nice groove. [...] Cool diary too - thanks for sharing!

Cool, glad you enjoyed it.

Verges on over-produced however (too many elements in the chorus I think)

"Verges"? I think it's definitely in "over-produced" territory. Like Duran Duran's Wedding Album. Or anything by Duran Duran for that matter. See that red clip light? That means "keep going, you're almost there".

-Kim.

[Signal chain]

Very generous for sharing, much appreciated this is a really informative and a new approach as a tutorial, not easy to find, even on the net.

not my stile at all ...

but I reckon great sound, ready for the radio, I 'd also have copressed it a db a db and a half less then this, but hey who am I?
and plus my music don't go on the radio.

thanks a lot.

[Kim Lajoie]

Very generous for sharing, much appreciated this is a really informative and a new approach as a tutorial, not easy to find, even on the net.

I know. I'd love it if more people did something like this. I really like to get a peek inside how other people compose and produce their music. Most of the techniques I use are the result of reading about other people's techniques and experimenting and adapting them to my work.

not my stile at all ...

but I reckon great sound, ready for the radio, I 'd also have copressed it a db a db and a half less then this, but hey who am I?
and plus my music don't go on the radio.

thanks a lot.

That's cool. I think we stand to learn just as much from different music as we do from similar music to our own.

-Kim.

[rsadasiv]

Very generous for sharing, much appreciated this is a really informative and a new approach as a tutorial, not easy to find, even on the net.

I know. I'd love it if more people did something like this. I really like to get a peek inside how other people compose and produce their music. Most of the techniques I use are the result of reading about other people's techniques and experimenting and adapting them to my work.

+1. Thanks for sharing - I learned a lot.

[kilroy]

You made it acoustic! You turned it into "Undone - unplugged"!

What did you do?

Quite a lot of carving and shaping, believe it or not.

I'm hearing a lot of emphasis on the mids (and de-emphasis on the bass). Is there some stereo widening (or K-Stereo) at work too? You've brought out the reverb quite a bit...

I'm using a fair bit of dynamic EQ to texture various parts, and of course there is some creative compression going on. No K-Stereo. Most of the "width" you hear is simply using EQ to carefully redistribute the weight of frequency information so that the sound stage opens up. There is some subtle mid/side shaping done here to get a bit of extra dimension and depth, hence the more obvious spatial information.


But yeah...totally bent the mix.

[Hewitt Huntwork]

Kim, I think this thread - the description of your progress in composing and recording this song - is one of the greatest things anyone has posted here, ever. Thank you!

[afreshcupofjoe]

Very cool.

[frequency_algorithm]

you are a cool person and I think you should think of other cool ways to decorate this forum with your posts, no matter how much time it takes away from your music or your work.

[bduffy]

Wow, great mix! Great track! Thanks for providing such a detailed glimpse into your songwriting and mixing technique; very illuminating indeed.

I was a little surprised by the final, unmastered mix; I thought it would sound a little brighter, as my tracks tended to brighten up after I tried your suggestions. Sometimes I'm not sure how bright a track is supposed to wind up unmastered, especially if you're A/B-ing with commercial mixes.

Thanks!

[Kim Lajoie]

Kim, I think this thread - the description of your progress in composing and recording this song - is one of the greatest things anyone has posted here, ever. Thank you!

you are a cool person and I think you should think of other cool ways to decorate this forum with your posts, no matter how much time it takes away from your music or your work.

Eeep! Thanks guys!

Wow, great mix! Great track! Thanks for providing such a detailed glimpse into your songwriting and mixing technique; very illuminating indeed.

I was a little surprised by the final, unmastered mix; I thought it would sound a little brighter, as my tracks tended to brighten up after I tried your suggestions. Sometimes I'm not sure how bright a track is supposed to wind up unmastered, especially if you're A/B-ing with commercial mixes.

Thanks!

Thanks. I find the saturation makes things a little brighter, but mainly adds more energy in the mids and upper mids. RetroBand is particularly flexible in focussing the fuzz. Keep in mind also that I add saturation to add character and complexity to a sound - not to change it. I don't add fuzz where there isn't anything there to begin with. It only enhances what's already there.

Also, I don't compare my mix with commercial mixes until the final master. I focus on getting the sounds to work well with themselves and with the song, rather than mixing it like someone else. I know my monitors pretty well, so the master usually only needs about +/-3db of EQ. Sometimes I'm too bright, sometimes not bright enough. This time it just worked out that the master needed some smile. Other jobs need more mids, or more lower mids sometimes.

The important thing to concentrate on in the mix is getting the sounds to work together. If your ears and monitors are in the ballpark, you can correct any slight spectral skews in the master (as I do). If the mix isn't even in the ballpark, you need to spend more quality time with your monitors (listening to reference music).

-Kim.