Insp.by Jupiter 8 Soundbank - [60 A/B comparison clips][New 07/13 : Get a coupon to buy Oxium )

[Peter999]

Congratulations and thanks for mentioning me
Welcome to the exclusive Jupiter-8 Factory Patches Sweaters Club, the last pure men domain in the world

Lol. Before releasing the first demo, I reread your Jup8 thread Peter, and I must say, I had to face EVERY problem you had. Exactly the same questions I asked myelf etc. This really made me smile. I know how tough it should have been for you, and I know the ammount of work that went into it. kudos.

As for mentionning you : Fully deserved. You were the first to attempt to recreate some of these patches afaik. A precursor, a pionner, a pilgrim on unknown lands

LtZ

Merci beaucoup In fact it was Ingo (as he correctly said) who started the whole idea of reprograming the whole Jupiter-8 factory bank a while ago here on KVR and it caught my attention because OP-X PRO-II already had a few of these Jupiter-8 factory patches in its included patches library before, too based on the Synthmania clips which I knew since a long time and which also were listed as reference source from the beginning on for the library - but not featuring the amount of detail and authenticity to withstand a real A:B comparison (it was more "inspired by"), so the idea of re-programming the whole factory bank based on this pre-work seemed to be tempting.

But to be honest, in the end I hated myself for this stupid decision since it turned out to become such an enormous work just for the sake of authenticity, but once you said A you also have to say B, and so it's there now, and I think some presets are really close, which could be cool for people looking for authentic sounding Jupiter-8 factory patches. But as you said too the best part about it is that one really can learn a lot regarding programming by re-creating such patches and doing all the fine-tuning to match them as close as possible to the original source. But it's a pain. Much sweat as you said

[olikana]

@ingo how you dealt with that case (jeez u found out it was a collection of sounds still being sold and on this site even(!!) ofc you had to fix that or u could have got in trouble) is not the norm though.
but sure if u want us to believe you got permission from roland for copying their factory presets don't expect anyone to believe u.
the only legit way would be by ear...any other way involving parmater values copying (like u admittedly did) would not be legit for redistribution.

[fmr]

@ingo how you dealt with that case (jeez u found out it was a collection of sounds still being sold and on this site even(!!) ofc you had to fix that or u could have got in trouble) is not the norm though.
but sure if u want us to believe you got permission from roland for copying their factory presets don't expect anyone to believe u.
the only legit way would be by ear...any other way involving parmater values copying (like u admittedly did) would not be legit for redistribution.

You are joking, right?

[Ingonator]

the only legit way would be by ear...any other way involving parmater values copying (like u admittedly did) would not be legit for redistribution.

AFAIK both Lotuzia and Peter had a look at the patch sheets too. On the other hand copying the sounds on Arturia Jupiter 8V also don't give a perfect result instantly so optimizations by ear are needed too. Opposing to Lotuzia and Peter i am not finished with that yet.


Ingo

[olikana]

If the resulting sounds would be identical how would one be more legit than the other one?

cos a sound in itself is not copyrightable (a recording of it is..but it's the recording that is copyrighted .not the nature of the sound itself)
in the case of a preset only the work done to achieve that sound is. ...not the sound in itself. and you cannot resistribute other peoples work (the work done to achieve that sound).
in other words if u achieve a sound by yourselself without copying parameter values you'd be fine. the sound in itself cannot be copyrighted .
otherwise all sound designers here would be counterfeit scammers as they all reproduce sounds which have already been made by others at some point (i don't think that there's many in the world who can claim to be making sounds that were never done before)

and btw i'm not a copyright Nazi....but lotuzia was already nice to thank you (for pointing him out synthmania the most famous vintage synth site on the net..) and he wanted to thank pail99 too for being somone who had inspired him to do the same close sompariosn to the origianl factory set with audio comparioson etc...
but u felt the need from your grandeur delusion to point out that u actually did that before him....so those nice words should actually be redirected at you.
lotuzia you should have just put in the main title "thanks ingo if we exist"
and the instrument forum should be renamed "ingonator and the preset spammers"
done

[Ingonator]

I could now more or less agree to your description of copying a sound vs copying values.
Anyway as already mentioned even if Arturia Jupiter 8V is a Jupiter 8 emulation the values do not fit exactly. If that would be the case i would have been finished long time ago (long before Peter and Lotuzia). I guess for really finishing it i would need a quite long time like the other two did.
In Diva the values are different enough (almost all of them) to cause any problems after your definition of a legal reproduction.

I don't think any further discussion of this is necessary here. at least i will stop contributing to that discussion. There is already enough derailment now.
I deleted parts of my posts to reduce the mess.


Ingo

[olikana]

if the values matched 1:1 (like in monark , tal-uno-lx) then absolutley anyone who's not blind could do it , so what plaudits do u expect?
my guess is that lotuzia wanted to give kudos to paul99 for embarking in a recreation of jupiter8 factory presets with audio comparisons even on a synth which is not even a jupiter8 emu.
and yes lets close this discussion here. pointless

[Ingonator]

One more comment. I sold OP-X Pro a while ago so using the those patches in not an option for me currently. I got Oxium anyway (as a NFR due to the Beta testing) and if Lotuzias patches are as good as i expect finishing the patches for Arturia Jupiter 8V could become obsolete for me anyway.
I could keep those at the current state for my own use then...


Ingo

[contrary]

As an OXIUM owner, this is wonderfull news for me !




But having sound design By Lotuzia availible for any of my instruments is always dam fine news !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


.

[Ingonator]

But having sound design By Lotuzia available for any of my instruments is always dam fine news !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
.

+1

Last bank i got from him was that for Diversion.


Ingo

[Lotuzia]

As an OXIUM owner, this is wonderfull news for me !




But having sound design By Lotuzia availible for any of my instruments is always dam fine news !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


.

Thanks a million Contrary and Ingo

[Lotuzia]

Second demo with another batch of around 15 A/B comparisons between Oxium and the Jupiter 8

Inspired by Jupiter 8 Demo 2


The first clip ( Flute) probably requires some explanations :

First comparisons you hear the Oxium flute WITHOUT reverb. Then twice the comparison with the JP8 with the reverb, and Oxium WITH the reverb.

This is to explain how reverb can affect the perception we have of a sound ( wich is obvious but well ) and to explain why I added reverb to the Oxium clips, as Paolo form Synthmania, also added reverb to his JP8 to perform the original clips/

Guess what software reverb I used to get that vintage vibe ?

LtZ

[Lotuzia]

Here are the 30 clips available atm. Working on the next ones so that in the end there will be around 60 A/B clips.

Inspired by Jupiter 8 Demo 1

Inspired by Jupiter 8 Demo 2

Reverb is Exponential Audio ( Mainly chambers in various flavors ) I only used the factory presets.

[Lotuzia]

Congratulations and thanks for mentioning me
Welcome to the exclusive Jupiter-8 Factory Patches Sweaters Club, the last pure men domain in the world

Lol. Before releasing the first demo, I reread your Jup8 thread Peter, and I must say, I had to face EVERY problem you had. Exactly the same questions I asked myelf etc. This really made me smile. I know how tough it should have been for you, and I know the ammount of work that went into it. kudos.

As for mentionning you : Fully deserved. You were the first to attempt to recreate some of these patches afaik. A precursor, a pionner, a pilgrim on unknown lands

LtZ

Merci beaucoup In fact it was Ingo (as he correctly said) who started the whole idea of reprograming the whole Jupiter-8 factory bank a while ago here on KVR and it caught my attention because OP-X PRO-II already had a few of these Jupiter-8 factory patches in its included patches library before, too based on the Synthmania clips which I knew since a long time and which also were listed as reference source from the beginning on for the library - but not featuring the amount of detail and authenticity to withstand a real A:B comparison (it was more "inspired by"), so the idea of re-programming the whole factory bank based on this pre-work seemed to be tempting.

But to be honest, in the end I hated myself for this stupid decision since it turned out to become such an enormous work just for the sake of authenticity, but once you said A you also have to say B, and so it's there now, and I think some presets are really close, which could be cool for people looking for authentic sounding Jupiter-8 factory patches. But as you said too the best part about it is that one really can learn a lot regarding programming by re-creating such patches and doing all the fine-tuning to match them as close as possible to the original source. But it's a pain. Much sweat as you said

yes I called the soundbank "Inspired by Jupiter 8" because imho a soundbank called "Jupiter 8 factory" should recreate all the Jupiter presets with 100% accuracy. An humble move so.

But Oxium is almost undistinguishable in some clips, and very very close in some other ones. And, all in all, in the remaining clips, even if some sound different, I think the Oxium version show it has definitely one "analog vibe". Only what I think though, I made these clips so that everyone could finally judge by himself on Oxium, andone those famous "Analog VS Digital" mysterious things ( and indeed some things remain mysterious )

[Peter999]

Yes, I also wasn't able to reprogramm all sounds with the same degree of authenticity. Some of the effect sounds even couldn't be done since OP-X PRO-II hasn't the same parameter set as Jupiter-8.

Btw, I think it would be a bit easier to compare and switch forth and back between original and clone if you listed the examples as single clips next to the originals as it was done in the OP-X PRO-II vs. Jupiter-8 thread:

Jupiter-8 Factory Presets for OP-X PRO-II
http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=359511

If one owns the original synth (unfortunately I don't own a Jupiter-8, but some other ones including an OB-X) the most fun is always to post the whole as blind A:B test. In this OB-X vs. OP-X PRO-II thread only 3 of 8 people were able to hear which one is the original, and this (as they admitted) only because the recordings of the original showed some revealing noise:

Oberheim OB-X vs. OP-X PRO-II
http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=348343