Help me understand Fruity Loops

[dto]

You may not know it yet since you've only been playing with the demo for a little while, but if you click on "Projects" in the browser window (the window on the left), and then click on "Cool stuff", you will see a ton of example songs. Just click on one to load it up, and then you can play it.

Maybe you could peruse some of those to see how other people are doing things in FL as well.

[Shane Sanders]

You may not know it yet since you've only been playing with the demo for a little while, but if you click on "Projects" in the browser window (the window on the left), and then click on "Cool stuff", you will see a ton of example songs. Just click on one to load it up, and then you can play it.

Maybe you could peruse some of those to see how other people are doing things in FL as well.

Thanks! That is definitely what I need to do. I found some tutorials online that have helped me apprehend some things, but I know there's a lot under the hood here.

I really like the routing in FL, and also the ability to write and implement expressions. That could really come in handy.

-Shane

[krumelur]

Some tips and tricks perhaps..

Lets see how this goes.. if I can remember it without having fl in front of me..
Copying a pattern:
In playlist, ctrl+shift+insert inserts a new empy pattern below the selected one. Extremely useful if u wanna have all the patterns for an instrument 'close together'..
Select all tracks in the pattern u'r working with (doubleclicking or right-clicking? the tiny green "dot" just right to the "sample box") press ctrl+c to copy, jump to next pattern, press ctrl+v, continue tweaking..
Note that there is a slight difference in copying a whole 'piano roll' and the actual notes within the piano roll (copying the track vs selecting all notes in the piano roll), this might be quite obvious however.. if u've got a bunch of notes copied from some pianoroll, in the next pattern right-click the sample-box, choose piano roll and paste 'em in there ..
A nifty little function, possibly not the most useful one but nonetheless worth a mention is that if you select a bunch of notes in the pianoroll, holding shift while dragging "length" makes the whole selection expand/contract.. looks cool anyway
A feature I use very often is automation.. creating automation for any parameter is quite easy and fast once u get used to it, automation is treated as patterns in the playlist, meaning that u trigger and can sequence auto-data in the playlist.. the automation is stored in the pattern it is created in (keep this in mind).. I usually keep patterns with notes and automation separated (with name and colour and everything).. I know some people store all automation in a single pattern (the dreaded "Automation data"), but I like the concept of "looping" or repeating an automation.
Just right-clicking any knob will enable u to automate it (for VST's there is a scroll down menu with all accessible parameters).
The peak controller is quite nifty aswell, making it really easy to just throw in an lfo or whatever for a knob, u use it as a plugin effect in the mixer (remember to un-mute it) and can be accessed pretty much the same way as automation (right click) or midi-control.
One little detail I find sometimes utterly superior, me being the "jammer" type of musician often involved in collaborative processes, is the way fl handles midi-data, atleast input from my keyboard.. no matter where I am in the program, I could be browsing for samples or inside some "Save ass.." dialog window, whatever, if I fiddle with my keyboard the selected instrument is playing pretty much no matter what.. props to the developers for this one..
I also like the snap-function being easily accessible at all time since I change this very often.. (most often I use 'none')
Oh yeah, and in the playlist you can drag a pattern to overlap the previous one, only works in one direction..

Zzillions of more if wanted..

he he.. just some late night thoughts possibly unreadable and incomprehensible for anyone but me..

have a nice one!

[Shane Sanders]

Thanks krumelur! I'll try those ideas out tomorrow night.

I have successfully used the slide function now. It took me a while to realize that it only works for native Fruity generators. Is that correct?

-Shane

[pheeleep]

Indeed, it only works for fruity generators.

Keep on playing with the demo

I have been a user for over 3 years now, and couldn't be happier. Well, it works for me. Once you get a hang of it, there is no looking back. You get hooked.

Once you get a hang of the basics, you will start digging deep into it and you will realize just how powerful it is. I still learn things about it on a daily basis. There is so much to explore, and so much you can do. You will also find answers to any questions you may have on the Fl Studio forum if/when you buy the program. I am an active member there and will be happy to help. There are things that you can do that I am sure you are not aware of, but that's normal. You are testing it right now.

[ash477]

Thank you!

If the arrangement window worked like Orion, I'd buy it tonight and not look back. I may still buy it, but I find the pattern thing odd even though I also use a pattern based sequencer all the time.

-Shane

I used to use Fruity and switched to Orion because of that awful arrangement window -- and the fact that I don't LIKE looking for 'secrets' and cool tricks in my sequencer. I want something thats awfully easy and straightforward. I just could not be creative with my songs when I can't see whats going on in the arrangement window or I'm trying to figure out some *trick* hidden way to do something in FL. Orion is easier for me to use, although may not have all the features of FL.
IE:
If I want a long track in Orion, sometimes I set it to 992 and just play for a minute or two until its about to end. I wish it went longer than 1000 but I can live with it. FL can play til the end of the song, but the whole arrangement thing is just awful, I can't take it.
The one thing that hurts me w/ Orion is that it doesn't work with drum loop VST's like GrooveAgent or Stylus. If I had that working, I'd be the next Barry Manilow, no, wait, I mean, Boy George, er, Prince

[Shane Sanders]

Thank you!

If the arrangement window worked like Orion, I'd buy it tonight and not look back. I may still buy it, but I find the pattern thing odd even though I also use a pattern based sequencer all the time.

-Shane

I used to use Fruity and switched to Orion because of that awful arrangement window -- and the fact that I don't LIKE looking for 'secrets' and cool tricks in my sequencer. I want something thats awfully easy and straightforward. I just could not be creative with my songs when I can't see whats going on in the arrangement window or I'm trying to figure out some *trick* hidden way to do something in FL. Orion is easier for me to use, although may not have all the features of FL.
IE:
If I want a long track in Orion, sometimes I set it to 992 and just play for a minute or two until its about to end. I wish it went longer than 1000 but I can live with it. FL can play til the end of the song, but the whole arrangement thing is just awful, I can't take it.
The one thing that hurts me w/ Orion is that it doesn't work with drum loop VST's like GrooveAgent or Stylus. If I had that working, I'd be the next Barry Manilow, no, wait, I mean, Boy George, er, Prince

Yep, the arrangment tools are not equal to Orion as far as basic layout goes, but Fruity's onion-skinning thing has an appeal because for doing counterpoint or building complex harmony across several voices in several instruments, it's nice to be able to see and hear the notes in the time line for the instruments.

Do you find that you still use Fruity within Orion via Rewire or did you drop it completely?

-Shane

[Jaidy]

Actually I find the fl playlist window a great gui for arrangement.

I create patterns as follows:
in red
patterns for kicks, patterns for snares, patterns for hats
in gold
patterns for bass
in blue
patterns for lead
in green
patterns for rhythm
in yello
patterns for 2nd rhythm

I arrange all the red patterns in the first set of lines in decending order according to complexity. Simple patterns on top, complex ones near the bottom of the band.

Next down comes the gold bass patterns again in order of complexity.

And so on with the other colors.

This method allows you to quicly try many different arrangements out quickly, from arranging a drum section to an entire set of measures of everything.

This works very well on my 1600 by 1200 lap top screen.

Some one else had a great idea which I concur with, grab as many flp files off the net you can and learn from them. There are lots of fan sites or e-music sites like sectionz where they can be found.

Is FL perfect, no way, needs more mixer sends and routing options, and recording to wav and using long wav files is problematic.

Good Luck!

[Shane Sanders]

That seems logical. I probably won't go to that much trouble until I can actually save something, but it makes total sense conceptually.

My fear, however, is that because unique patterns have to be on their own Pattern Track, I will be overcome by my propensity to have many short but unique patterns, especially in the percussion instrumentation. This would mean a lot of vertical scrolling.

I think I could live with a bass part that just kept getting longer as I worked on it, and certainly most melodies would be in a longer Pattern, but for the little stuff I am a maniac for variety and I like to have them short and sweet because I use a few basic patterns to make myriad variations. In keeping things short, it allows for more options when it's time to really arrange the song. I think more like a songwriter than a lot of the trance/dance influenced folks that gravitate toward fruity, and so I like having many options when moving a chorus here and there, etc.

But in thinking it over, perhaps I could alter my working methods and keep a group of "building blocks" down near the bottom of the song and then bring bits and pieces up from there and paste into a "live" Pattern that's actually part of the real arrangement. Of course, unless I'm missing something obvious, in order to mute all the "building block" Patterns, I would need to assign them all to a single mixer track and then turn the volume down on it (since there seems to not be a mute button anywhere else).

I need to think this through more and keep reading the help file.

Also, can anyone give me an honest appraisal of FL stability. What VST's crash it? What VST's don't work properly? What are the outstanding issues that bother dedicated users? It would help me a lot to know these things.

-Shane

[thockin]

FL very rarely crashes. I have had a few crashes, but have not tracked them to any particular VST. Very rare.

I do find that I have LOTS and LOTS of little patterns. Sometimes I really really just want a single track for an instrument.

[Shane Sanders]

FL very rarely crashes. I have had a few crashes, but have not tracked them to any particular VST. Very rare.

I do find that I have LOTS and LOTS of little patterns. Sometimes I really really just want a single track for an instrument.

Yes, it seems like this would be easy for the Fruity programmers to do because they could leave the underlying code the same, but merely create a "container" Pattern Track that lets you represent (instance) all those little patterns into a single line - if only for the sake of the eye. I suppose it would mean adding another method of representing data on the playlist. One could even write it so you could import and export sub-playlists for doing alternate mixes of your own work or someone's work.

I'm sure all of this has been said before. I just don't really follow the Fruity threads here, but probably should go back over some of the more recent ones.

-Shane

[digitalstasis]

playlist menu/patterns/flatten selected = selected patterns are put in one longer bar

[Shane Sanders]

I just got a nice brain tingle from the Fruity formula demos. Now that is what I call a good feature. Do Fruity users have a repository of useful formulas somewhere?

I also like the wide variety of effects that ship with this product. They all seem to be very musical, and the GUIs are consistent for the most part.

I've just discovered the Channel Display Groups and Layer Groups. This may be part of what I'm looking for to solve some of my "wants" versus some of my "must haves", etc. Though it doesn't solve the arrangement issues, it's a start.

[smart]

It's very stable and will very rarely crash. It's only happened to me once in a while, and it's just about always been related to a buggy vst plugin.

[Shane Sanders]

playlist menu/patterns/flatten selected = selected patterns are put in one longer bar

Thanks. I had figured that out earlier, but that process seems to take away one's ability to easily move what used to be patterns 1-8 from the chorus and put them in the intro, etc. I realize that one can copy and paste, but it's a workflow issue.