A sad new low for lack of teamwork

[glokraw]

the irony is how bloated and inefficient linux distros are getting. The prerequisites to install anything are getting much longer and more tangential.

I agree, and like to start off with CD sized distros.
Bodhi is a good barebones .deb based CD sized distro.
Installing the audio apps can drag in qt, gtk and gnome,
among others, yet still be a nimble and clutter free experience.
pclinuxOS, has 'mini-me' versions, as well as
'full monty', Ubuntu could do likewise.

I think antiX for debian has a super-bare
version, in the 300 meg range. Then there is Studio 1337,
the Puppy/Slackware hybrid that boots the rt-kernel/OS into ram,
for sheer speed, it's hard to beat.
Cheers

[StudioDave]

The Linux community have always been a bunch of elitist snobs.
Sadly their own user base are one of the main reasons that people are turned off of Linux.

The users never bothered me, but the irony is how bloated and inefficient linux distros are getting.

I tend to stay with the tried & trusted. I've been happy with Fedora 21 for a long while, but it's time for an upgrade. I won't necessarily go with the latest, I'll stick with whatever Fernando recommends at Planet CCRMA.

Bloat can be shoved overboard, of course, but I'm not sure what you mean by inefficient.

It is a pity that the 3-tier structure (community/free, non-commercial, commercial) to support linux is so vehemently opposed. It would advance linux, in terms of usage as well as development.

This.

Fortunately the folks at Pianoteq, u-he, discoDSP, Loomer, Tracktion, Bitwig, Monoplugs, Monstrum Media, Renoise, energyXT, Harrison, and elsewhere continue to produce high-quality music software for Linux along with Windows and the Mac, despite the squeaky pips.

Best,

dp

[glokraw]

Lot of Redhat fans at the Michigan Vs Ohio State game today

[khanyz]

Bloat can be shoved overboard, of course, but I'm not sure what you mean by inefficient.

I mean inefficient in terms of wasted storage space, excessive and recursive library calls. Shared code is a good thing as it maintains standards and minimises bugs but it needs to be optmized. For instance, in Debian and others, I've had to install bluetooth libraries, drivers and services, just to get one format processing procedure, or comms stack, when neither was exclusive to bluetooth and were standards before it. In some OSes, you can get per format and per protocol libraries which are only rolled up when they reach legacy status. This leads to lean, efficient code and installs.

[.jon]

If that's true, I'm glad I got November's Linux Magazine Issue #192,
since it has a searchable dvd, with all the previous 191 issues as PDF's,
and I'm going to need all those tutorials to figure out
what a desktop really is...maybe figure out that
wheely looking thing on top of the mouse...

Gee, 192 issues, and we still haven't reached 'the year'

Desktop in this context refers to an OS people can use for all their personal and professional computing needs. Linux, lacking all the end user software, is still as far from this goal as it was 20 years ago when the meme was born.

[robotmonkey]

Read the title, opened the post and read linux. LOLed hard.

Why would any plugin developer care about linux considering linux's zero market share and that it generally sucks Donald Trumps ass when it comes to audio?

And that things are not working out in a linux community should not surprise anyone considering that 99% of linux developers and users suffer more or less from autism and have exactly zero people skills.

[khanyz]

Read the title, opened the post and read linux. LOLed hard.

Why would any plugin developer care about linux considering linux's zero market share and that it generally sucks Donald Trumps ass when it comes to audio?

And that things are not working out in a linux community should not surprise anyone considering that 99% of linux developers and users suffer more or less from autism and have exactly zero people skills.

That's way out of order. Just because you mention Trump, doesn't mean you should channel his bull. Autism is a serious issue, for both the individual and their family and friends. It shouldn't be belittled, in whatever context.

Linux as an ethos over economics is admirable. However, that should not limit it, if it's truly free.

[chk071]

Linux as an ethos over economics is admirable.

No. Simply because people AREN'T like that. I don't blame the Linux people though. It's a common thing that people get more and more naive. Linux is like north korea, but people are like China. That's how it is basically, and that's also the reason why Linux' general concept sucks, and always will. The Black Friday sales going on show that very well ATM. Why limit yourself to a concept where everyone has to pay the same, always, when you get DYNAMICS with lowering and raising prices, and producing SALES. The vast majority of people want that. They don't want a "give and take" thing, which produces no dynamics, or motivation to produce quality. The bigger the price, the more people will expect quality. It's really not that hard.

[Aleatoriac]

argumentum ad populum

That's way out of order. Just because you mention Trump, doesn't mean you should channel his bull. Autism is a serious issue, for both the individual and their family and friends. It shouldn't be belittled, in whatever context.

Linux as an ethos over economics is admirable. However, that should not limit it, if it's truly free.

Hey. The larger population of screaming apes has spoken.

And how dare you side with people who don't necessarily want to f**k each other over for a percentage.

[khanyz]

Linux as an ethos over economics is admirable.

No. Simply because people AREN'T like that. I don't blame the Linux people though. It's a common thing that people get more and more naive. Linux is like north korea, but people are like China. That's how it is basically, and that's also the reason why Linux' general concept sucks, and always will. The Black Friday sales going on show that very well ATM. Why limit yourself to a concept where everyone has to pay the same, always, when you get DYNAMICS with lowering and raising prices, and producing SALES. The vast majority of people want that. They don't want a "give and take" thing, which produces no dynamics, or motivation to produce quality. The bigger the price, the more people will expect quality. It's really not that hard.

I said it was admirable, not that it worked. Yes it's economics first, second and third which drives society today, but that doesn't mean it should always be and that there isn't something better in the future. Evolution isn't in one go and across the board, there's steps forwards and back till one moves us all forward.

[chk071]

I consider not learning from hundreds, thousands of years of human existence a step backwards TBH. Why do we feel like we need to reinvent the wheel the whole time these days, without learning from the past? In an ideal world, a lot of things WOULD work. But, unfortunately, this world is not ideal. And, especially, people are not the same. What would work for you and me doesn't have to work for everyone. And that's the important point, and a point many Linuxer's fail to see, i'm afraid to say. Hence it will stay niche, in foreseeable future. TBH, i don't see how such a concept would work in any case, anyway. To give and take, everyone must be the "same". But noone is.

[khanyz]

The glass may be half empty, but you can decide which bit to look through.

[.jon]

Linux as an ethos over economics is admirable.

No. Simply because people AREN'T like that. I don't blame the Linux people though. It's a common thing that people get more and more naive. Linux is like north korea, but people are like China. That's how it is basically, and that's also the reason why Linux' general concept sucks, and always will. The Black Friday sales going on show that very well ATM. Why limit yourself to a concept where everyone has to pay the same, always, when you get DYNAMICS with lowering and raising prices, and producing SALES. The vast majority of people want that. They don't want a "give and take" thing, which produces no dynamics, or motivation to produce quality. The bigger the price, the more people will expect quality. It's really not that hard.

That's not the reason linux sucks, even though it's also related to basic economics. Linux and FOSS will be inferior to commercial products as long as educated, skilled and talented programmers and producers have to pay for living. It's really simple as that, teams of real people just can't work on free software like they can work on commercial software.

[Gamma-UT]

That's not the reason linux sucks, even though it's also related to basic economics. Linux and FOSS will be inferior to commercial products as long as educated, skilled and talented programmers and producers have to pay for living. It's really simple as that, teams of real people just can't work on free software like they can work on commercial software.

Companies like Redhat charge for services. Others do dual-licensing as well as service provision. Qt is in a bunch of hardware that needs a graphical user interface that isn't a bog standard PC, including mass-market smartphones. And then there's JUCE, which you probably have running in multiple instrument and effects plugins on your own PC.

[Teksonik]

The Linux community have always been a bunch of elitist snobs.
Sadly their own user base are one of the main reasons that people are turned off of Linux.

Bingo ! I have two computers running Ubuntu and have tried other Distros and anytime I've had a question at the various forums the response has been rather douchy.

I love Linux for simple tasks such a e-mail and internet but I wouldn't want to use it as a music production platform. Windows 10 Pro is $200 from Microsoft, the price of a mid range plugin and opens up the entire world of music production.

But I admire anyone who has the patience to set up and use with Linux for music production. Your nerves are far more steady than mine......