Need new acoustic steel string guitar sample set

[David]

I've got quite a few, including the Sunbird and the OT Steel, both very nice (esp. like the string=key setup in Sunbird and all their others, just like how AAS's Strum 2 works, perfect for fingerpicking). Speaking of which, I've also got Realitone's Fingerpick, which is very useful and appealing but sounds even better when the patterns are sent to its cousin, their Acoustic Light which has become one of my recent favs overall. A few other surprises in the same "cheaper AND just as good!" vein, don't miss Spitfire's $3 Peel guitar, and definitely check out Jack's Concert Guitar, and SampleTank's American Acoustic.

I'm very interested working out MIDI patterns reminiscent (to me) of the American Primitive style of acoustic fingerpicking but once I have a pattern going I tend to swap in lots of different sounds/instruments, and I'm very often happiest with the simplicity or oddness I get from these small libraries with very little hassle. Plus it seems better in practice to have lots of little flavorful libraries to choose from than one or two huge ones, given my workflow.

Another great source is Omnisphere 2; some great stuff resurrected from Hans Zimmer Guitar libraries from back in the day—easy to miss if you're not thinking Omnisphere=Guitar.

And don't ignore Strum2, it's pretty splendid, esp since so tweakable.

Some example tracks (obviously NOT going for perfection here, but for a virtual version of what it used to feel like being hunched over a real guitar and fooling around for hours on end; IMO, nailed):

Omnisphere
https://soundcloud.com/david-coffin/dd- ... r-week-two

Sunbird
https://soundcloud.com/david-coffin/dif ... week-three

Strum
https://soundcloud.com/david-coffin/dif ... perfection

[kevvvvv]

compyfox

why do you not consider RG4 to be of quality?

I mean, sure, the samples are a bit "dated" at this point, but nothing that the right EQ and compression can't fix? Also, for the money you invest, you do(!) get several guitars (incl. 12-string), and a great "brain" to play this thing.

Dated sound. Yes. The 290mb sample set is the only one I use. Neutron improves it.

Frankly MusicLab disappoint me as they made more instruments rather than made RG4 better.

Nonetheless they've been real leaders in their field for ages. I was an RG1 customer. Even wrote demos for it.

So maybe it's just time to move on.

I'm still a bit scared of what to get as it seems so final. A few times I've sprung £100+ on sample sets only to feel a bit let down later when I discovered it was a one trick pony and not the answer to my prayers.

It's a lot easier to spend £100+ on a synth, as they're all so good (spire, wiggle, avenger, diva et al)

btw the AGT demos sound good and I play a Taylor anyway (814ce). Thanks for the heads up, donkos

And thanks everyone for all your welcome inputs

[Compyfox]

Man, I completely forgot Realitone. That thing was pure cheese (in a good way!) in the presentation videos... IIRC, the dev changed the tone of the samples via scripting and filter alternation to reduce the sample size. The pre-recorded chords might be a bit limiting though.



Other than that... are there audio demos for "Peel Guitar"?

So many interesting mentions in here, even I might cave and pick up the one or another set.
Did anyone mention Vir2 yet? Granted, not cheap, but maybe something for somebody out there.



And before I comment on the following - an important disclaimer:
I am not trying to sell anyone of you anything. I'm just giving a different viewpoint. Ultimately, it's your decision what to go for.

Dated sound. Yes. The 290mb sample set is the only one I use. Neutron improves it.

Personally I'm using a combination of a NEVE type EQ (1081) and moderate compression (4:1, 3-5dB gain reduction). And this works absolute wonders.

The problem IMO is, that the 290MB sample pack is "fixed stereo", meaning, ultra wide. It's two mics alright, but panning is kind of hard to control. And then we have the "plain" engine on top.

I do prefer the "mono" versions, and in fact "Steel 2".

Frankly MusicLab disappoint me as they made more instruments rather than made RG4 better.

Nonetheless they've been real leaders in their field for ages. I was an RG1 customer. Even wrote demos for it.

I do understand what you mean. I've been with them for years as well (took so long regarding the keyswitched - remember ToolBox?). I still dislike the strumming library. If I wouldn't be so lazy, I'd create some plain bread and butter stuff suited for my needs (if only Cubase would have a "name keys" feature like Reaper does).

However - the "Humanize feature" update is absolutely killer now. It sounds so much more alive, so much more "realistic" (reaching into downright sloppy and bad sometimes - if you push the engine into that direction). I waited for years (and it took many FR's) to see something like this finally implemented. And IMO, it delivered.

Do you use this mode? Is it still off-putting to you?

Or why not use the super-simplified "Joystick Mode". You can trigger that via MIDI notes as well (more control over the velocity!), though it doesn't use the "Humanize engine" on top, since you're supposed to play this thing in this mode with a... er... toy guitar.

RG4 didn't get the double-track feature of the e-guitars yet. Maybe for RG5, whenever that will hit.

So maybe it's just time to move on.

If you feel dissatisfied, I definitely understand that. But I wouldn't "move on" just yet. Maybe put it back on to the shelf for a while.

I'm still a bit scared of what to get as it seems so final. A few times I've sprung £100+ on sample sets only to feel a bit let down later when I discovered it was a one trick pony and not the answer to my prayers.

It's a lot easier to spend £100+ on a synth, as they're all so good (spire, wiggle, avenger, diva et al)

That's why I wrote that at some point, I did feel like "is there more" with the one or another Pettinhouse sample set. And I also did try a lot of other sets from the competition. Ultimately, I did jump back to RealGuitar and use it's brain to simply trigger Kontakt samples. if I really need a different flavor and/or are too lazy to program some keyswitches.

I know of Ilya Efimov, I know of Vir2 - I've used them at client rigs, but I've never bought these samples myself because of... well... being a "one trick pony" sometimes.

btw the AGT demos sound good and I play a Taylor anyway (814ce). Thanks for the heads up, donkos

I think this is why a lot of people prefer AmpleSound over Musiclab. The sound is definitely(!) instant gratification. It has more "oomph" (hah! more lowend/more rounded out sound), it often sounds better right out of the box, I do like the chord pattern creation engine. However, this is where it ends for me usability wise. And, as mentioned, paying extra for "add-ons" while other sets come with 3-5 guitars bundled.



Again - it's ultimately up to you and your personal preferences.

[kevvvvv]

compyfox

Personally I'm using a combination of a NEVE type EQ (1081) and moderate compression (4:1, 3-5dB gain reduction). And this works absolute wonders.

cheers

[donkey tugger]

Man, I completely forgot Realitone. That thing was pure cheese (in a good way!)

The bloke in the 80s leather jacket!

It is actually really nice (yes, got that one too..) but the leather jacket gets me very time.

[Compyfox]

compyfox

Personally I'm using a combination of a NEVE type EQ (1081) and moderate compression (4:1, 3-5dB gain reduction). And this works absolute wonders.

cheers

Any compressor should works, just focus on the sustain.

EQ wise, it's up to personal taste and what the production needs. Sometimes I remove the "lower mids" (honk) a bit, sometimes I add more highend to counteract the "boomy lowend", sometimes if things are too thing, a healthy dose of several dB of low shelf... it's a matter of taste. It's just that to me, a 1081 type EQ (personal favorite, Nomad Factory) just gets the job done - and quick.

And as mentioned - turn on the Humanize feature...
Bonus: mess with the VSTi EQ (low frequency mainly in +-3dB range) and the "Internal Mixer" (reduce the plectrum sound by at least 3dB, which alters the "attack" feeling)

Then maybe give RG4 another chance.


DISCLAIMER STILL: not trying to sell anything, just giving some tips and tricks.

Man, I completely forgot Realitone. That thing was pure cheese (in a good way!)

The bloke in the 80s leather jacket!

It is actually really nice (yes, got that one too..) but the leather jacket gets me very time.

I don't remember any "leather jacket" (unless you mean the Bon Jovi impression ), but definitely some jokes in the videos, and his "let's meet up campaign" with brownies at NAMM, or was it Musikmesse? Either way, Mike Greene is definitely full of joy for his work.

[David]

Other than that... are there audio demos for "Peel Guitar"?

The link takes you to a google search which includes some links promising a demo, but here's the only one I found useful:



Peel solo'ed starts at 5:40; it's very brief. Regardless, I doubt you'll miss your $3:)

[donkey tugger]

Man, I completely forgot Realitone. That thing was pure cheese (in a good way!)

The bloke in the 80s leather jacket!

It is actually really nice (yes, got that one too..) but the leather jacket gets me very time.

I don't remember any "leather jacket" (unless you mean the Bon Jovi impression ), but definitely some jokes in the videos, and his "let's meet up campaign" with brownies at NAMM, or was it Musikmesse? Either way, Mike Greene is definitely full of joy for his work.

This chap, on the GUI..

And Mike does seem like a good lad. Had a few questions before I bought it and he was straight back to me with helpful answers.

[David]

Here's a longer Peel demo, plus a bunch of other libraries I enjoy:
https://soundcloud.com/david-coffin/peeldemoplus

"A quick demo of my favorite acoustic Guitar Sample libraries for fingerpicking, all running a little MIDI loop from Realitone's Fingerpicking, transposed in various ways to showcase different registers in each instrument. These are, in order:
Spitfire's Peel Guitar
Realitone's Acoustic Lite (sounds slightly better to me than Fingerpicking itself, but just a bit)
Orangetree's Evolution
Haephestos" Jacks' Guitar (nylon…)
IKMultimedia's American Acoustic
Omnisphere 2's Fingerstyle Acoustic 6-string (transposed a bit more since it's laid out over the entire keyboard)
Ample's M Free
AcousticSamples's Sunbird
PrecisionSound's Owerland Guitar"

[kevvvvv]

compyfox

Any compressor should works, just focus on the sustain.

EQ wise, it's up to personal taste and what the production needs. Sometimes I remove the "lower mids" (honk) a bit, sometimes I add more highend to counteract the "boomy lowend", sometimes if things are too thing, a healthy dose of several dB of low shelf... it's a matter of taste. It's just that to me, a 1081 type EQ (personal favorite, Nomad Factory) just gets the job done - and quick.

And as mentioned - turn on the Humanize feature...
Bonus: mess with the VSTi EQ (low frequency mainly in +-3dB range) and the "Internal Mixer" (reduce the plectrum sound by at least 3dB, which alters the "attack" feeling)

Then maybe give RG4 another chance.

Thanks for taking the trouble to share. Appreciated.

Casting my mind back, it's the strum in RG4 that sounds less convincing, especially when I've got both of NI's Session Guitars to fall back on, which are top stuff.

But the Solo guitar in RG4 always did sound quite good, and maybe I should experiment with my post production, as you suggest.

Like everyone else here, I reach too easily for a new bit of kit, instead of making better or more original use of what I've already got.

btw And now it's been mentioned, Realitone & Donkey Tugger seem lifelong mates, marriage made in heaven. Leeds meets the Deep South.

I always like reali-demos, but I can't quite get over the guy-next-door jovial salesman presenter as a serious muso, even tho he prob knows miles more than me

[kevvvvv]

David

Here's a longer Peel demo, plus a bunch of other libraries I enjoy:
https://soundcloud.com/david-coffin/peeldemoplus

"A quick demo of my favorite acoustic Guitar Sample libraries for fingerpicking, all running a little MIDI loop from Realitone's Fingerpicking, transposed in various ways to showcase different registers in each instrument. These are, in order:
Spitfire's Peel Guitar
Realitone's Acoustic Lite (sounds slightly better to me than Fingerpicking itself, but just a bit)
Orangetree's Evolution
Haephestos" Jacks' Guitar (nylon…)
IKMultimedia's American Acoustic
Omnisphere 2's Fingerstyle Acoustic 6-string (transposed a bit more since it's laid out over the entire keyboard)
Ample's M Free
AcousticSamples's Sunbird
PrecisionSound's Owerland Guitar"

Cool - thanks for this comparison.

To my surprise, I liked the freebies best

And the Sunbird.

Choosing a bland awful midi file was a great idea for setting all the guitars off against each other.

It's "no hiding place" music

cheers = kev

[donkey tugger]

btw And now it's been mentioned, Realitone & Donkey Tugger seem lifelong mates, marriage made in heaven. Leeds meets the Deep South.

Yorkshire has been compared to Texas before...

Whilst on the subject (of acoustic guitar, not rednecks), if you're wanting realistic guitar strumming/picking but not wanting to mic yours up then this is an option;

http://www.yourockguitar.com

I took a bit of a gamble and bought one. Looks horrible, not great for anything 'lead' as you need to use the whammy bar (or add pitch info afterwards), and takes a bit of getting used to, but for picking and strumming it's spot on. As there's no actual strings on the fretboard (the raised plastic 'strings' are surprisingly easy to adapt to) so the tracking is unnervingly accurate and fast so you can to all intents and purposes play it like a real guitar at low latency.

You'll not get any of the strumming engines produce anything quite as realistically sloppy as this without a great deal of programming ;

http://www.bennyleeds7.myfreeola.uk/sunbirdstrum.mp3

[Compyfox]

Here's a longer Peel demo, plus a bunch of other libraries I enjoy:
https://soundcloud.com/david-coffin/peeldemoplus

Thanks for that quick demo.

I must say, "Peel" sounds really dark with that amped sound.
Realitone and OTS are a bit "strange" in tuning with the fret position switch
Jack's guitar... is a bit jumpy, but I'm interested in the "percussion mode" *hm...*
Omnisphere sounds very synthetic
Ample M sounds it was recorded in a boxy room with strange reverb
Soundbird sounds interesting, but has strong attack sounds

All in all - interesting comparison. Thanks for the work.
An nice photo on Soundcloud.

Whilst on the subject (of acoustic guitar, not rednecks), if you're wanting realistic guitar strumming/picking but not wanting to mic yours up then this is an option;

I listened to the audio demo - but honestly... does this thing not forward dynamics properly? Each strum sounds the same in terms of velocity, strange attack even. Reminds me of my first attempts with Musiclab's RealGuitar... kind of suprised, not in a good way though.

Casting my mind back, it's the strum in RG4 that sounds less convincing, especially when I've got both of NI's Session Guitars to fall back on, which are top stuff.

But the Solo guitar in RG4 always did sound quite good, and maybe I should experiment with my post production, as you suggest.

I can help with that (still). And once more - obvious disclaimer (thanks to "some" recent events here on KVR)



DISCLAIMER - I am not trying to sell anybody anything. I'm merely trying to help, give tips and tricks as longtime user.



Now that this is out of the door, two links to two posts of mine from November last year:
viewtopic.php?p=6616617#p6616617
viewtopic.php?p=6624929#p6624929

Somebody wanted to recreate "Hey there Delilah" by Plain White T's in RealGuitar v3, but didn't know how. I tried to help and explain which route could be taken. The second post links to a quick demo I cobbled together with "Engine 4" (RGv4) within 1 hour of work, slapped on an EQ and compressor, edited the Humanize engine a bit and be done.

The ZIP file (still online at the time of this post!) includes an A/B demo of "Non-Humanized" and "Humanized". Since the song is mostly chords, I think this shows very well how much this new feature adds to chord play - if tuned right. Running the tracks side by side makes the effect even more obvious.

This feature is what was missing in RG all the years prior, and where AmpleSound succeeded the time they showed up (due to the random sample position trigger).

But YMMV.

I always like reali-demos, but I can't quite get over the guy-next-door jovial salesman presenter as a serious muso, even tho he prob knows miles more than me

There are worse people out there...

[kevvvvv]

compyfox

You are a Real Guitar God

[Compyfox]

I take it you'll give RG4 another spin.


Other than that... I'm no "Real Guitar God", just well acquainted with the engine. I mean... you've been with it since v1 as well... so how long has it been? 10+ years? (actually, 13 years - v1 came out April 2004)