Fear And Loathing At The SoundsOnline Forum

[z15]

yeah, all the information is pretty dim and shady to say the least. can't judge anyone and don't really want to.

i'm just starting to get really angry at the constant bullsh*t talking and rudeness that's been going on among the orchestral sample developers and users in these forums... why can't people just be fair and honest, stop being greedy and either solve their mutual troubles privately or act like adults and professionals they should be? sigh.

[Brahms & Liszt]

That having been said, all that seems to be in the document is Doug Rogers demanding:

"With reference to the GPO vs Silver sales comment you posted on our forum I need to know your real name, your real email address and who you work for.

"Please respond as soon as you get this.

"Thanks,

"- Doug"

Now, hang on just a minute. It's about more than the PM.

Suppose you made a post in one of the developer forums here. You mention in passing that although you prefer the developer's Product X, Product Y (made by another developer), outsells it.

Next time you log into that forum there's a PM from the developer demanding to know your real name, e-mail and employer's details.

You decline to supply the information and next day you find that all your posts in KVR have been deleted and your account no longer exists.

You'd find that acceptable behaviour?

I don't think so.

[Brahms & Liszt]

It definitely makes you appreciate k-v-r.

My thoughts exactly.

[herodotus]

That having been said, all that seems to be in the document is Doug Rogers demanding:

"With reference to the GPO vs Silver sales comment you posted on our forum I need to know your real name, your real email address and who you work for.

"Please respond as soon as you get this.

"Thanks,

"- Doug"

Now, hang on just a minute. It's about more than the PM.

Suppose you made a post in one of the developer forums here. You mention in passing that although you prefer the developer's Product X, Product Y (made by another developer), outsells it.

Next time you log into that forum there's a PM from the developer demanding to know your real name, e-mail and employer's details.

You decline to supply the information and next day you find that all your posts in KVR have been deleted and your account no longer exists.

You'd find that acceptable behaviour?

I don't think so.

Well of course, it is privately maintained web space, so what is 'acceptable' is up to the owner.

That being said, this sort of foolishness will eventually come back to haunt the developers who engage in it.

I mean, just imagine if instead of a developer it was a musician:

"We demand to know where you heard that records by another band sold better than records by our band. Tell us some personal information or we will ban you from this mp3 hosting site."

They would be laughed off the internet.

[Armadillo]

welcome to kvr Brahms & Liszt.

So you have joined kvr with the sole intention of telling us how crappy East West are.

How many other forums have you joined today?

[Markleford]

So you have joined kvr with the sole intention of telling us how crappy East West are.

How many other forums have you joined today?

Yeah, that's how it's going to be for a while: people jumping ship, spreading news of ill treatment, and fragmentation into new "truly free speech" forums. But those will either degenerate into being a New Regime (as seems EW) or will be so lawless that nothing productive will be discussed and people will look elsewhere (as have others already forgotten).

There's definitely a balance to be struck. I like to think KVR is doing well at it. It *is* for the best when multiple vendors are on the same forum, so that cross-pollenation of ideas happens.

But some people just can't handle the very concept that different products are better for different people with different needs, so in come the elitist trolls to stir the pot: "Your library is crap! I don't care if you like using it and have fun and get work done, IT'S STILL CRAP!"

I can definitely see some call to delete that sort of noise, but moderators have to understand the gravity of hitting "delete".

- m

[Frunobulax]

I can definitely see some call to delete that sort of noise, but moderators have to understand the gravity of hitting "delete".

Agreed, where some action has to be taken, simply locking threads is far preferable in most circumstances. Deleting threads or messages is almost like denying that what was said in them ever happened in the first place, and it often gives the appearance of being (and often times probably is) a heavy-handed attempt to silence people with a viewpoint that might be contrary to the commercial interests of the website. That said, I do not think people should treat a website operated by a developer as a completely open forum, unless that developer maintains a section for what appears to be an open discussion. It's fine to be critical so long as it's done in the context of the purpose of those types of forums. That's a problem with NSS--it appears to be an open forum until you read the rules and observe what happens there over a period of time.

Plus I don't want to suggest that the editing of messages is never warranted. Both here and elsewhere, I have seen messages edited by a mod for reasons I had no problem with, but deleting entire threads as a regular practice is another thing. Websites can do what they want, but they need to accept the criticism that comes along with these actions.

And yes, KVR rocks.

[jeffn1]

I can definitely see some call to delete that sort of noise, but moderators have to understand the gravity of hitting "delete".

Agreed, where some action has to be taken, simply locking threads is far preferable in most circumstances. Deleting threads or messages is almost like denying that what was said in them ever happened in the first place, and it often gives the appearance of being (and often times probably is) a heavy-handed attempt to silence people with a viewpoint that might be contrary to the commercial interests of the website. That said, I do not think people should treat a website operated by a developer as a completely open forum, unless that developer maintains a section for what appears to be an open discussion. It's fine to be critical so long as it's done in the context of the purpose of those types of forums. That's a problem with NSS--it appears to be an open forum until you read the rules and observe what happens there over a period of time.

Plus I don't want to suggest that the editing of messages is never warranted. Both here and elsewhere, I have seen messages edited by a mod for reasons I had no problem with, but deleting entire threads as a regular practice is another thing. Websites can do what they want, but they need to accept the criticism that comes along with these actions.

And yes, KVR rocks.

I think most of the time, the moderator does not need to take any action. People will respond most of the time to debunk the bullshit. Also, after a while, you get to know the people in the forum whose judgment you trust.

It is not perfect, but I generally prefer this to heavy monitoring by moderators.

jeffn1

[Spe3D]

Who needs an orchestra, when you can play and Black n Decker

Best regards,

Spe3d

:O)

[bduffy]

Man this reminds me of that scene in "Anchorman: The Legend of Ron Burgundy", where all the newscasters have a street rumble - except picture sample library authors...

[vurt]

ben,can i be put down for kvrs first scandal please?

[Z3R0T0N1N]

That having been said, all that seems to be in the document is Doug Rogers demanding:

"With reference to the GPO vs Silver sales comment you posted on our forum I need to know your real name, your real email address and who you work for.

"Please respond as soon as you get this.

"Thanks,

"- Doug"

frankly, that is enough to give me some serious pause about ever dealing with them. And the deleting of all posts by B&L is quite telling. It means that you can't possibly trust anything they might say about why he was banned.
Just my opinion

[Markleford]

ben,can i be put down for kvrs first scandal please?

Well BONES tried to make a scandal of the time I locked yet another inane Mac vs PC thread that had inevitably proven its uselessness.

And there was the time that someone (spaceman?) was posting on the Cakewalk forums how KVR supports warez and is just a den of pirates.

And then there's the scandal where KVR hosts forums for several popular small software companies that FREELY give out support and tips for their products, including links to DOWNLOADS, allowing people to actually make music which they post for FREE outside of larcenous COPYRIGHT! Gasp! Unheard of!

- m

[herodotus]

And there was the time that someone (spaceman?) was posting on the Cakewalk forums how KVR supports warez and is just a den of pirates.


- m

Actually spaceman was accused of stuff on the cakewalk forum and they were making the statements about kvr being all evil and warezy.

I don't know anyone involved. I just remember the threads (a slooooow day at work that day).

[Squids]

Did anyone like the movie Fear & Loathing in Las Vegas? I didn't really like it that much but maybe the second time you watch it is different. When I saw the Big Lebowski the first time I had no idea what a classic it really was.

Oh, sorry, did I change the subject? I was drawn in by the interesting thread title. Weird stuff.