Synth Bank Prices

[macalister]

Well guys, we collected in all (Single patches & Multis), about 23,000 new Pro Patches ready to go, brand new and HQ created @ last 5 or so months using only Omni, yes, we have 23,000 user patches, not bad right? now we are thinking in a cool packaging...so good as OMNI

23,000 patches? 23,000 diff sounds? i doubt that very much.

Even in basic VA synths with a 128# set a LOT of the sounds are so similar its not even funny....slight variations yes, but you could get those variations by accidently knocking the mouse with you hand...

Yes, all this patches collected from 32 guys around US & Europe (France, Germany, Spain & Italy ), programmed using of course Omni soundsource and our "made in home" Software OwnCode to use Wav. format as soundsource, is not easy to explain but tweaking a little Omni to open Wav format from the browser and mix them with soundsources from the original library, so basically we used two computers as a bridge to open the samples from the third one (sounds confuse but its simple), then broken it up and process all ours samples from Omni, amazing sounds, I hope one day , some day in the future Omnisphere could work with samples, as did it with us experiment,

Thanks

[synthmanDS]

The soft synth market is like the stock market in a lot of ways. There a lot of wheeling and dealing going on in a broad market landscape. A visit to the marketplace on any given hour shows just how active the deal making and trading is!

From a mass consumer perspective, the sweet spot for 3rd party sound banks base on 11 pages of feedback is about $15-$20 a set which is where I generally fall as well. A lot of sound developers (and synth for that matter) unfortunately let their pride and inaccurate value perception get in the way of good business sense. On the other side, developers shouldn't just have to give away their stuff away either (though wont complain if they do).

Once the work is done though, the name of the game is to move it. The best way to do this is at large volume obviously, by pricing it in the "sweet spot" which is better in the long run. Chances are sound banks are more likely to move double, triple or more at $15-20, than $40-$50. Where I come from, selling 3 units at $60 more frequently than 1 unit at $40 or more quite infrequently is greater revenue!

Also, you have to take into account the natural curve of product cycles which is never constant no matter what the price is or product. This is why many devs have introductory offers, raises the price, then should drops the price on blow out when the product is flat. A lot of developers are selling sound banks and products that are several years old for the same price as when it was introduced which in a lot of cases are inflated by todays market value.

The notion that a sound bank has to be priced high to be good is false. I've picked up banks inexpensively that I couldn't be more happy with. Its not the pricing, it's the person who is doing the work that makes it good!

[Shabdahbriah]

Where I come from, selling 3 units at $60 more frequently than 1 unit at $40 or more quite infrequently is greater revenue!

That even makes sense, where "I" come from.

[Lotuzia]

The soft synth market is like the stock market in a lot of ways. There a lot of wheeling and dealing going on in a broad market landscape. A visit to the marketplace on any given hour shows just how active the deal making and trading is!

From a mass consumer perspective, the sweet spot for 3rd party sound banks base on 11 pages of feedback is about $15-$20 a set which is where I generally fall as well. A lot of sound developers (and synth for that matter) unfortunately let their pride and inaccurate value perception get in the way of good business sense. On the other side, developers shouldn't just have to give away their stuff away either (though wont complain if they do).

Once the work is done though, the name of the game is to move it. The best way to do this is at large volume obviously, by pricing it in the "sweet spot" which is better in the long run. Chances are sound banks are more likely to move double, triple or more at $15-20, than $40-$50. Where I come from, selling 3 units at $60 more frequently than 1 unit at $40 or more quite infrequently is greater revenue!

Also, you have to take into account the natural curve of product cycles which is never constant no matter what the price is or product. This is why many devs have introductory offers, raises the price, then should drops the price on blow out when the product is flat. A lot of developers are selling sound banks and products that are several years old for the same price as when it was introduced which in a lot of cases are inflated by todays market value.

The notion that a sound bank has to be priced high to be good is false. I've picked up banks inexpensively that I couldn't be more happy with. Its not the pricing, it's the person who is doing the work that makes it good!

Actually the price of a soundbank depends on a factor just called ROI. You invest time in a soundbank, and sales should at least pay the time spent. My avarage time per preset retained is quite slow (around 30/40mn per preset including the making of the audio demos/manuals aso).

The more the synth grows in complexity, the more time is spent on a preset ( Like Alchemy with its 8 remix pads/variations + the time spent to create the sources eventually ), the more expensive the soundbank will be. Its as simple as that.

For old soundbanks, ime they sell the same ammount than banks "only" 6 months old. Not counting people who crave "vintage" patches like myself ( Hey they never die ) you have to consider that music that was made last year or two years ago is not always bad, that once the supersaw hype is over you'll be a bit annoyed with all your supersaw presets, and that a good instrument just stays a good instrument some years later ( See the Vox Humana preset, or the Mellotron afficionados, even after "all these years )

Then, very expensive soundbanks are not always the best thats very true, and free or very cheap soundbanks can be very good as well. Its just that people selling very cheap AND very good products won't, unfortunately, stay alive in the long term. Just because their ROI is way too low

So that in the end you're perfectly right imho, the person ho is doing the work does matter indeed. A good business plan wont probably harm both user and the company though. Offering quality products at the right price is a good goal imho. In any case its ours

fwiw,

LtZ

[brok landers]

A lot of sound developers (and synth for that matter) unfortunately let their pride and inaccurate value perception get in the way of good business sense.

sorry, that's a pure non-valid allegation, at least for my part as well as for the other sounddesigners i know.

@lotuzia:
don't tell the users that the time you need for a patch is on the slow side. you're actually quite fast (not to say, for a good sounddesigner , it's actually way below the average)!

[tasmaniandevil]

@lotuzia:
don't tell the users that the time you need for a patch is on the slow side. you're actually quite fast (not to say, for a good sounddesigner , it's actually way below the average)!

Yep, totally agreed. I'd be very happy if I would get sounds done in that average time. I somehow can't get a patch done in a single rush, usually have to work on it for several times until I'm happy with how it sounds, how it plays and what the midi-controllers, xy pads or macro-controllers do.

[Arglebargle]

$20 or less is fair to me for a quality bank.

[C.Bennett]

$20 is the sweet spot for me too. Spent much more and spent less over the years but $20 gets me into PayPal without thinking. Sure, some soundbanks are worth a lot more but from a buyers perspective, $20 is where it's at. No-brainer territory if the demo sounds good.

[Lotuzia]

A lot of sound developers (and synth for that matter) unfortunately let their pride and inaccurate value perception get in the way of good business sense.

sorry, that's a pure non-valid allegation, at least for my part as well as for the other sounddesigners i know.

@lotuzia:
don't tell the users that the time you need for a patch is on the slow side. you're actually quite fast (not to say, for a good sounddesigner , it's actually way below the average)!

Thanks Brok

I'm also a preset addict, and have been a fan of your work for a lOooong lonng time ( as for the audio demos )

LtZ

[Lotuzia]

@lotuzia:
don't tell the users that the time you need for a patch is on the slow side. you're actually quite fast (not to say, for a good sounddesigner , it's actually way below the average)!

Yep, totally agreed. I'd be very happy if I would get sounds done in that average time. I somehow can't get a patch done in a single rush, usually have to work on it for several times until I'm happy with how it sounds, how it plays and what the midi-controllers, xy pads or macro-controllers do.

Hi TasmanianDevil,

Yeah 30/40 mn per preset can be seen as quick, but actually I think it will surprise most of the musicians who do use our instruments.

I however increased a lot my own efficiency over years, and one of the things that helped me is to finish more presets in a single row, while before I was merely taking 2/3 or even more rounds to complete them. So what does this mean in real work : While crafting a preset, I now think of all the possible modulations that I find suitable for this preset, including of course real time "invisible" mods, but also the mod wheel-AFT-BC, eventually the XY remix pads, or the ..... devilish 8 remix pads of Alchemy for example.

Of course this is not true for all instruments for all synths. Sometimes reviewing a preset twice, or polishing it after some days, will bring some new ideas that might not have emerged when the first incarnation was beeing built.

The second thing that certainly helped me was some short pauses during sound design sessions, and to get rid of long exhausting 8 hours runs. I finally found out that, in my case, making breaks and refreshing ears and taking the time to pause to develop new concepts and ideas without producing any sound, was far more productive.

Might be just me tough

Anyway I did enjoy your patches for ACE

LtZ

[tasmaniandevil]

Yeah 30/40 mn per preset can be seen as quick, but actually I think it will surprise most of the musicians who do use our instruments.

Yup, I also think that many of the users who don't have the time for it or simply are not interested in sound-design might have a somewhat false impression about the time and effort it takes to create good sounds.

I however increased a lot my own efficiency over years, and one of the things that helped me is to finish more presets in a single row, while before I was merely taking 2/3 or even more rounds to complete them. So what does this mean in real work : While crafting a preset, I now think of all the possible modulations that I find suitable for this preset, including of course real time "invisible" mods, but also the mod wheel-AFT-BC, eventually the XY remix pads, or the ..... devilish 8 remix pads of Alchemy for example

Thanks for your tips. Efficiency is a main thing I have to work on. And I have to learn to simply let it be at one point because I almost always find something to change or add on my sounds every time I play them. That's costing a lot of time.
And breaks are really important, that's so true.

Anyway I did enjoy your patches for ACE

Thanks a lot.

[brok landers]

@lotuzia:
don't tell the users that the time you need for a patch is on the slow side. you're actually quite fast (not to say, for a good sounddesigner , it's actually way below the average)!

Yep, totally agreed. I'd be very happy if I would get sounds done in that average time. I somehow can't get a patch done in a single rush, usually have to work on it for several times until I'm happy with how it sounds, how it plays and what the midi-controllers, xy pads or macro-controllers do.

but that's how it has to be. nothing from nothing leaves nothing. some peeps here don't seem to understand the effort necessary for quality patches. if the banks i do would sellout for such a price suggested here by some users, i wouldn't do them, no second thought. honestly, for those who are not willing to pay good money for good patches i say: go and do them yourself. end of the story. however, fortunateley i can say that these price suggestions are by far not reality for good patch sets, as well as they're not taken over by the developers i usually work with. these guys understood that exellent patches is one of the most important sellingpoints for a good synth, and it certainly pays off for them. i'm happy for most professional developers gladly paying my price. on the other hand, they know what they get in return. a synth with 256-512 exeptional patches is worth more than a synth with 2000 average semiprofessional patches, which is the case with quite a lot of synths. in the long run these synths won't survive unless the synth is exeptionally good and so easy to be edited, that the average preset user could do his own patches with it in no time.
however, i'm happy that kvr is everything else than representative.

[brok landers]

A lot of sound developers (and synth for that matter) unfortunately let their pride and inaccurate value perception get in the way of good business sense.

sorry, that's a pure non-valid allegation, at least for my part as well as for the other sounddesigners i know.

@lotuzia:
don't tell the users that the time you need for a patch is on the slow side. you're actually quite fast (not to say, for a good sounddesigner , it's actually way below the average)!

Thanks Brok

I'm also a preset addict, and have been a fan of your work for a lOooong lonng time ( as for the audio demos )

LtZ

no need to thank me, honour to whom honour is due.

[VitaminD]

$20 is the sweet spot for me too. Spent much more and spent less over the years but $20 gets me into PayPal without thinking. Sure, some soundbanks are worth a lot more but from a buyers perspective, $20 is where it's at. No-brainer territory if the demo sounds good.

Completely agree. $20 is my max for a bank of 128. Especially these days when one can get a whole new synth/sound generator for 40 or 50..


I see a lot of soundbanks selling for 30-40 dollars, which I find ridiculous -- I can buy a sound bank.. or an entirely new synth for roughly the same money. Obviously I'd buy the new synth, which will come with a soundbank..

[mellotronaut]

some peeps here don't seem to understand the effort necessary for quality patches.

i don't think, you're right here, but people tend to overestimate their kind of work compared to the work, others do, e.g. synth programmers or musicians.

if the banks i do would sellout for such a price suggested here by some users, i wouldn't do them, no second thought. honestly, for those who are not willing to pay good money for good patches i say: go and do them yourself. end of the story.

... weil ich es mir wert bin ... .



anyway, there is no soundbank with 100% (in most cases not even 70%)good or excellent stuff and nobody needs all the sounds included in one bank anyway.

Nonetheless i appreciate your work, Brok, Laurent and Tasmodia and from time to time i buy a soundbank.

me