What is the difference between music and noise? [years-dead slappyfight revived]

[vurt]

i would suggest, some merzbow, some stockhausen and also the book/cd handmade electronic music by nicolas collins.
the ohm 3 cd set with dvd is worth grabbing too.

This is an interesting method - "conditioning"... i.e. coming closer to what other people and musicians think music is... or think is music too... but how does this help? It's still relative AND it is putting meaning in temporal move!

im not so much trying to condition ed, i just think with that package he may have a better understanding of where some of us "noise lovers" are coming from, plus considering the noise history book he was looking to purchase, some refernce would imo be essential.

the ohm collection, as well as having some interesting noise based compositions, have plenty of less esoteric stuff that i think ed would enjoy (as would most people interested in synthesis of any kind)

[debra1rlo]

I don't think noise is commonly, if ever, used as a positive term.

x infinity.

x infinity +1

sure, ed, Sonic Youth and MBV agree with you on that one.

[vurt]

Challenge: Fifteen Snip-n-Save MeffyBux(tm) for anyone who can make a "word ladder" turning MUSIC to NOISE by changing one letter at a time, each step leading to a valid English word. This will give us an invaluable* metric for determining the exact difference between the two.

[example from Genesis' "Supper's Ready": Mum to Mud to Mad to Dad.
___________________________
* Note: Meffy isn't very smart and thinks this word means "worthless."

its a pointless task, similar in my mind to turning water to ice essentially theyre the same thing.

so ill go with 0.01 deg c. for those in the know

[vurt]

I don't think noise is commonly, if ever, used as a positive term.

x infinity.

x infinity +1

sure, ed, Sonic Youth and MBV agree with you on that one.

hmm, you think merzbow was maybe going a bit far?
although sonic youth are on the ohm collection so i didnt miss completely

[debra1rlo]

I don't think noise is commonly, if ever, used as a positive term.

x infinity.

x infinity +1

sure, ed, Sonic Youth and MBV agree with you on that one.

hmm, you think merzbow was maybe going a bit far?
although sonic youth are on the ohm collection so i didnt miss completely

um, going too far, in that his head might explode?

possibly, but it's a good thing.

[Km7]

vurt, you can surprise the listener, etc. still making sense, otherwise you could think it's music, but the listener could think it's just noise. Sure, you can do that, though I personally would prefer to do it temporarily in the piece, not the whole piece. But in the end, you decide what 'laws' to obey, which shapes your compositional language.

[vurt]

vurt, you can surprise the listener, etc. still making sense. But in the end, you decide what 'laws' to obey, which would shape your music, style, etc.

ok then, what if i want a listener to approach me at the end of the show and say "what the f**k was that? i cant feel my toes!"

or what if as is normal for me, i couldnt give a feck what the listener thinks or feels? once ive recorded my ideas im done, they are what they are, my art.

[Km7]

But the "what the f**k was that? i cant feel my toes!" reaction could be achieved through various means - tonal, atonal, modal, polytonal, serial, aleatoric, etc., etc.

If you are happy with your ideas and that's what you want to do, then it's all fine. And I would encourage you to do it, since this is you.

[vurt]

And I would encourage you to do it, since this is you.

thats it, take away my final act of rebellion in my dotage.
if everyone goes round supporting my intentions how can i fight back against the masses?
bloody dichotomies, im off to record a pop ballad

[whyterabbyt]

if everyone goes round supporting my intentions how can i fight back against the masses?

AK47

[vurt]

if everyone goes round supporting my intentions how can i fight back against the masses?

AK47

too unreliable, i guess i should nuke it from orbit, just to be sure...

[Meffy]

bloody dichotomies, im off to record a pop ballad :x

Don't do it, vurt. The minuet and the chaconne need you.

[Km7]

[TiUser]

...let's try to put it simpler...

If you have nothing to do and see your favorite racing car, making this beautiful roaring sound - then this it's music... because you can enjoy it. But if you have something really important to do where you need to concentrate and the same car is at your window making the same roaring sound you can't enjoy it - it's noise then...

Rules and laws are usually not the first thing around - they come when you analyze something that's already there... trying to find out how it works, which elements make it the thing it is...

[jopy]

ah, this is beautiful music to me: