KVR Audio

Ingonator · Post by **Ingonator** » Fri Oct 14, 2016 1:27 pm

I am currently also re-checking NI The Maverick (included in Komplete 10, based on samples of an old Bechstein grand piano) that i had not used for some weeks (so far The Grandeur and Alicia's Keys were my favorite NI pianos).

UPDATE:
I added a demo of The Maverick to the comparison in my previous post.

Here are 3 more demos using NI The Maverick:
Jordan Rudess - Grand Illusion_The Maverick
Beethoven - Moonlight Sonata mvt.1_The Maverick
Debussy - Clair De Lune_The Maverick

Clair De Lune i also included in the official demos for the new official Bechstein library:
https://www.bechstein-digital.com/

Ingonator · Post by **Ingonator** » Sat Oct 15, 2016 9:25 am

Concerning the upcoming Wavesfactory Mecury there seems to be some news at their Facebook page:
https://www.facebook.com/wavesfactory

There will be no pre order as I tested it and it wasn't working 100%, so in order to avoid misunderstandings I decided to do a good intro offer once the product is out.

Little time's left, Mercury's on the way! We're pleased to announce that we'll use the Continuata downloader for the fastest and most comfortable download experience

So no pre-order but an intro price instead.

Ingonator · Post by **Ingonator** » Sat Oct 15, 2016 11:29 am

Interesting piano comparison thhread here, including a MIDI file:
https://www.gearslutz.com/board/music-c ... otout.html

videos are available too:

That VI Labs Ravenscroft 275 sounds quite impressive and is quite reasonable concerning the needed HD space.
For that piano there is no competing library avaiiable so far.

Website for the real thing:
http://www.ravenscroftpianos.com/275.php

Base price $280,000 USD.

Ingonator · Post by **Ingonator** » Sat Oct 15, 2016 1:06 pm

While comaring teh MP3 of the Ravencroft 275 from the thread mentioend above to Alicia's Keys renderd by myself using the provided MIDI file i found that at least for this specific MIDI file both seem to have a comparable overall sound character and in parts of the track inded could sound quite similar.

Based on this as i like the sound of Alicia's Keys i am quite sure i would also really like that of the Ravenscroft 275 (same is true based on some other demos of it i listened to).

fmr · Post by **fmr** » Sat Oct 15, 2016 3:35 pm

Ingonator wrote:Interesting piano comparison thhread here, including a MIDI file:
https://www.gearslutz.com/board/music-c ... otout.html

That piece shows nothing special about what a piano can do. It's just a dull ballad piano accompaniment. Basically any reasonable piano library will be able to play this in a more or less good way, I guess. This isn't the best piece to judge a piano, IMO.

BTW: I loved the sound of the East West Quantum Leap Pianos, especially the Bechstein and the Steinway, although this isn't exactly a piece to showcase their full potential.

modularg2 · Post by **modularg2** » Sat Oct 15, 2016 9:10 pm

Ravenscroft 275 top-notch. Best choice for me,the one I've got indeed.

Fleer · Post by **Fleer** » Sun Oct 16, 2016 2:59 am

Ingonator wrote:Concerning the upcoming Wavesfactory Mecury there seems to be some news at their Facebook page:
https://www.facebook.com/wavesfactory

There will be no pre order as I tested it and it wasn't working 100%, so in order to avoid misunderstandings I decided to do a good intro offer once the product is out.

Little time's left, Mercury's on the way! We're pleased to announce that we'll use the Continuata downloader for the fastest and most comfortable download experience
So no pre-order but an intro price instead.

Anxiously looking forward to this

logburner · Post by **logburner** » Sun Oct 16, 2016 3:29 am

Fleer wrote:
Ingonator wrote:Concerning the upcoming Wavesfactory Mecury there seems to be some news at their Facebook page:
https://www.facebook.com/wavesfactory

There will be no pre order as I tested it and it wasn't working 100%, so in order to avoid misunderstandings I decided to do a good intro offer once the product is out.

Little time's left, Mercury's on the way! We're pleased to announce that we'll use the Continuata downloader for the fastest and most comfortable download experience
So no pre-order but an intro price instead.
Anxiously looking forward to this

I have a feeling that this library is going to be the best sounding virtual piano in today's market.

Ingonator · Post by **Ingonator** » Sun Oct 16, 2016 8:24 am

modularg2 wrote:Ravenscroft 275 top-notch. Best choice for me,the one I've got indeed.

Well, somehow i wanted the VI Labs Ravencroft 275 for a while, also based on the audio demos, videos and many postive comments about it. Instead of that i recently got a few cheaper libraries (inclsuing Alicia's Keys second hand for a very low price) that are good but not the same quality and/or sound character as the Ravenscroft 275.

I hesitated also due to the price but yesterday evening i finally decided to buy it!!!

Paid around 187 € (after conversion, no additional VAT was added to the original price). Installed the license to my iLok 2 key.
Alraedy installed it and started playing with it and it is indeed really great.

So far i could say that no other of te pinao libraries i used so far (and created demos with) sounds really similar (while Alicia's KEys sounds somehow comparable at the softer tones).

This is the first really expensive single library i ever bought and maybe i will sell one or two of the other pianos soon. I already deinstalled some i no longer need for doing demos. Alicia's Keys as as second hand license is NFR (while it was only 37 € and i want to keep it anyway) and the other NI pianos were part of Komplete 10 (standard version). Arturia Piano V was part of the V-Collection 5 (quite sure i would not have paid the current full price of the single product for it wich currently is teh same as teh Ravenscroft 275).

As this uses the UVI sample/library library format (*.UFS file), while it is crteated by VI Labs and not UVI, it is also compatible with UVI Falcon which i alraedy checked and it works there. It could be fully inregrated into tehynth engine including e.g. filters, effects, modulation and layers with other osc modules. Normally it is used in the free UVI Workstation plugin (or standalone).
The comressed UFS file has a size of 5.32 GB which is a reasonable amount.

After i started tweaking it a bit i already created audio demos (like with the demos i posted for other pianos) and will post them here soon.

Ingonator · Post by **Ingonator** » Sun Oct 16, 2016 11:25 am

As mentioend above i finally got the VI Labs Ravenscroft 275 piano library yesterday evening. That library is based on samples of a Ravenscroft 275 Titanium 9' (275 cm) concert grand piano and seemed to be created with official permission and also in cooperation of the original piano company called Spreeman Piano Innovations. The most expesnive model of the real thing currently goes up to a price of 550,000$, starting at around 280,000$ base price (!!).

Like with the other pianos i used/own i have created audio demos of the Ravenscroft 275. Also due to owning this less than one day those are of course not fully optimized in terms of both piano settings and the MIDI files yet. While there are 4 mic positions for the first demos i only used the "Close" mic which should represent the "fullest" and/or more pure sound.
Only small adjustments were made to the basic settings including slightly reducing the "Dynamic" parameter and having a slightly harder velocity curve. Also the pedal nois was reduced. There are really several options to adjust the sound, including the differnt mic positions and a freely drawable velocity curve so the current demos represent a specific setup. FWIW reducing the "Dynamic" value further could also boost the low end.

So here are the demos using the "Close" mic position (moderate amounts of the Waves H-Comp compressor and Lexicon MXRnative reverb were used, no EQ was used):
Beethoven - Moonlight Sonata mvt.1_Ravenscroft 275 Close
Beethoven - Moonlight Sonata mvt.3_Ravenscroft 275 Close
Beethoven - Appassionata mvt.1_Ravenscroft 275 Close
Beethoven - Appassionata mvt.3_Ravenscroft 275 Close
Beethoven - Für Elise_Ravenscroft 275 Close
Mozart - Turkish March, KV331 mvt.3_Ravenscroft 275 Close
Mozart - Piano Sonata No. 16 , KV545 mvt.1_Ravenscroft 275 Close
Debussy - Clair De Lune_Ravenscroft 275 Close
Chopin - Nocturne Op 27 #2_Ravenscroft 275 Close
Chopin - Fantasie, Op 66_Ravenscroft 275 Close
Chopin - Op 39_Ravenscroft 275 Close
Rachmaninov - Prelude Opus 3 No.2_Ravenscroft 275 Close
Jordan Rudess - Grand Illusion_Ravenscroft 275 Close
Piano Shootout MIDI file_Ravenscroft 275 Close

Here are 6 of those demos without the external Lexicon MXR Native reverb (and also no built-in one):
Beethoven - Moonlight Sonata mvt.1_Ravenscroft 275 Close + no Reverb
Beethoven - Appassionata mvt.1_Ravenscroft 275 Close + no Reverb
Rachmaninov - Prelude Opus 3 No.2_Ravenscroft 275 Close_no Reverb
Debussy - Clair De Lune_Ravenscroft 275_Close + no Reverb
Chopin - Nocturne Op 27 #2_Ravenscroft 275_Close + no Reverb
Jordan Rudess - Grand Illusion_Ravenscroft 275_Close + no Reverb

Ingonator · Post by **Ingonator** » Mon Oct 17, 2016 9:59 am

Due to having just bought the VI Labs Ravenscroft 275 and recently also Alicia'S Keys, XLN Addictive Keys Studio Grand and Imperfect Samples Fazioli Ebony Grand Baisc it is highly unlikely that i will buy an ynew piano library in the near future (including teh uopcoming Wavesfactory Mercury no matter how good it will be).
At the moment it is time to get full use of what i currently got, especially teh Ravenscroft 275.
There were multiple comments that this is the best piano library so far. I have not tested all of them so i am not sure if this is true but it sounds impressive for sure and offers multiple options to tweak the sound which makes it quite versatile (as in parts also shown in my demos above).

Those are the ones i am vey sure i will keep:
- VI Labs Ravenscroft 275
- NI Alicia's Keys
- NI The Grandeur (+ the others included in Komplete 10 Standard)
- Imperfect Samples Fazioli Ebony Basic
- Arturia Piano V (inckluded in V-Colection V)

Alicia'S Keys was second hand and is NFR now (while it was quite cheap and i like it for sure) and both The Grandeur and Piano V are part of bigger plugin collections (Komolete 10 Standard and V-Collection V) so it is unlikely taht i sell any of those anyway.

I have installed True Pianos as currently i do not really have use for it. Posible taht i will sell this.

Not so sure abou XLN studio Grand as it is quite versatile and was quite cheap (sepcial peice at JRR Shop). Anyway it would be possible taht this will be sold too.

Somehow i feel that i should have bought teh Ravenscroft 275 earlier ( i was intersted in this for a whiel already) and maybe just skipped some of the others i got recently.

fmr · Post by **fmr** » Mon Oct 17, 2016 10:09 am

Ingonator wrote: Rachmaninov - Prelude Opus 3 No.2_Ravenscroft 275 Close

Ingo, what MIDI file did you use to make this rendition? This is simply horrible. This isn't my file, and is NOT the Rachmaninoff Prelude. Everything is wrong with the tempi here, to the point of making it unlistenable. Even the dynamics are not quite well, IMO (maybe because of the tempi).

Ingonator · Post by **Ingonator** » Mon Oct 17, 2016 10:14 am

fmr wrote:
Ingonator wrote: Rachmaninov - Prelude Opus 3 No.2_Ravenscroft 275 Close
Ingo, what MIDI file did you use to make this rendition? This is simply horrible. This isn't my file, and is NOT the Rachmaninoff Prelude. Everything is wrong with the tempi here, to the point of making it unlistenable. Even the dynamics are not good, IMO.

Well i wanted to use yours first but there were two tracks included in that file where the first missed the low octaves and the second missed notes in a part of teh track. Was not sure how to use those properly here.

So at the moment i used a MIDI file from another source while of course i could replace it with yours. Anyway the term "unlistenable" is a strong word here. I do not think it is THAT bad.

Besides that there are lots of other demos that shoudl show how teh Ravenscroft 275 sounds.

fmr · Post by **fmr** » Mon Oct 17, 2016 10:36 am

Ingonator wrote: Well i wanted to use yours first but there were two tracks included in that file where the first missed the low octaves and the second missed notes in a part of teh track. Was not sure how to use those properly here.

Tell me what's missing, and I will send you another. But that's strange, because I was able to use it from host to host without problems. There are three tracks in there. One is called "clipping, and you can eliminate it. The second is the right hand (Piano MD), and the third is the left hand (Piano ME). Just point both to the same instrument, since the pedal information is just on one of the tracks. I believe you are using Cubase. If it is, that's pretty much it. If you want, I can send you the Cubase project even.

Ingonator wrote: Anyway the term "unlistenable" is a strong word here. I do not think it is THAT bad.

Sorry, it is THAT bad. When I listen to a file where there almost are no dynamics, the slow tempi are played quite faster (and these are cascades of chords), and the faster tempi are played at half the speed or less, for me it's unlistenable. Just compare it to a real performance.

Ingonator · Post by **Ingonator** » Mon Oct 17, 2016 12:12 pm

^
@fmr:
I updated the Rachmaninov demo using your MIDI file (sending tracks to the same piano instance). Like with some other demos i also added a version without a Reverb now (below the demos taht use teh external Reverb).

Acoustic Grand Piano libraries/emulations: An Overview (audio demos of some pianos added)