Should I buy a DAW or use AI to make my music?

[Aloysius]

I hope BONES won't mind me cutting one sentence out of his post.

There are countless thousands of artists who are better than me, that doesn't stop me from doing my thing.

That makes a lot of sense to me.

[Michael L]

I just asked Bing to produce " a sketch that depicts the emptiness of modern life". I quite like what it came up with

Good example!

They are images made by referencing other images, so they can be called hyperimages

Similar to creating a track entirely from loops and samples -- a task that AI will soon do better, thankfully.

None of them are art or design but hyperobjects one can like, dislike, or be indifferent to.

This thread convinces me that AI is a next-level search engine. It will become better at routine tasks like basic mixing or combining search results, but will have less of a long-term influence than steve-jobs-style AI marketers wildly promise.

But AI could be a challenge to human artists and designers in all media to be less derivative and more innovative!

(But just watch-- audiences will prefer AI-created shit cuz its more familiar.)

[tha_man]

Some time ago people got upset when artists used playback, now we're fine with it.
Then some were upset when producers were using loops, now we're fine with it.
Now some are getting upset as people start to use AI to make their music. Yeah it's still crap, but just give it a few years.

Personally I never performed on playback or used loops and will never use AI to make my music. Not because I think it's cheating, but because I find it boring. I just like making music "the hard way". I get a real kick out of it, when I manage to make a cool sound, beat, bassline, flip a sample or perform live on stage, with power to do whatever I want, not having to lip sync to a fixed recording.

But I do see appeal for people who are just trying to make some easy cash or want to taste some "fame" as a musician, even if they don't really like or want to learn how to make music.

But there are also people, who don't approach music from strictly "musical" standpoint but more as kind of science. Modular users could fit here, especially if they're making generative stuff. Those will not just ask some commercial AI to make a tune for them but might actually program their own AI to make music, which will be their's in a way like they original generative patch is.

In any case, music making will change with the AI (as will many other things), but no one can stop us from doing it the way we like. Or support and listen to other artist that we respect, for any reason we think it matters.

[Jafo]

The proper use of AI is to solve day-to-day problems, to free us so more people can make art. And to make my damn Dwarf Fortress dorfs stop walling themselves in!

[BONES]

I just asked Bing to produce " a sketch that depicts the emptiness of modern life". I quite like what it came up with

Good example!

They are images made by referencing other images, so they can be called hyperimages

In exactly the same way that a human artist would look up other images for inspiration. Before the internet, we had a whole bookshelf full of art books for exactly that purpose. Now I just have a few GB of images on a portable drive that I keep plugged into my computer at work, so I can look through it for inspiration. And let's not even think about how heavily artists rely on stock images and video for their work.

In music, we are inspired by presets made by others, which we use all the time. We use drum loops that someone else either played or programmed. We listen to our favourite music for inspiration and we use all manner of tropes, like the simple 4/4 kick, that AI would also draw upon. AI is doing things exactly the way we do so when you criticise it, you are criticising people, too.

Similar to creating a track entirely from loops and samples

Not entirely. Like us, it will only use bits and pieces as inspiration.

None of them are art or design but hyperobjects one can like, dislike, or be indifferent to.

Absolute f**king bullshit. Go to Adobe Stock and search for "AI art" and see what it gives you. Some of the best art in Adobe Stock is AI generated. I've been earning a good living as an artist for more than 25 years but AI is already a much better artist than I am. It may not be as good at interpreting a brief but as a pure artist, it is streets ahead of me. It knows everything I know about composition and colour, light and shade, negative space - all that stuff people spend 2 or 3 years at art college learning.

But AI could be a challenge to human artists and designers in all media to be less derivative and more innovative!

Why? I see no impetus for this. What AI will do is show up shit artist for the shit artists they are. It will also be a long, long time before it can do what I/we do, for the simple reason that we are so far from the mainstream that AI doesn't currently understand our aesthetic. It feels like it is programmed not to. It has an overall optimism that stops it from doing anything truly dark. I'm not sure it even understands anger at this point. But one day it will. It's not very good at "stream of consciousness", either.

(But just watch-- audiences will prefer AI-created shit cuz its more familiar.)

How is that different from the absolute shite that populates mainstream charts around the world today? How is it worse than the "hit factories" that have been churning out chart fodder since the 60s? I'll take AI over Stock, Aitken and Waterman or Justin f**king Bieber any day.

[Michael L]

But AI could be a challenge to human artists and designers in all media to be less derivative and more innovative!

It will also be a long, long time before it can do what I/we do, for the simple reason that we are so far from the mainstream that AI doesn't currently understand our aesthetic. It feels like it is programmed not to.

This distils my critique-- as AI becomes better at making derivative hyperobjects (whether from art books, portable drive, or loops) it will push humans to be more humanistic.

"Go to Adobe Stock and search for AI art and see" how technically proficient but emotionally empty the images are.

But when "one day it will" be able to reference images of hyperanger and do what you do now, what will you do then? I wager that neither you or your environment will stay still, either.

Again, that is my point.

(and thanks for the useful examples!)

[Junolab]

Sorry skipped the last 6 pages, but can some one give a few names of software which generates good music? I have yet to find anything which does something proper and generating random midi patterns is hardly AI.

[mholloway]

Sorry skipped the last 6 pages, but can some one give a few names of software which generates good music? I have yet to find anything which does something proper and generating random midi patterns is hardly AI.

No.

[BONES]

Sorry skipped the last 6 pages, but can some one give a few names of software which generates good music? I have yet to find anything which does something proper and generating random midi patterns is hardly AI.

Can you point me to some humans who can generate good music? In my experience there isn't a lot of it around so it doesn't surprise me that what you hear from AI is as bad as the shite you hear on the radio.

[BONES]

This distils my critique-- as AI becomes better at making derivative hyperobjects (whether from art books, portable drive, or loops) it will push humans to be more humanistic.

No, that's not what I was saying at all. AI is designed not to offend anyone so it won't do anything anywhere near as offensive as the stuff we do. e.g. It won't write a song telling people their lives are worthless and they should kill themselves, which is one of our favourite themes.

Go to Adobe Stock and search for AI art and see" how technically proficient but emotionally empty the images are.

No more or less so than any of the other stock you will find there. For example, I typed "cute puppy" and "cute puppy playing with child" into Adobe's search and into Bing Image Creator AI. Can you pick which of these came from each source?

PUPPIES.jpg

But when "one day it will" be able to reference images of hyperanger and do what you do now, what will you do then?

I'll go to the pub, mate. It's been happening in my industry for years. 15 years ago, properly cutting a subject out of a photo was a highly specialised job which took half a day but now, with the help of Adobe's AI assisted tools, it takes literally 10 seconds. It's a chore that AI has taken off our hands and the more of that it can do, the better. When it gets good enough to write and mix songs for me to perform, I'll be over the f**king moon. Right now it's already good enough to remove most of the burden of creating our album artwork and we've fully embraced that.

[Junolab]

Sorry skipped the last 6 pages, but can some one give a few names of software which generates good music? I have yet to find anything which does something proper and generating random midi patterns is hardly AI.

Can you point me to some humans who can generate good music? In my experience there isn't a lot of it around so it doesn't surprise me that what you hear from AI is as bad as the shite you hear on the radio.

Yes I can easily do that, but music is subjective. Yet what’s the point of your reply beside sounding like a sour old man?

[BONES]

My point is that just because you don't like any AI music you have heard doesn't mean that it isn't actually good. I can't recommend any to you for the reasons I explained above, which is basically because Ai is currently too narrowly focused on mainstream tastes, so even if it could out-do Taylor Swift and Katy Perry, I'd still think its was shit. I'd want to hear it attempt to sound like Skinny Puppy or Nitzer Ebb before I could pass judgement on its ability but, like the vast majority of people, it has no idea who those artists are or what their music sounds like.

[Michael L]

It won't write a song telling people their lives are worthless and they should kill themselves, which is one of our favourite themes.

I went to an AI music site, entered "your life is worthless so kill yourself" and got a charming slow ballad on acoustic guitar with soothing male vocals, evoking the bliss of life after death . . .

[BONES]

Link Please.

[Michael L]

Link Please.

https://www.riffusion.com
Results vary a LOT depending on keywords, Settings, and today's weather in cyberspace.