Are you a composer or a technoid?

[whyterabbyt]

I love it when a plan comes together. Now get on the friggin plane...

[herodotus]

Though I have to ask, why is it always the amb/ex/art guys what have to do the thinking and compromising? When the fork did you see any of 'us' start a thread yelling "melody is shite; if you rely on melody you buy into preconceived notions of musical cliche, fail to challenge, and rely purely on a banal and corrupt consumer-driven Western aesthetic"

Not that bloody often, eh?

Although there is truth in the statement: 'When the fork did you see any of 'us' start a thread yelling "melody is shite; if you rely on melody you buy into preconceived notions of musical cliche, fail to challenge, and rely purely on a banal and corrupt consumer-driven Western aesthetic"' I personally have run into a great deal of anti-craft sentiment on this as well as other message boards.

In many circles, the ability to play guitar well is looked down upon as a form of idiocy. I have been told that some of my favorite music is "pretentious twaddle". I have seen a personal hero of sorts (i.e. Frank Zappa) referred to as 'having created the most boring music ever'. I have even seen someone say that "I am glad the f**ker is dead"

That last was not at KVR, but I was told here that all prog rock is dated and stupid, and that it is all just "Twiddly". As a guy who has never said anything bad about ANYONES music here, and who has spent long, lonely years of my life trying to understand all kinds of music, I found this cavalier dismissal of some of my favorite artists to be offensive.

I don't want to start another argument. I merely want to correct this notion that only crafty musician types steeped in the western tradition can be elitist snobs.

I have met rock and rollers, ethnic percussionists, sound artists and punks who are snobs too.

[whyterabbyt]

Fair point, sir, very fair point....

[jens]

prog-rock is manieristic crap!

[donkey tugger]

I am rational economic man.

[Meffy]

*BIG NOD* of agreement to herodotus.

[herodotus]

I am rational economic man.

I've soooo been wanting to meet you!!!!

So what is this "economic" stuff? Is it a new plugin???

[donkey tugger]

I am rational economic man.

I've soooo been wanting to meet you!!!!

So what is this "economic" stuff? Is it a new plugin???

What's it worth then eh?

[whyterabbyt]

jens quoth prog-rock is manieristic crap!

Mainwaristic?

[dystonia_ek]

@ herodotus & whyterabbyt:

Semi-fair point, I'd say... there's much more to craft than instrumental virtuosity, after all. The two concepts can exist independently of each other. Much depends on context and purpose.
There are a lot of instrumental traditions that seem to lack the concept of virtuosity... look for example at Tibetan liturgical music. Timing is everything, but I haven't heard of anyone coming off all Steve Vai on the rag-dun parts, nor is 'expression' the point.

[McLilith]

There are a lot of instrumental traditions that seem to lack the concept of virtuosity... look for example at Tibetan liturgical music. Timing is everything, but I haven't heard of anyone coming off all Steve Vai on the rag-dun parts, nor is 'expression' the point.

Why is it, that I'm not surprised to see references of both "Tibetan liturgical music" and "Steve Vai" in the same sentence?



McLilith

[Meffy]

Why is it, that I'm not surprised to see references of both "Tibetan liturgical music" and "Steve Vai" in the same sentence?

I'm guessing you don't have his latest collaboration CD with Linda Ronstadt... all Tibetan liturgical choonz, except a guest drum solo by Terry Bozzio.

[seamonkey]

Only on KvR.... a simple question turns into the battle of the minds(read OPINIONS).

It's what comes out the speakers, not how it got there that matters.

Music is an expression of the soul, heart, experiences.
Whatever tools one uses to express these feelings is fine by me.
Use one finger, two or all eleven as far as I care.

[McLilith]

I'm guessing you don't have his latest collaboration CD with Linda Ronstadt... all Tibetan liturgical choonz, except a guest drum solo by Terry Bozzio.

Is this CD an April Fool's joke? That sounds pretty wild.

...except for the part about Terry Bozzio being a drummer. I think he's an excellent drumer.

Did you ever listen to this album:

Bozzio Levin Stevens
Black Light Syndrome

It's very good. Those are three very talented players, and the the music is very impressive, in my opinion. The fine technical skills don't squash the emotional feel of the music on that album. I don't know why the album isn't more widely known.


take care,
McLilith

[Z3R0T0N1N]

.

Though I have to ask, why is it always the amb/ex/art guys what have to do the thinking and compromising? When the fork did you see any of 'us' start a thread yelling "melody is shite; if you rely on melody you buy into preconceived notions of musical cliche, fail to challenge, and rely purely on a banal and corrupt consumer-driven Western aesthetic"

Not that bloody often, eh?

bang on, that.
it does get tiring; but it seems that in many fields it is the people who push the envelope, or change in some way how things are percieved that will of course have to defend those ideas at first against the dearly held assumptions of those who fear or fail to understand change.
Still, it does seem that at this point in time the ideas put forward by the early Avant Garde composers would have had sufficient time (a hundred bloody years or so) to sink in. For the most part the music that gets discussed here is not even the most cutting edge; one wonders why these things are still misunderstood by so many.