SONAR 4 Surround....

[Mr. Slater's Parrot]

In regards to Sonar's clip automation:

It covers exactly *one* paramter: velocity. Probably the single parameter least usefully manipulated with an envelope instead of discrete values. I accepted the clarification. Again, if you haven't used a host that supports rich per-clip automation envelopes your judgements of their
worth aren't very interesting.

True, Sonar 3 supports Velocity as a parameter for midi clip envelopes. It also supports Gain and Pan as parameters for audio clip envelopes.

Full support for all envelopes on clips would be cool, indeed. However, this is mitigated in large part by the fact that Sonar already supports copy/paste for *track* envelopes (and these *do* include full parameter support). This copy/paste functionality is coordinated with midi clip copy/paste in a *highly* useful way.

So, for example, I can create a midi clip and add whatever envelopes that I want as track envelopes. I can select the midi clip and copy it. The copy dialog lets me indicate that I want to copy the automation as well. I can then do a paste which will paste -- all at once -- both the midi clip *and* the track envelope data that applies to the copied midi clip. So, in effect, the midi clip and the automation that applies just to that clip can be manipulated all at once making it pretty much just as useful as "clip automation". In fact, off the top of my head, I can't think of a situation in which it wouldn't be the same thing, really.

[Mr. Slater's Parrot]

Cool, thanks for the tip! I might well do that, anything that adds up to under $500 is fine by me!

It looks to me like you can buy Cakewalk Plasma 2003 for $49 (or less), register it, and then buy Sonar 4 PE -- the full enchilada -- for $349.

Or you could do the same and upgrade to Sonar 4 Studio Edition for $199.

[Mr. Slater's Parrot]

Bounce-to-disk isn't in any sense the same as a freeze feature. It's a reasonable substitute, but that's all. I love how eager Sonar fans, who've never had a freeze feature, are to tell me how unnecessary it is. I await with pleasure all the revelatory praises of the new Sonar 4 freeze feature.

But, to be fair to Sonar, there isn't a universal standard for freeze. Some hosts do a freeze that doesn't allow volume and pan adjustments afterwards -- really limiting. Some do a freeze only in real time -- not much fun. Some give no options about what time length to freeze, whether or not to include insert or send effects, etc. Some do a freeze without releasing resources and give the latter yet another name ("deep freeze", for example).

So, all things considered, Sonar's highly flexible and configurable and much faster than real time "bounce-freeze" has been very effective -- in my use, for sure. The addition of a one-button-deep-freeze variety in Sonar 4 should be frosting on the cake!

[christianmusicmaker]

The addition of a one-button-deep-freeze variety in Sonar 4 should be frosting on the cake!

very well said.

The traffic on the Sonar forum is unreal! There is very little that cannot be done with Sonar 4 now.

[LoRez]

Once again I have to point out that this is the quickest new version release I've seen from them yet.

Is that bad?

It's only been a year, and we've seen ONE update to version 3. I mean they've apparently been working on quite a few "enhancements" such as the metronome and the optimized audio engine. So they couldn't release any of these as a v3.x.x???......Of course not, if they hoarde all the small features (as well as the larger ones) they can call it a "new version".

Actually there were two updates. Hoarde features? Any software developer would find this quite humerous.

I can't believe no one else is irritated. Version 1 to version 2...huge difference. Version 2 to version 3.....gigantic and wonderful difference. Version 3 to version 4.....a bunch of shit they could have released individually as updates, but instead have "bundled" to warrant a new version.

I'm really sorry but this is just absurd. Not having used v.4. yet how do you know it is a bunch of shit? Surround, AV support, Pow-r, freeze, etc...all just minor stuff that should have been in minor updates huh? I just don't see it and if you think about it, it is really a rather unrealistic point of view.

And honestly, I could give a f**k about the new plugs.

Fine, but there are plenty of people who are quite excited about them so...

At this rate they should just charge us Cake customers a $179.00 a year member fee. And I also love how close the price to upgrade from version 1 is to the price for me to upgrade from Sonar3 Producer. "Yeah Cakewalk, I've supported you all along, and updated with every new version, but let some kid who just bought version 1 off of Ebay for $50 upgrade to the same version as me for just slightly more money." f**k this. f**k Cakewalk. f**k pandas.

Well this is just not valid. No one is forcing you to upgrade. Your v.3 will continue to work just as it has so don't feel like there's a gun to your head or anything. And the Ebay thing....anyone buying a used copy on Ebay would NOT be eligible for updates so the scenario you present could not happen. So, I really don't think there is anything to be upset about.

[JeffSanders]

Babies. You whiny babies should be embarrassed.
Go buy Tracktion.

[Hink]

Babies. You whiny babies should be embarrassed.
Go buy Tracktion.

fairhaven mass? howdy neighbor...well not close but my governer is Mitt too....Lowell/N.Chelmsford here...5 minutes from Nashua...

[WillieJenkins]

Lowell?

I'm in Attleboro mate My best friend is out in Lowell.

[Hink]

Lowell?

I'm in Attleboro mate My best friend is out in Lowell.

cool, I use to work at Mars in Natick, and then I went to for Daddy's...but then I remembered why I hated shopping there, and realized working there was worse...

[tony tony chopper]

Magix (Samplitude)have gone the Pow-r dither route as well so it is a very high end addition to Sonar 4.

http://audio.rightmark.org/lukin/dither/

check "2.2. 16-bit samples"

wow.. I'm amazed.. blown away.... by the stupidity of how dithering is used by marketing these days.


As usual, don't forget to raise your speaker's level to around 10x if you want to hear anything in those examples. And by anything I mean sound, because you're probably not likely to notice a difference in them anyway.

But ok, true, dithering is rather important.. if you're doing 8bit audio for the GBA.

Now hoping someone will prove me wrong and post meaningful example audio clips to hear a difference that would justify these funny-sounding praises:

But when I heard [POW-r], I began to cry, because I couldn't believe my ears---this box brings 16-bit audio closer to the 24-bit source than I had dreamed possible.

I had tried everything but nothing worked. Then, in a last attempt, I tried POW-r, thinking I had nothing to lose. I couldn't believe my eyes, my hair was growing back!

note: I made up one of these 2 quotes

[Sicklecell666]

Lowell?

I'm in Attleboro mate My best friend is out in Lowell.

cool, I use to work at Mars in Natick, and then I went to for Daddy's...but then I remembered why I hated shopping there, and realized working there was worse...

get a room, guys


















small world init?

[JeffSanders]

Cakewalk rules. I can't wait to get my copy of Sonar 4.

Yeah - it is a small world! I'm in the New Bedford area. Nice to see some MA musicians here!

[WillieJenkins]

curiously enough, Cakewalk world headquarters is on Melcher Street in Boston!

[robains]

I've Pre-Ordered my Sonar 4 PE for $179.

The list of new enhancements and plugins is more than enough to justify the price of upgrade.

Yearly versions seems very acceptable to me. I'm a developer and we come out with new versions every 6 months -- it is called getting a return on investment. Good developers aren't cheap I should know.

If you think the new feature list on Sonar 4 was easy to code, then please fill us all in on how easy it was? Assuming of course you must have access to Sonar source code??

Can't believe people are complaining about a product before it is released?

[CynicalSmile]

LoRez, it's far too late for me to try to contest everything you contested.

I was just trying to say it seems like I just dumped a couple hundred pretty recently, and they didn't even flip us many updates. If you optimize the audio engine in version 4, perhaps that's something us version 3 people should be getting too.

And I never said the new features were shit, I just threw the word shit in there because I was pretty cranky earlier, and I cuss quite alot.

I'm sure all the new features are very nice, and honestly probably worth the money, but along the development path to version 4, there are a couple things I really think they should have given v3 users, that's all.



And again, all my negativity and whining aside, I do love Sonar very much, and we are planning on a fall wedding