What would make you switch to Linux?

[whyterabbyt]

For the heck of it, every time I encounter OSX, I'm baffled with what I have to interface it with -- the effing mouse has only one button!

Apple havent shipped a one-button-only mouse in a very long time. Their current mice have no buttons, but when they introduced the Magic Mouse in 2007 or so, it registered left- and right- clicks, and Apple has supported right-click context menus for years, right back to OS-9.

[briandc]

Yes if you install it with the package manager. You don't have an installer, but in ubuntu you can add ppa and you will can install the latest one. But if you want the latest programs desktops, you should try Arch Linux. First it could be a difficult to install, but it isn't impossible, and it is the most flexible and up-to-date distro.

And here we go again:
1. What is PPA?
2. Now it's not Ubuntu anymore, but Arch Linux, which could be difficult to install?

Come on... It is problematic already when I have to make applications work with each other, and deal with the drivers, let alone having headaches trying to install the OS. And if I choose the best distro, it is not the most flexible and up to date, and If I want the most up to date, it's not the best distro and the most flexible?

Seems like things didn't change that much over the last ten years, after all

BTW: Did I say that I think all "app stores" like iTunes, Google, whatever, suck? I never manage to know what I should get from there, and always feel helplessly lost. Last time I tried to install Winamp in my Android ophone, I had to go through their own website, because I was unable to find it in the Google store.

It's really pretty simple: linux has three main branches: Debian, RedHat and Slackware. Many of the audio-based distributions are made in Debian. Ubuntu is under Debian.

Each distribution, such as Ubuntu, has "repositories." These are basically online application containers. You connect to one, search for an application (ie. sequencer, synth, etc) and it lists the ones available. You select the ones you want and click install. It does all the installing to your system in a few minutes. Now you have new apps!


brian

[lutykos]

Which is easier: to search on the web for the installer, then double click next,next....or to run the sofware center(in ubuntu) search the program and click instal (or just type in the terminal "sudo apt-get install program" /in Ubuntu/ or "sudo pacmans -S program" /in Arch Linux/ )

You're not getting it ... you're looking at it from the point of view of an experienced user.

Most musicians are not (and are not interested in being) experienced computer users.

Not really, that's why first i said the ubuntu software center: it is like google play

[ZenPunkHippy]

It's really pretty simple: linux has three main branches: Debian, RedHat and Slackware. Many of the audio-based distributions are made in Debian. Ubuntu is under Debian.

Not simple.

Some users won't even open Notepad to edit a file.

It needs to be simpler than that ...

[ZenPunkHippy]

Not really, that's why first i said the ubuntu software center: it is like google play

It doesn't matter how many times you say "it's simple" ..

It is NOT SIMPLE for the average musician.

Sheesh.

[lutykos]

Not really, that's why first i said the ubuntu software center: it is like google play

It doesn't matter how many times you say "it's simple" ..

It is NOT SIMPLE for the average musician.

Sheesh.

Really? So you don't have a smart phone, because it's hard to use...

[briandc]

Which is easier: to search on the web for the installer, then double click next,next....or to run the sofware center(in ubuntu) search the program and click instal (or just type in the terminal "sudo apt-get install program" /in Ubuntu/ or "sudo pacmans -S program" /in Arch Linux/ )

You're not getting it ... you're looking at it from the point of view of an experienced user.

Most musicians are not (and are not interested in being) experienced computer users.

Yes, I think you're right. However, remember that it's not a "linux" issue, it's a computer issue. All computer operating systems have a learning curve. People probably just don't remember the work they had to do initially just to be able to use an email client.
Fortunately, once a person is used to Windows or Mac, using linux is now very easy.


brian

[ZenPunkHippy]

Really? So you don't have a smart phone, because it's hard to use...

Linux, and specifically music apps on Linux, is not "smartphone easy", is it? Really ... you can't be that blind to the Linux cause to think that setting up a Linux based system is as easy as using an iPhone or Android variant, can you?

[lutykos]

Really? So you don't have a smart phone, because it's hard to use...

Linux, and specifically music apps on Linux, is not "smartphone easy", is it? Really ... you can't be that blind to the Linux cause to think that setting up a Linux based system is as easy as using an iPhone or Android variant, can you?

First you said: to install a program isn't easy. But in windows you also have to configure a program, and nowadays in linux is almost as simple as in windows. Try ubuntu studio(you don't have to install) for example and you will see it.

[ras.s]

You guys do understand that it's just terminology one has to learn when they use Linux?

It's not learning new terminology, it's the massive hassle of getting a system working.

And you saying "You lost me as "package whatsamajiggy"." wasn't about terminology?

Quite a lot of musicians (not KVR users ...) find plugging in a keyboard and making sure the MIDI port is active in a host "difficult". Think about that for a minute!

Well, I did. And all I could come up with is that what do those people do then? Either they learn or give up? I don't understand how is that different with whatever the operating system is.

Practically, it isn't any different on the Linux side. You attach the keyboard to the computer, wait for the operating system to identify it as a MIDI device, and make settings so that the software you want to use receives the MIDI input. How is learning that any more difficult, or even different?



And as for "Most musicians are not (and are not interested in being) experienced computer users." --- then consider this forum; here we have literally thousands of computer musicians. For most people here, the computer is the main instrument. You're belittling a lot of people.

[fmr]

It wouldn't have to be linux; but I don't think Apple will port their apps to linux, either. But that's my whole point. Corporations aren't interested in the common good; only their earnings. If adding new functionalities will improve their earnings, great. If not, forget about it.
Whereas the open-source community of users includes a lot of talented people who will make improvements just for the enjoyment of making a good app. And the world is a better place for it.

brian

Corporations are interested in their earnings, yes, but their earnings come from satisfied customers. I don't like Apple way of doing business, with the shameless planned obsolescence of the hardware, but the OS is good and solid, and there are plenty of first class applications that get the job done well, with great quality, and are also very well done.

The very same can b said about Microsoft and Windows, with the added argumetn that there is a much better retrocompatibility (I can still run in the latest systems applications written in the beginning of XP), and I can assemble a machine using whatever components I want, because everybody supports it. Again, applications are first class, elegant, well done, get the job done well and with great quality.

In both cases, that comes at a price, but hey, you get what you pay for (most of the time)

Sure, in the way, I had some hardware that became obsolete, because of lack of support, but the same happens in Linux, with the agtravant that, in Linux, most of the applications still are not there, most of the plug-ins are not there, most of the hardware are not supported, and we are always dependant on the goodwill of some freelancer (frankly, how can I demand something of someone who does it for free?)

[fmr]

And as for "Most musicians are not (and are not interested in being) experienced computer users." --- then consider this forum; here we have literally thousands of computer musicians. For most people here, the computer is the main instrument. You're belittling a lot of people.

You said it yourself: "the computer is the(ir) main instrument". You usually don't expect the pianist to also tune the piano and repair it, do you? It's his instrument, not his hobby. The goal is to make music, producing, make sound design, research, whatever, not spending the time trying to get the OS working, or trying to devise what the hell is missing for something I downloaded and should work actually work, and where to put what library I had to get because the package didn't contained that, and one application expects the library in a place, and another expects it in another place. and I had the wrong version, because the library got updated, and the app programmer didn't update the application.

[lutykos]

It wouldn't have to be linux; but I don't think Apple will port their apps to linux, either. But that's my whole point. Corporations aren't interested in the common good; only their earnings. If adding new functionalities will improve their earnings, great. If not, forget about it.
Whereas the open-source community of users includes a lot of talented people who will make improvements just for the enjoyment of making a good app. And the world is a better place for it.

brian

Corporations are interested in their earnings, yes, but their earnings come from satisfied customers. I don't like Apple way of doing business, with the shameless planned obsolescence of the hardware, but the OS is good and solid, and there are plenty of first class applications that get the job done well, with great quality, and are also very well done.

The very same can b said about Microsoft and Windows, with the added argumetn that there is a much better retrocompatibility (I can still run in the latest systems applications written in the beginning of XP), and I can assemble a machine using whatever components I want, because everybody supports it. Again, applications are first class, elegant, well done, get the job done well and with great quality.

In both cases, that comes at a price, but hey, you get what you pay for (most of the time)

Sure, in the way, I had some hardware that became obsolete, because of lack of support, but the same happens in Linux, with the agtravant that, in Linux, most of the applications still are not there, most of the plug-ins are not there, most of the hardware are not supported, and we are always dependant on the goodwill of some freelancer (frankly, how can I demand something of someone who does it for free?)

Just a question: when did you tried a linux based setup?

[briandc]

Corporations are interested in their earnings, yes, but their earnings come from satisfied customers. I don't like Apple way of doing business, with the shameless planned obsolescence of the hardware, but the OS is good and solid, and there are plenty of first class applications that get the job done well, with great quality, and are also very well done.

The very same can b said about Microsoft and Windows, with the added argumetn that there is a much better retrocompatibility (I can still run in the latest systems applications written in the beginning of XP), and I can assemble a machine using whatever components I want, because everybody supports it. Again, applications are first class, elegant, well done, get the job done well and with great quality.

In both cases, that comes at a price, but hey, you get what you pay for (most of the time)

Sure, in the way, I had some hardware that became obsolete, because of lack of support, but the same happens in Linux, with the agtravant that, in Linux, most of the applications still are not there, most of the plug-ins are not there, most of the hardware are not supported, and we are always dependant on the goodwill of some freelancer (frankly, how can I demand something of someone who does it for free?)

Yes, corporations depend on happy end-users. So does the open-source community.

The retro-compatability issue is a valid problem across the board. I think it's just part and parcel of having new releases of an application. At some point, things start to collide. But with an international community that's working as I write this, there's MUCH more chance that something you need ported to linux will get there, than expecting a corporation that is only looking at profits.

The issue with linux, imo, is that there are many distros and many apps, and they are not all working together under the same "umbrella." Microsoft has few distros, so they are more focused. With linux there's more freedom to choose and build as you like (in fact, it's considered "modular"), even though there are some very focused distros like AVlinux that gives you an entire audio studio setup without having to choose what you want to install or not.


brian

[ZenPunkHippy]

And as for "Most musicians are not (and are not interested in being) experienced computer users." --- then consider this forum; here we have literally thousands of computer musicians. For most people here, the computer is the main instrument. You're belittling a lot of people.

First, I explicitly said "Quite a lot of musicians (not KVR users ...)". By "most musicians" I'm referring to the people who compose, but have very little working knowledge of computers - and there is quite a lot of people in this situation.

So back to installation: if it's relatively easy to get Ubuntu Studio working (which I have done before: it's easy enough, but not as easy as either OS X or Windows), what about the hardware?

Is all of it supported, the same way it's almost guaranteed to be supported on Win + Mac? Just looked up Novation Automap - not supported. Maschine? No chance. And it looks like the M-Audio 1814 FW is still not supported either.

What about the plugins I've invested in? Kontakt sample libraries?

All of these things have to be taken in to consideration: it's not just a matter of getting the OS and host up and running. Unless you're starting out fresh, there is a whole existing investment in gear that needs to be considered before making the switch.

Peace,
Andy.