Hyakken (HY Plugins) releases HY-POLY

[BONES]

The only two that matter to you. But they don't matter to enough other people that the other devs feel like they need to follow suit. As for what you're talking about, what makes you think anyone cares?

That a move to Linux would lock out a good amount of good synths and tools wouldn‘t bother me

Again, you'd be letting your OS decide which software you will use, which is totally arse-backwards, whether there is enough to cover your needs or not. I'd be far more likely to compromise on my host than on my VSTi.

[Erisian]

As soon as I am left with the choice of Linux or Win10, I'm going Linux - end of. In the meantime I am going to milk Win7 and possibly Win8 if I need it. MS are taking too many choices away from people. You only need a small handful of good VSTis and if you have an imagination at all, they don't need to have every gimmick under the sun.

[crickey13]

I would switch to Linux in a heartbeat if it was supported by everybody.

[Biome_Digital]

I would switch to Linux in a heartbeat if it was supported by everybody.

yep

[nucleox]

The reason I don't use Linux for music production is because not all of my favorite plugins and DAWs have a native Linux version. There is not one other task I need to accomplish that can't be done on Linux and be done faster with privacy.

Don't confuse the OS with developer's support of that OS.

If everything I'm using now would run native on Linux I would drop Winblows in a heartbeat and never look back. Anyone who uses Linux now and actually pays attention to what Win 10 does to your system should agree. For example this is Sunday so monitor what WaaSMedic Agent.exe does to your spinning disk drives on it's scheduled weekly run.

In my recent experience, modern Linux distros are far more efficient than Winblows. Full stop.

We're starting to see forward thinking developers support native Linux versions more and more like U-he and Bitwig all the way to one man operations like Vital and now it's great to see HY join the battle.

Anyway this discussion is off topic so all I'll say any further is that I'm happy to see HY become one of those forward thinking developers. Hopefully one day in the future all developers will join him.

End of discussion.

I totally agree with you, Linux has a thousand years advantage on many essential aspects such as security, performance, storage requirement...

And yes, is amazing to see developers opening the gates to the linux market and it's vast universe of distros, but there's one thing that has made a solid barrier between the mainstream PC users and linux: It's way too complicated for the average PC user.

We are used to the functional scheme that Windows and MAC has given through the years, totally GUI-based steps, Easy-to-install programs, well organized file system, etc; But the most important is a workflow that adapts to any user doesn't mater if it's not experienced or an expert, it will give to each one what it needs, thing that in Linux is far from happening.

That's the main reason why Linux is widely used only by experts and server enviroments, and is something we can't expect to change, is the Kernel itself built and based on Command lines (Way that is handled almost 90% of things on Linux); It's perfect for servers due to the amazing resource and data handling, on security and pentesting for the several layers of security and user controlled access, but for audio? now things change.

An audio OS has to be made to make things easy and quick for the user, give perfomance and tools to make the musicians able to do what they need, where they need, how they need, and when they need, in the shortest and eassier way posible, and Linux doesn't fit on this area at all.

Of course, a user with deep experience on computers and OS systems wouldn't even notice of how complicated it is, but for a guitarist or singer or producer who only wants to make music, seeing a command line and a bunch of commands to learn on how to use each one because is the only way to get your system going, man, that's a real life nightmare and a total headache.

I've worked with many Linux distros for all kind of tasks, but audio has been the less comfortable to do, except for very simple tasks.

I just hope to see this change on a future, and a lot of effort will be needed for that.

[BONES]

I would switch to Linux in a heartbeat if it was supported by everybody.

Yeah and I'd buy a Ferrari if I could get my keyboard stand in the boot.

[BONES]

But the most important is a workflow that adapts to any user doesn't mater if it's not experienced or an expert, it will give to each one what it needs, thing that in Linux is far from happening.

And that is precisely where Linux falls down. Unless you are an expert, Linux can be a total f**king nightmare. I remember the two Linux experts in the IT dept where I worked took a whole week to figure out how to get the graphics card on my Dell laptop to work as it was supposed to. That's probably more than 50 man hours to do one, simple thing. And these guys were the experts! What hope would an ordinary user have?

That's the main reason why Linux is widely used only by experts and server enviroments

No, it's not. It is used in those environments because it is completely customisable and can be tailored perfectly to the needs of the business. But it requires a serious IT presence to make it all work and to keep it working. No business without an IT dept would ever consider it and individuals like us shouldn't, either.

The thing is that it's fine until it isn't. e.g. I bet Linux wouldn't work with my Zenbook Duo's dual screens. I reckon it would require a lot of time and effort and it would end up just being like a second monitor, with none of the usability features Asus have built into it. And you can bet those sorts of issues would extend to a lot of the specialised peripherals we use for what we do. My Roli Blocks wouldn't work, for example, and I'd only be able to get basic functionality from my KeyStep.

An audio OS has to be made to make things easy and quick for the user, give performance and tools to make the musicians able to do what they need, where they need, how they need, and when they need, in the shortest and eassier way posible, and Linux doesn't fit on this area at all.

Of course, a user with deep experience on computers and OS systems wouldn't even notice of how complicated it is, but for a guitarist or singer or producer who only wants to make music, seeing a command line and a bunch of commands to learn on how to use each one because is the only way to get your system going, man, that's a real life nightmare and a total headache.

^^^^ This! ^^^^

[Tj Shredder]

The thing is that it's fine until it isn't. e.g. I bet Linux wouldn't work with my Zenbook Duo's dual screens. I reckon it would require a lot of time and effort and it would end up just being like a second monitor, with none of the usability features Asus have built into it. And you can bet those sorts of issues would extend to a lot of the specialised peripherals we use for what we do. My Roli Blocks wouldn't work, for example, and I'd only be able to get basic functionality from my KeyStep.

That picture doesn't fit completely. Asus did that work for Windows and I bet its not less complicated than it would be doing it for Linux (but they didn't). Your Roli Block would have no issue if Roli would deliver their dashboard for Linux (It does run in Wine though). But if its setup you wouldn't have a problem at all, as its plain Midi and compliant to the specs...
I wonder why no hardware computer vendor ever got into this seriously. There are half baked Dell Linux laptops and some dealers specialized for that and thats it...
For standard office work Linux is well suited since ages. I remember setting up a the computer of my girl friend around 2003 running Windows Me... I had to reinstall Windows every 3 months or so. After installing Linux, there was no problem at all for the remaining years until the machine died...

The worst and most annoying thing in the Linux world is, that all those who are knowledgeable insist on using the terminal, well knowing that isn't made for people who need it rarely, its prone to typing errors and has too many points of failure. If you know all points of failure it might be even useful, but I still doubt it... Its just more flexible if you need to get into rare configuration details which you will never need as end user...

But maybe we should go back on topic now. Looking forward to the new versions...

[BONES]

You only need a small handful of good VSTis.

And that's the problem - none of the instruments I consider part of that "small handful" will run natively on Linux. Not one. Neither does any host I'd actually want to use. And my Roli Blocks won't work with it, either. And none of my hardware VST editors are available natively for Linux. The list is near endless. And that's before I start looking for a Linux Window Manager that can hold a candle to Windows 10's Start. So what I'd end up with are VSTi I don't want, running on a host I don't like, using controllers that aren't any good on an OS that doesn't work as well as the one I use now. Sign me up!

Asus did that work for Windows and I bet its not less complicated than it would be doing it for Linux (but they didn't). Your Roli Block would have no issue if Roli would deliver their dashboard for Linux (It does run in Wine though).

But that's my entire point - Linux could be the greatest operating system in the history of the universe but if it won't let me run the things I want to run, it is a complete and utter waste of time. Asus and Roli live in the real world, that's why they don't waste their resources on Linux. What do you think you know that they don't?

I wonder why no hardware computer vendor ever got into this seriously. There are half baked Dell Linux laptops and some dealers specialized for that and thats it...

And if those little ventures had been successful, don't you think they'd have gone all-in? Nobody is interested because there is no reason to be interested.

For standard office work Linux is well suited since ages.

And yet, most who have tried it end up going back to Windows.
http://www.neowin.net/news/munich-germa ... to-windows
"the idea is generally that Linux setups are cheaper than a Microsoft solution as you do not have to pay licensing fees but what Munich experienced is that Linux was much more expensive... the city had to hire programmers to build out functionality that they needed and then had to pay the staff to maintain the software."

[crickey13]

And that's the problem - none of the instruments I consider part of that "small handful" will run natively on Linux. Not one. Neither does any host I'd actually want to use. And my Roli Blocks won't work with it, either. And none of my hardware VST editors are available natively for Linux. The list is near endless. And that's before I start looking for a Linux Window Manager that can hold a candle to Windows 10's Start. So what I'd end up with are VSTi I don't want, running on a host I don't like, using controllers that aren't any good on an OS that doesn't work as well as the one I use now. Sign me up!

Yeah, that's the real pain in the butt. From what I understand, hooking up an audio interface to a Linux OS is also a hassle in that most of this is done through some workarounds. What might work in one sampling rate might not work in others and so on, it's a nightmare.

I'm not sure if Wine is a solution, it's apparently quite buggy. It's fairly easy to run Windows-based audio software on it from what I've heard, but who knows. If Wine became stable and reliable, then I would love to switch, but these are just hypotheticals. Maybe some day.

[Teksonik]

Here are a few wavs for HY Poly's Vector Oscs. Just drop them in the factory waveforms folder. You can also create sub-folders for your custom waveforms.

You can of course load four different wavs and let the Vector travel through them but you can also use the Vector Osc by leaving the puck at dead center and can then route two Oscs through Filter 1 and the other two through Filter 2 etc. That Osc Module brings some interesting possibilities.

HY Poly Tek Wavs.zip

[audiojunkie]

The reason I don't use Linux for music production is because not all of my favorite plugins and DAWs have a native Linux version. There is not one other task I need to accomplish that can't be done on Linux and be done faster with privacy.

Don't confuse the OS with developer's support of that OS.

If everything I'm using now would run native on Linux I would drop Winblows in a heartbeat and never look back. Anyone who uses Linux now and actually pays attention to what Win 10 does to your system should agree. For example this is Sunday so monitor what WaaSMedic Agent.exe does to your spinning disk drives on it's scheduled weekly run.

In my recent experience, modern Linux distros are far more efficient than Winblows. Full stop.

We're starting to see forward thinking developers support native Linux versions more and more like U-he and Bitwig all the way to one man operations like Vital and now it's great to see HY join the battle.

Anyway this discussion is off topic so all I'll say any further is that I'm happy to see HY become one of those forward thinking developers. Hopefully one day in the future all developers will join him.

End of discussion.

I totally agree with you, Linux has a thousand years advantage on many essential aspects such as security, performance, storage requirement...

And yes, is amazing to see developers opening the gates to the linux market and it's vast universe of distros, but there's one thing that has made a solid barrier between the mainstream PC users and linux: It's way too complicated for the average PC user.

We are used to the functional scheme that Windows and MAC has given through the years, totally GUI-based steps, Easy-to-install programs, well organized file system, etc; But the most important is a workflow that adapts to any user doesn't mater if it's not experienced or an expert, it will give to each one what it needs, thing that in Linux is far from happening.

That's the main reason why Linux is widely used only by experts and server enviroments, and is something we can't expect to change, is the Kernel itself built and based on Command lines (Way that is handled almost 90% of things on Linux); It's perfect for servers due to the amazing resource and data handling, on security and pentesting for the several layers of security and user controlled access, but for audio? now things change.

An audio OS has to be made to make things easy and quick for the user, give perfomance and tools to make the musicians able to do what they need, where they need, how they need, and when they need, in the shortest and eassier way posible, and Linux doesn't fit on this area at all.

Of course, a user with deep experience on computers and OS systems wouldn't even notice of how complicated it is, but for a guitarist or singer or producer who only wants to make music, seeing a command line and a bunch of commands to learn on how to use each one because is the only way to get your system going, man, that's a real life nightmare and a total headache.

I've worked with many Linux distros for all kind of tasks, but audio has been the less comfortable to do, except for very simple tasks.

I just hope to see this change on a future, and a lot of effort will be needed for that.

Linux is no longer too complicated for the average user. This has all changed years ago. The key with Linux is to know "Exactly" what you want, and then find the distro that does what you want, how you want it. That is the beauty of Linux--there are nearly 300 active variations--EACH ONE CATERS TO A SPECIFIC TARGET AUDIENCE!! Yes, there are difficult distros, like Gentoo or Arch. But they serve specific purposes and accomplish specific goals that attract specific users. But there are also distros that my great-grandmother could use without having ever seen a computer. In fact, many of you are probably using Linux without even realizing it--have you got an Android phone, a Smart Device, or anything IoT? Most of that uses Linux. Linux runs in your cars these days. Smart TVs are using Linux....in fact, most "smart" anythings are usually running Linux. Even Windows has integrated with Linux with its WSL technology. Linux is not going away, and is getting bigger and better every year. Yes, we can joke year after year about this year or the next being the "Year of the Linux Desktop". But no one can deny that its popularity is growing. Do you know what the three most popular desktop OSes are this year? I'll give you a hint: Apple OSX is not one of them. That's right, Chrome passed Apple this year. Chrome is a Linux distribution.

With Windows or OSX, you get a single desktop environment choice and that's it. What if you don't like that desktop environment? Sorry. "You get what you get and don't throw a fit", as my daughter has been taught to say in school. But with Linux, you have dozens of choices. You can be as Windows-like or as OSX-like as you want, or go with something completely different. You can have the hold-your-hand spoon-fed, full-fat can't make a mistake easy like OSX, or have it stripped down to the bare metal Real-Time Ultra-ultra-ultra efficient, ultra-ultra-ultra uber low-latency self-driving AI, factory robotics lightning speed don't make a mistake get it done but with a lot of work hard.

Personally, I like EndeavourOS. I can choose from the most popular (or the most efficient) desktop environments. I have access to every package that Arch makes, straight from the developers, as soon as they are released, including the AUR. I have immediate access to half a dozen or more the variously tuned kernels that I can simply install and use. If I wanted to bother with it, I could custom compile my own kernel for hard realtime ultra-low latencies (like those built into Pro Audio equipment and synthesizers), and have it only load specifically the drivers I want it to. Some users are able to go from completely turned-off to fully booted in about 10 seconds--absolutely zero bloat and nothing that isn't necessary.

Many of the users in the Reaper Linux forums are partial to Manjaro, which is an excellent compromise between being dead-easy and having all of the benefits of an Arch system. I personally think it is a great choice! But the point is, the technology is here. NOW. and, there is a distro specifically right for you. And developers are noticing this. Maybe you your specific favorite application or plugin is not available natively yet (although almost everything but ILOK stuff currently works on Linux through WINE), but there is more and more available for Linux every year. It's not a matter of if, it's a matter of when....

[audiojunkie]

This is really great news. As someone who has come to despise Windows 10 I have been using Linux distros more an more for every day tasks but not music production.

This is exactly why I stopped using Linux 20 years ago - if you can't use it for everything, why use it at all? Windows is like democracy - it's the worst possible system, except for all the others.

Twenty years ago?!?! You're judging Linux by how developed it was at the time you stopped using it twenty years ago?!?!? You DO realize that Windows 98 was the dominant Windows OS twenty years ago, and was what you used for Pro Audio work? Of course you do! We've both been on this forum for nearly that long!

Seriously though.... Maybe you're happy with Windows. That's fine. Nothing wrong with that. But Linux TODAY is NOTHING like our grandma's Linux of yesteryear. Maybe, rather than dismissing it outright, you could recognize that it is now a very viable operating system that developers are now starting to take seriously.

[audiojunkie]

But the most important is a workflow that adapts to any user doesn't mater if it's not experienced or an expert, it will give to each one what it needs, thing that in Linux is far from happening.

And that is precisely where Linux falls down. Unless you are an expert, Linux can be a total f**king nightmare. I remember the two Linux experts in the IT dept where I worked took a whole week to figure out how to get the graphics card on my Dell laptop to work as it was supposed to. That's probably more than 50 man hours to do one, simple thing. And these guys were the experts! What hope would an ordinary user have?

That's the main reason why Linux is widely used only by experts and server enviroments

No, it's not. It is used in those environments because it is completely customisable and can be tailored perfectly to the needs of the business. But it requires a serious IT presence to make it all work and to keep it working. No business without an IT dept would ever consider it and individuals like us shouldn't, either.

The thing is that it's fine until it isn't. e.g. I bet Linux wouldn't work with my Zenbook Duo's dual screens. I reckon it would require a lot of time and effort and it would end up just being like a second monitor, with none of the usability features Asus have built into it. And you can bet those sorts of issues would extend to a lot of the specialised peripherals we use for what we do. My Roli Blocks wouldn't work, for example, and I'd only be able to get basic functionality from my KeyStep.

An audio OS has to be made to make things easy and quick for the user, give performance and tools to make the musicians able to do what they need, where they need, how they need, and when they need, in the shortest and eassier way posible, and Linux doesn't fit on this area at all.

Of course, a user with deep experience on computers and OS systems wouldn't even notice of how complicated it is, but for a guitarist or singer or producer who only wants to make music, seeing a command line and a bunch of commands to learn on how to use each one because is the only way to get your system going, man, that's a real life nightmare and a total headache.

^^^^ This! ^^^^

"I bet Linux wouldn't work with my Zenbook Duo's dual screens."

Come on! Let's all be realistic! You're just arguing for argument's sake. Seriously, how about OSX? How about any OS that isn't Windows? Why not just say, "I bet OSX wouldn't work with my Zenbook Duo's dual screens."

[audiojunkie]

You only need a small handful of good VSTis.

And that's the problem - none of the instruments I consider part of that "small handful" will run natively on Linux. Not one. Neither does any host I'd actually want to use. And my Roli Blocks won't work with it, either. And none of my hardware VST editors are available natively for Linux. The list is near endless. And that's before I start looking for a Linux Window Manager that can hold a candle to Windows 10's Start. So what I'd end up with are VSTi I don't want, running on a host I don't like, using controllers that aren't any good on an OS that doesn't work as well as the one I use now. Sign me up!

Asus did that work for Windows and I bet its not less complicated than it would be doing it for Linux (but they didn't). Your Roli Block would have no issue if Roli would deliver their dashboard for Linux (It does run in Wine though).

But that's my entire point - Linux could be the greatest operating system in the history of the universe but if it won't let me run the things I want to run, it is a complete and utter waste of time. Asus and Roli live in the real world, that's why they don't waste their resources on Linux. What do you think you know that they don't?

I wonder why no hardware computer vendor ever got into this seriously. There are half baked Dell Linux laptops and some dealers specialized for that and thats it...

And if those little ventures had been successful, don't you think they'd have gone all-in? Nobody is interested because there is no reason to be interested.

For standard office work Linux is well suited since ages.

And yet, most who have tried it end up going back to Windows.
http://www.neowin.net/news/munich-germa ... to-windows
"the idea is generally that Linux setups are cheaper than a Microsoft solution as you do not have to pay licensing fees but what Munich experienced is that Linux was much more expensive... the city had to hire programmers to build out functionality that they needed and then had to pay the staff to maintain the software."

You are the PERFECT candidate for Windows. Use Windows! There is nothing wrong with using Windows......or OSX......or iOS.... or Chrome, or Linux, or hardware or a rusty hillbilly banjo. That's the beauty of it. Use what you like! You have your reasons, and that's OK. We Linux users have our reasons, and that's OK too! We don't all listen to or play the same genre of music, yet here we all are........at KVR.

To quote a controversial American figure...

"Can't we all just get along?"

Now back to our regularly scheduled (and derailed) thread....