Installers - why

[Paul_FX]

Like why in the world would Betabugs use installers? I still haven't tried their plugs because of it

Thats a shame. I actually wrote the Betabugs installers and i can promise you that they are very clean (basically all they do is copy the manual, dll and create a start menu item). But if you want a copy of all the plugins as just DLL's, drop me an email (paul[at]expdigital[dot]co[dot]uk) and ill send them over to you..

Paul

[Sascha Franck]

Like what?
I don't believe it for a single second.

BFD? Guru?

What about stuff like reaktor? Ever look at what that installs, lots of lots of files, dependancies everywhere, registry keys etc etc..

That still doesn't say it's necessary to do it like that. And if you ask me, there's a LOT of installers rather adding to the confusion instead of avoiding it...

[Ja.x]

When a vst comes with an installer I install it, copy the dll somewhere else, deinstall the bloody thing, and put the .dll back in the VST folder. The bottom line: installer is an extra hassle.

[soulata]

When a vst comes with an installer I install it, copy the dll somewhere else, deinstall the bloody thing, and put the .dll back in the VST folder. The bottom line: installer is an extra hassle.

Does it always work that way?

I guess some things have to have installers but for majority of vsti and fx there is NO need (for installer).

k

btw, visitors welcome

[Sascha Franck]

When a vst comes with an installer I install it, copy the dll somewhere else, deinstall the bloody thing, and put the .dll back in the VST folder. The bottom line: installer is an extra hassle.

This doesn't work for all VSTs. Unfortunately that is.

[Ja.x]

From the vst's I have only Vertigo did not work that way, so far.

[bduffy]

I don't mind an installer as long as it's coded properly!!! (nothing like going on a hunt through the 12 "INSTALL.LOG"s in your VST folder..).

And IMHO I can't imagine choosing to hand-copy complex installs like BFD or Native Instruments that need to copy to at least two folders, probably more. No thanks, I'd rather play music.

[declassified]

If it doesn't work the way Ja.x described, then there's two typical reasons:
1. The installer writes a registry entry which is removed upon deinstallation, but is neccessary to run the plugin
2. The installer copies other files apart from the DLL to the hard drive (perhaps to "system32" or to "Documents and Settings") which are removed upon deinstallation

In both ways you can solve the problem. If it needs a registry entry (like registration data) you can run regedit and export that entry to a ".reg" file. When you reinstall windows, you just have to start that file to rewrite the entry into the registry.

If the second one is the problem, just copy the appropriate files to somewhere else, uninstall the plugin and copy them again to the location.

To find out where the registry entry or the copied files are, just read the "install.log" (or however the installation log is called) using notepad.

This is very helpful when you are like me and reinstall windows every couple of weeks to keep it clean.

[shamann]

From the vst's I have only Vertigo did not work that way, so far.

I know Rhino doesn't work that way, nor does Vaz Modular. But both of those are also standalone apps, and in the case of Rhino, ships with a bunch of audio material and makes reg entries to point to them.

No matter. I can live with installers if they are needed, though I would prefer not having in most cases since it is then much easier to reorganize your VST directory on a whim. I'd also prefer .ini files, simply because the registry is big and ugly and a pain to have to troubleshoot in the event that you need to. Several apps even manage the .ini from within the GUI, so there's little need to edit it manually. And I can't see how it is so difficult to say to a user who has f**ked it up to delete the .ini file and then reload the plugin.

I just hate bad installers. Don't use an installer if, when I uninstall, it doesn't remove all the crap your plugin added to my system.

[speccyteccy]

Another vote against installers (unless they really need to).

I hate having to browse to my VST folder, then creating a new folder 'cos I'm never sure whether the synth will install to c:\VST or to c:\VST\synthname, and then when it does, I end up with something like:

c:\VST\synthname\vstfolder\synthname\vst\synthname.dll

Even worse when it wants to install to Program Files AS WELL as the vst directory.

Then after a few weeks, I decide I want to uninstall it, but forgot it had an installer, and just delete the directory. Then a few weeks after that, I'll find an orphaned Add/Remove Programs entry that I have to search the registry for to get rid of.

[LIMITAPROACHINGINFINITY]

f installers

[Big Tick]

When a vst comes with an installer I install it, copy the dll somewhere else, deinstall the bloody thing, and put the .dll back in the VST folder. The bottom line: installer is an extra hassle.

I know Rhino doesn't work that way...

Of course it doesn't. What do you think we use installers for ?

Here's a point to justify why you want installers. The reason some of us developers use an installer, is, hey, you users asked for it ! What, you didn't notice ? take some requests like that one: "I want the synth to automatically save its settings when I exit". Or this one: "I share my scala tuning files across several synths, so I'd like Rhino to remember the last path used for accessing its tuning files". This requires the synth to store additional data somewhere. And the easiest way to ensure this data gets removed, should you ever be bored with the synth and decide to get rid of it (god forbids!) is... you name it, use an installer. So if it's here, it's for your own good.

'Tick

[Stupid American Pig]

I dont see why people dislike installers. They are pretty handy. I use Wise 9 and install shield admin studio at work to repackage software. Installers are handy and can do some powerful things. They also make things easy for end users. Installers are much less of an issue to me than DONGLES. Those *really* suck.

[shamann]

Of course it doesn't. What do you think we use installers for ?

I wasn't criticizing you for it, just merely pointing it out.

[Big Tick]

Yep. Forgot a smiley here.