KVR Audio

bmanic · Post by **bmanic** » Mon Jan 28, 2013 11:30 am

djeroen wrote:
bmanic wrote:Argh! The SOUND QUALITY and possibilities with Fix are awesome but the interface makes me want to commit murder!
Too much flexibility I guess

The thing is, Melda Dynamic EQ has even more flexibility yet manages the user interface quite nicely.

Creating the user interface for this kind of plugin is indeed very tricky.

I'd say the first things to address are simple ones, like showing the exact center frequency for each node. Giving a clear readout of the current dB value it is set at (and no, the tiny number to the left does not count as one) and a way to lock and reset a node to zero dB is vital.

Same for the transfer function. Having a way to keep a node on the 1:1 diagonal axis is imperative. Also having some kind of reference number for where on the axis a node currently resides would be helpful. If for instance X axis is input and Y axis is output then top right corner would be 0dB:0dB.. or just keep to a ratio value instead, would probably be more intuitive.

Those are basically the main sources of frustration. Also the constant mention of how it works just like a normal parametric EQ (website and manual) which is not true at all. There is no Q/bandwith, instead the shape and bandwith is determined by the neighbouring nodes. Not a very intuitive thing at all and takes way too many clicks to setup a precise area of operation. Instead of having the zooming ability the "drag a box" would be better used to group multiple nodes together so that they can all be moved at once. Or just make the nodes work as ordinary parametric EQs with bandwith and all. This might not be possible though.. depending on the implementation.

Anyhow, the plugin sounds absolutely great! I really like the intelligent release algorithm and the widening thing is completely unique so I hope you'll continue working on the tool.

Cheers!
bManic

kylen · Post by **kylen** » Mon Jan 28, 2013 1:29 pm

I keep wanting to right-click the 3 nodes in the compression editor to set a value or ratio. If that's taken some other key-combo must be available - if we're comparing Melda I have to shift-right-click or something like that to be able to set EQ values manually.

The difference between parametric eq nodes and the 'center-band' nodes on FLX don't bother me so much except for the fact that it can cost me 4 nodes to set a steeply sloped range - 200-300Hz for example, in Melda it only costs 1 node.
I'm not sure how much I'd be using FLX to do that kind of thing since the UI seems to 'want' me to just select center-points in the various 5 freq range bands. Makes it fast to setup a split for sure which cost 2 nodes.

I'm running Reaper 4.32 on Win7 (32bit I3) and selecting between the compressor editor and the regular EQ view gets stuck, if I stop the audio playback then the switch will happen is a second or 2.

mabian · Post by **mabian** » Mon Jan 28, 2013 1:58 pm

Another vote for GUI refinements. For one, I don't like that clicking on a node enables it even though it wasn't enabled. A click is needed to give the node focus and check the compressor settings, I could want to check those settings without changing the enabled state of a node.

This is probably a winner soundwise (especially for the price), but the user interface needs tweaks...

Edit: what about right click to toggle node enable and leave left click only for focus / edits?

- Mario

AKJ · Post by **AKJ** » Mon Jan 28, 2013 2:01 pm

AKJ wrote:does this replace the JB Smash Pro?

???

if yes: the old gui was a lot more accessable...

bbaggins · Post by **bbaggins** » Mon Jan 28, 2013 3:54 pm

bManic, you left out one other feature that MDynamicEQ has that TB Fix does not: sidechaining.

This features allows for automatic complementary equalization. For example, I can insert MDyanmicEQ on the instruments bus, carve a hole for the lead vocal and key the sidechain off the vocal so that those frequencies dip whenever the vocal is happening. Low frequencies that don't conflict with the vocal remain unaffected, so you don't hear any pumping, and the overall instrument level can be higher without burying the vocal.

bmanic · Post by **bmanic** » Mon Jan 28, 2013 4:23 pm

Indeed. Like I said earlier, Meldaproductions Dynamic EQ is the most fully featured dynamic equalizer ever. It simply has no competition at all when it comes to features. The only thing missing is look-a-head.

TB Flex does sound/behave very differently though, making it very interesting.. and it has the widening thing which is awesome.

Cheers!
bManic

Tp3 · Post by **Tp3** » Mon Jan 28, 2013 4:34 pm

bmanic wrote:Indeed. Like I said earlier, Meldaproductions Dynamic EQ is the most fully featured dynamic equalizer ever

It look too similar to HOFAs IQ-EQ (at least in the way it operates. haven't compared them one to one).

Oh, and HOFA's got Look-Ahead...

Selfik · Post by **Selfik** » Mon Jan 28, 2013 5:14 pm

Never heard about hofa...looks nice!
Was thinking to get Melda but now...hmmm
bmanic what do you think?

Tp3 · Post by **Tp3** » Mon Jan 28, 2013 9:11 pm

Selfik wrote:Never heard about hofa...looks nice!
Was thinking to get Melda but now...hmmm
bmanic what do you think?

Well, AFAIK... he was there long before Melda (not to imply of anything... but MDynamicEQ operation was extremely familiar to me. I didn't know why and in what way. now I know...).

bmanic · Post by **bmanic** » Mon Jan 28, 2013 9:24 pm

Well the Hofa EQ does look nice but it's not anywhere near as flexible as the Melda EQ.. at least not when it comes to the actual dynamics part. You can change the whole transfer function in the Melda EQ which makes it about as flexible as you could ever imagine.

Other than that the hofa seems even more immediate and nice. If I didn't have the Melda one I'd probably consider the Hofa.

Cheers!
bManic

kylen · Post by **kylen** » Tue Jan 29, 2013 3:14 am

I finally ran some pink noise thru this so I could 'see' what I was doing a little better. If I put node 5 nearly over node 4 (both nodes turned on) and adjust the node 5 dynamics curve to limit (around 10KHz) - wow that's a really steep slope you've got there!

Anyway I did the same thing putting node 1 almost over node 2 at about 300 Hz or so, adjusted the dynamics curve to limit about 10-12db I think (according to the detector waveform in the dynamics view), then click on the bottom dot in the transfer curve to give a soft-knee and voila - negative ratio. I think it sounds pretty fine - smooth - natural, even though I appear to be compressing a fairly big bass & sub range in a full mix, 20-300Hz.

My only problem is that when I get the EQ nodes that close it's hard to select the correct one. Is there a way to put a node selector index on the gui somewhere?

Also, I wonder if it's possible to add a few more nodes, optional maybe to add a couple more, or delete them. If there were only 5 then it's not bad - but if you get 30 of them like CurveEQ then it's nice to be able to get rid of the un-necessary ones.

I think I'm really going to like the dynamics in this one - even if I just use it for split-band type stuff - would be worth it if I can get a compressor to make my bass/sub region sound natural but tamed!

Thanks

djeroen · Post by **djeroen** » Tue Jan 29, 2013 8:35 am

kylen wrote:I finally ran some pink noise thru this so I could 'see' what I was doing a little better. If I put node 5 nearly over node 4 (both nodes turned on) and adjust the node 5 dynamics curve to limit (around 10KHz) - wow that's a really steep slope you've got there!

That's indeed one of the great advantages of the underlying technology.
It can basically handle any filter steepness from ultrasmooth to
virtually infinity.

I have a question though. The compressor input/output graph now
has 3 nodes to set the curves. Is this something that you all value,
or would you prefer the traditional way of setting thresholds and ratios
(still being able to set negative ratios, obviously).

miro pajic · Post by **miro pajic** » Tue Jan 29, 2013 9:23 am

djeroen wrote:
kylen wrote:I finally ran some pink noise thru this so I could 'see' what I was doing a little better. If I put node 5 nearly over node 4 (both nodes turned on) and adjust the node 5 dynamics curve to limit (around 10KHz) - wow that's a really steep slope you've got there!
That's indeed one of the great advantages of the underlying technology.
It can basically handle any filter steepness from ultrasmooth to
virtually infinity.

I have a question though. The compressor input/output graph now
has 3 nodes to set the curves. Is this something that you all value,
or would you prefer the traditional way of setting thresholds and ratios
(still being able to set negative ratios, obviously).

Hi Jeroen,

first of all: Congrats on the new release and thanks for your great set of tools.
About FIX: I personally would prefer a "classic" way of setting the compressor (attack, release, ratio, threshold) because the nodes can be a bit confusing and a bit hard to handle with the mouse. To me the GUI just needs a LITTLE space below the main graph with the values displayed in numbers (which can be either 1)typed in by double clicking or 2) moved up and down by click dragging the mouse).

I'm also wondering why this is a dynamic EQ and not a multiband compressor. To me the main difference is that a dynamic EQ has regular EQ bands, while FIX "seems" to split bands, as in multiband compressors. You have bands which can be adjusted in gain and band width, depending on the crossover frequencies.

Not a biggy to me though. I somehow like the simplicity in it. Simple tools are more user friendly and often find its use for many years.

Besides that I find FIX to sound very interesting and I could get used to this plugin. The GUI is nice on the eyes as well.

Please add some number values below the main graph. Just a tiny row with all important parameters next to each other as numbers.

Thanks (also for the new awesome tape models in TB ReelBus!)

EDIT: Even more perfect, if the area with the nodes would be replaced by "classic" compression parameters AND with the click on a button switchable between the nodes, as seen now and classic view (attack, ratio, release, gain reduction meter...)

AKJ · Post by **AKJ** » Tue Jan 29, 2013 10:33 am

djeroen wrote:
kylen wrote:I finally ran some pink noise thru this so I could 'see' what I was doing a little better. If I put node 5 nearly over node 4 (both nodes turned on) and adjust the node 5 dynamics curve to limit (around 10KHz) - wow that's a really steep slope you've got there!
That's indeed one of the great advantages of the underlying technology.
It can basically handle any filter steepness from ultrasmooth to
virtually infinity.

I have a question though. The compressor input/output graph now
has 3 nodes to set the curves. Is this something that you all value,
or would you prefer the traditional way of setting thresholds and ratios
(still being able to set negative ratios, obviously).

valued a lot!

Skorpius · Post by **Skorpius** » Tue Jan 29, 2013 11:12 am

djeroen wrote: I have a question though. The compressor input/output graph now
has 3 nodes to set the curves. Is this something that you all value,
or would you prefer the traditional way of setting thresholds and ratios
(still being able to set negative ratios, obviously).

I would prefer nodes for the EQ part and traditional buttons or sliders for the compressor part. I'm pretty sure that would make the handling a lot easier and smoother.

I'm really glad you're asking for our opinion, thanks for that.

New TB plugin: TB-FIX(flex) Dynamic EQ