FALCON or HALION 6 ?

[EvilDragon]

E-MU sounds like E-MU. Falcon sounds like Falcon. They aren't similar at all, IMHO.

You should watch through all of Dan Worrall's Falcon tutorials, in there you can get an idea of the sound quality, if that worries you. I think it shouldn't worry you, it sounds great, really.

[fmr]

What about the fact that uvi gives you 3 licenses and Steinberg only gives you one. Halion 6 comes with a 25+ gig library and Falcons factory content is 600 mb.

UVI gives you a 100 $/€ voucher that allows you to buy more content. Which content will be your choice.

That said, I can't choose between one or the other. Both have their strenghts, and I think they even complement each other nicely. For example, I think that Falcon does a better job as a pure synth, while HALion is better as a wavetable synth. HALion is also slightly better in granular, although both perform very well in this aspect - but different.

[rasmusklump]

I have both and while I use Falcon daily in every project, I load Halion 6 maybe once a month...

[SJ_Digriz]

Halion is the better "Sample Editor" for mapping, wave editing and stuff like that. It also actually samples too now.

I like Halions wavetable more than Falcons. It's a lot deeper.

After that it's all in the synth engines and effects. Which aren't about the "sampler aspect".

I think Falcon is easier to program from a sound design perspective. And, I agree the built in FX are tops. But, when I'm going to sample my modular or something, I use Halion and Wavelab. I don't even consider Falcon.

[apeshake]

Thanks for the advice I went for Falcon and I'm not dissapointed - sounds amazing and the interface makes more sense to me than halion does. I've even dipped my toe in the lua scripting to make a simple note trigger delay (I was really surprised there isn't a native control for that - I couldn't find one, or any mention of one in the manual). I might get more into the scripting side down the line but for the most part the standard options seem to have everything I can think of covered.

I agree if I was going to be making multisampled instruments Halion would have made things a bit easier but I'm more interested in creative sampling and sound design and falcon beats halion in that regard with the better modulation options and better effects.
Also very impressed with the granular engine - I don't know why but I didn't get along with Halions granular engine at all while falcons sounds great with very little effort

Brilliant hybrid sampler/synth well worth the money - now I just can't decide which sound pack to get with my voucher!

[Echoes in the Attic]

Brilliant hybrid sampler/synth well worth the money - now I just can't decide which sound pack to get with my voucher!

If you ask me Atmospherics is the best by far.

[goldenanalog]

Ok! This has been a resourceful thread - I'd like to pose the question slightly differently:

I just bought Halion 6 as part of a package, it's up to 6.1 (Falcon is @ 1.4), and comes with a fair-sized chunk of material to play with -

Is there a truly compelling reason or reasons for buying both, or would there be too much redundancy between both to justify the additional purchase?

The very fascinating thing about Halion at this late stage of it's development cycle is that it's geared to *author* content that can be used as stand-alone products in conjunction with a free player - Falcon from what I've read is fantastic; but you need to buy (or own) additional uvi content to really make Falcon sing?

[goldenanalog]

To completely simplify the question: Falcon *and* Halion 6? Or is having either enough - no need to buy the other?

[starflakeprj]

Falcon is more complete, there's hardly nothing HALion has that Falcon doesn't have. I also think Falcon has a lot better effect section, and Falcon has FM synthesis, which HALion lacks, as well as far more expansions to choose from.

HALion on the other hand has a much larger factory library. It has, imo, superior wavetable and granular synthesis. And also the possibility to sample sounds, which Falcon can't (which is the only thing I think Falcon can't do that HALion can.

I have them both, and I think Falcon is far more intuitive to use, much easier to handle without peaking in the manual or watching tutorial videos. This of course when trying to create sounds from scratch.

My "short" answer though, is that if you already own HALion, I don't think there are any reasons purchasing Falcon. Unless you don't want any or some of the great expansions that are available for Falcon, or can't live without FM synthesis.

But I guess I didn't make it much easier for you now

[Sampleconstruct]

And Falcon also has the physical modelling oscillator (pluck synth).

[Gamma-UT]

To completely simplify the question: Falcon *and* Halion 6? Or is having either enough - no need to buy the other?

Halion's factory library is way more extensive than Falcon's. I doubt you need both, particularly if you are going to use it for the library more than custom sound design. Even then, Halion now has scripting which was one advantage of Falcon before H6 arrived.

I think Falcon is easier to navigate, though none of the power samplers (Kontakt included) are intuitive. I just find there's a lot of "why Steinberg, why is that function there?" with Halion's design that probably has a lot to with having made it to version 6 with the need to preserve backward compatibility.

How either handles MPE is also a consideration. Halion assumes you will be using Cubase's conversion to VST note expression. Mileage varies in other DAWs. Falcon is a bit cleaner in how it handles MPE. If you're not using an MPE controller then problem solved.

[gentleclockdivider]

PLayed with both , don't own any of them
I got the impression that Halions filters (ported from retrologue ?) are superior ..more mojo ..where as falcon's filters lack that oomph/drive ..iow they sound more surgical .

[apeshake]

I still love falcon and i'm pleased I went with it, but sample playback is not the main focus of the instrument and sometimes that is distracting. Despite having most if not all the same options as halion for sample playback you really feel like you're using a sampling synthesizer and I don't remember feeling that way about halion

I wish (but don't expect) uvi would add sampling capabilities to falcon

[Echoes in the Attic]

To completely simplify the question: Falcon *and* Halion 6? Or is having either enough - no need to buy the other?

Halion's factory library is way more extensive than Falcon's. I doubt you need both, particularly if you are going to use it for the library more than custom sound design. Even then, Halion now has scripting which was one advantage of Falcon before H6 arrived.

I think Falcon is easier to navigate, though none of the power samplers (Kontakt included) are intuitive. I just find there's a lot of "why Steinberg, why is that function there?" with Halion's design that probably has a lot to with having made it to version 6 with the need to preserve backward compatibility.

How either handles MPE is also a consideration. Halion assumes you will be using Cubase's conversion to VST note expression. Mileage varies in other DAWs. Falcon is a bit cleaner in how it handles MPE. If you're not using an MPE controller then problem solved.

It’s a little inaccurate to say that falcon handles mpe better since Halion doesn’t handle mpe at all. Like you said it can work with Cubase note expression where you can convert mpe messages to note expression but there is no mpe with Halion in any other daw. There isn’t even polyphonic aftertouch.

Falcons mpe is pretty well implemented, except for the fact that you cant use mpe expressions in mono mode.

[Gamma-UT]

It’s a little inaccurate to say that falcon handles mpe better since Halion doesn’t handle mpe at all. Like you said it can work with Cubase note expression where you can convert mpe messages to note expression but there is no mpe with Halion in any other daw. There isn’t even polyphonic aftertouch.

The workaround for Halion is much the same as with Kontakt or Omnisphere. Although it's a kludge, that is not the same as "no MPE at all".