Ozone , tell me why

[LeVzi]

In terms of loudness I know a few people who swear by Oxford inflator, but isn't that just a saturator?

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=560874

OK so I was half right, its a saturator and waveshaper lol In fact I think it was that video I was thinking of when I mentioned the inflator.

tbh I will give it a miss. After I read an article about loudness last night, seems its not so needed anymore as people think.

But here's the thing: Songs still need a certain 'density'. You don't want the listener pushing the volume up manually in the quiet bits and then rushing to turn it down in the loud bits - you want to even it out a little for listening enjoyment. Most music anyway. Just not to Skrillex loud anymore. Waveforms are not sausages.

Yeah I'm talking about making it louder not Metallica death magnetic loud

[MogwaiBoy]

Didn't that album have like 2dB of dynamic range

[dionenoid]

Err... I think he's talking about making music louder. Not just creating a loud distorted noise...!

This is TERRIBLE advice!!

It's a common technique used by pretty much all the top mastering engineers and top producers ; Having multiple limiters each doing a little bit, thereby having more control and less artifacts than when using 1 limiter that's pushed.

Or, to quote Mazen Murad (mastering for Rolling Stones, Muse, Oasis, Björk, Groove Armada and many more) :

"Don't just use one limiter," says Mazen. "I have two or three, each doing a little bit." This allows you to gradually scale up the limiting. Two limiters with 1.5dB of gain reduction could sound louder and punchier than the same limiter with 3dB reduction.

[LeVzi]

Didn't that album have like 2dB of dynamic range

I don't think it had even that much, it was just a mass of noise hard limited. lol

[Tj Shredder]

But here's the thing: Songs still need a certain 'density'. You don't want the listener pushing the volume up manually in the quiet bits and then rushing to turn it down in the loud bits - you want to even it out a little for listening enjoyment. Most music anyway. Just not to Skrillex loud anymore. Waveforms are not sausages.

If a song “needs” density (or in other words avoids dynamics) you would do this in the mix wouldn’t you?
This isn’t a task of a limiter or, to have it more subtle, a compressor…
Some of these tools, especially analog ones, do change the sound and you might be after that. If you want to keep the sound clean, multiple limiters wouldn’t help much btw., but if you like the coloring it could be an option…

[LeVzi]

But here's the thing: Songs still need a certain 'density'. You don't want the listener pushing the volume up manually in the quiet bits and then rushing to turn it down in the loud bits - you want to even it out a little for listening enjoyment. Most music anyway. Just not to Skrillex loud anymore. Waveforms are not sausages.

If a song “needs” density (or in other words avoids dynamics) you would do this in the mix wouldn’t you?
This isn’t a task of a limiter or, to have it more subtle, a compressor…
Some of these tools, especially analog ones, do change the sound and you might be after that. If you want to keep the sound clean, multiple limiters wouldn’t help much btw., but if you like the coloring it could be an option…

Personally I wanna keep things minimal for a reason, so adding a lot just to thick stuff kinda goes against what im trying to do.

But I kinda understand raising the level by bit by bit and not stressing 1 limiter out. Easy in the digitial world.

[MogwaiBoy]

But here's the thing: Songs still need a certain 'density'. You don't want the listener pushing the volume up manually in the quiet bits and then rushing to turn it down in the loud bits - you want to even it out a little for listening enjoyment. Most music anyway. Just not to Skrillex loud anymore. Waveforms are not sausages.

If a song “needs” density (or in other words avoids dynamics) you would do this in the mix wouldn’t you?
This isn’t a task of a limiter or, to have it more subtle, a compressor…
Some of these tools, especially analog ones, do change the sound and you might be after that. If you want to keep the sound clean, multiple limiters wouldn’t help much btw., but if you like the coloring it could be an option…

Yeah, I mean more in the "leveling amplifier" type of compression - essentially like slow fader moves / macro dynamics across the whole track. You can easily tell the mastering engineer to implement this (Vari-Mu outboard for example)., and you can easily do this yourself too. Sometimes I just automate the master volume up in the really quiet bits so there's no gain reduction at all, just boost. I make a lot of ambient music though so this stuff is easy to automate super long transparent fader moves.

[MissOptimyst]

Be careful when buying Ozone because perpetual license holders won't be receiving updates. Only subscribers will.

If you're cool with that, then by all means.

I'd also just caution that most issues in mastering start at the mix. If you're having trouble getting great sounding masters, the problems likely start in the mix and/or arrangement. Ozone would only do so much.

Ah thank you for telling me that, that's a deal breaker.

I would go with Fabfilter. I went with Ozone before they announced this garbage and now I regret it. Also I feel my masters sound worse for some reason. I was better off with just my ears and without any assistance from their tools...they seem to add a ton of mud that you inevitably have to clean up again anyway.

It’s a good tool to learn on but otherwise I feel it’s very overrated...

[LeVzi]

Be careful when buying Ozone because perpetual license holders won't be receiving updates. Only subscribers will.

If you're cool with that, then by all means.

I'd also just caution that most issues in mastering start at the mix. If you're having trouble getting great sounding masters, the problems likely start in the mix and/or arrangement. Ozone would only do so much.

Ah thank you for telling me that, that's a deal breaker.

I would go with Fabfilter. I went with Ozone before they announced this garbage and now I regret it. Also I feel my masters sound worse for some reason. I was better off with just my ears and without any assistance from their tools...they seem to add a ton of mud that you inevitably have to clean up again anyway.

It’s a good tool to learn on but otherwise I feel it’s very overrated...

Thanks, it's definitely off the table now thanks to their subscription system now.

[MissOptimyst]

Be careful when buying Ozone because perpetual license holders won't be receiving updates. Only subscribers will.

If you're cool with that, then by all means.

I'd also just caution that most issues in mastering start at the mix. If you're having trouble getting great sounding masters, the problems likely start in the mix and/or arrangement. Ozone would only do so much.

Ah thank you for telling me that, that's a deal breaker.

I would go with Fabfilter. I went with Ozone before they announced this garbage and now I regret it. Also I feel my masters sound worse for some reason. I was better off with just my ears and without any assistance from their tools...they seem to add a ton of mud that you inevitably have to clean up again anyway.

It’s a good tool to learn on but otherwise I feel it’s very overrated...

Thanks, it's definitely off the table now thanks to their subscription system now.

I ended up pulling the trigger on the Fabfilter mastering bundle. It’s 25% off. I am already so impressed. Right off the bat it sounds much better with my production than Ozone. I feel Ozone sometimes lifts weird transients.

[LeVzi]

Be careful when buying Ozone because perpetual license holders won't be receiving updates. Only subscribers will.

If you're cool with that, then by all means.

I'd also just caution that most issues in mastering start at the mix. If you're having trouble getting great sounding masters, the problems likely start in the mix and/or arrangement. Ozone would only do so much.

Ah thank you for telling me that, that's a deal breaker.

I would go with Fabfilter. I went with Ozone before they announced this garbage and now I regret it. Also I feel my masters sound worse for some reason. I was better off with just my ears and without any assistance from their tools...they seem to add a ton of mud that you inevitably have to clean up again anyway.

It’s a good tool to learn on but otherwise I feel it’s very overrated...

Thanks, it's definitely off the table now thanks to their subscription system now.

I ended up pulling the trigger on the Fabfilter mastering bundle. It’s 25% off. I am already so impressed. Right off the bat it sounds much better with my production than Ozone. I feel Ozone sometimes lifts weird transients.

tbh I'd love Pro L , and Pro Q, but I can't see me afforded them anytime soon.

I wish they'd do a pay per month option like Splice for their plugins individually tbh.

[martinjuenke]

Why not?

[_leras]

Err... I think he's talking about making music louder. Not just creating a loud distorted noise...!

This is TERRIBLE advice!!

It's a common technique used by pretty much all the top mastering engineers and top producers ; Having multiple limiters each doing a little bit, thereby having more control and less artifacts than when using 1 limiter that's pushed.

Or, to quote Mazen Murad (mastering for Rolling Stones, Muse, Oasis, Björk, Groove Armada and many more) :

"Don't just use one limiter," says Mazen. "I have two or three, each doing a little bit." This allows you to gradually scale up the limiting. Two limiters with 1.5dB of gain reduction could sound louder and punchier than the same limiter with 3dB reduction.

Ya, ok fair enough that's not so bad when you say it like that, and in fact some clipping before a limiter can be a help.

but that wasn't what you said in what I replied too.... which was basically:

"don't care about gain staging, clipping or peaks and run it into four instance of Pro L"

but... I mean, you can if you like...

You do harder styles right ? Use several limiters after each other, and mix into that.

Some guys even don't use a limiter at all, they just mix everything as loud as possible into the master channel and don't care about gain-staging, clipping or peaks.

But the important thing is to mix into it, and not try to make it loud afterwards.

Btw : I don't know which limiter you use now, but it doesn't really matter that much. Just know what your limiter does to the sound. Altho most i know use Pro-L2. Up to 4 instances of it.

[MogwaiBoy]

4 instances of Pro-L 2 in series... f***

On topic... Pro-L 2 is superb, as is Limitless - both are better than the Ozone Maximizer in my opinion.

[LeVzi]

Why not?

Lack of money normally has that effect when it comes to buying stuff.