Baby Audio Crystalline

[Andreya_Autumn]

I tried this, and think I will pass for now, but am happy to give some feedback.

1: Ambiphile already got here: The transient shaper thing is a good idea, but straight up doesn't work as of now. And I don't think it's just about how busy the signal is, the worst test case I could fine was on a piano playing mezzo-forte chords on each barline at a medium tempo. In this case, turning the transient shaper to the right or left has nearly identical results: a burst of noise at each chord onset. I'm not sure what's going on, but it needs more work. It seems like a good idea though, so I hope it can be improved. On some hi hats it seemed to fare a bit better.

2: The modulation dial could really use a log scale. The useful settings for me are all in the bottom fifth of the range. The top four fifths range from "way chorused-out" to "totally seasick", and I don't need precise control in that range nearly as much as in that bottom fifth (where I'll keep it 95% of the time).

3: I appreciate the frequancy shaping options! We can always load pre- and post-EQs for that of course, but some on-board tools to address common issues can save time. I find they fall a bit short for me, as they are now though.
First, I *always* want a high pass filter, and in this case I guess that function is meant to be filled by the "damping" control? I was getting usable sounds out of it, but the naming threw me off because this isn't usually what a damping control is for.
The bigger deal though: I wish the "smoothing" parameter could go harder! I often found myself wanting to tame some upper-mid activity which the tilt EQ wouldn't let me get at.
I'm generally not a big fan of tilt EQ for reverbs for this very reason, the EQ needs are usally more precise IME. The smoothing filters seem well designed as a complement though, I just wish I could dig down more with it! I kept that at 100 throughout most my testing and sometimes still wanted to dig in more. And when I need to load other EQ plugs to shape the reverb tone the motivation to use this plugin is lessened, since it's main strength seems to be the usable interface.


All in all, I like the sound of the algorithm though! Nice early density with a good transition/buildup, to my ears. I like the shimmer implementation too, which is uncommon for me. Good work, hope it goes well!

[sQeetz]

Crystalline typically runs around 20-30% lower than Spaced Out on my system. At the lowest CPU intensity, it's like our Super VHS plugin, which is a pretty lightweight experience

Hi! I have Crystalline, Heart NY, Parallel Aggressor and as I saw the deal on Super VHS I listened to the demos, saw in the compatibility section that the platforms supported included Apple's M1 and went for it.

Screen Shot 2022-05-10 at 22.42.19.png

As it turns out, after inspecting the component file, that it is not AS native.
Well alright, but it wouldn't matter that much if the CPU usage wasn't that bad... it uses about 20% of one CPU core just sitting idle. Is that normal?

[CrystalWizard]

Are you affiliated with Baby Audio?

[CrystalWizard]

Frankie.T
Are you affiliated with Baby Audio?

[Igro]

First impressions. Pop-up text is too small and indistinct in dark mode. Too much mouse travel required for controls. The waveform display is nice eye candy but it doesn't seem useful at all.

Sound is very nice and fits the name nicely. Modulation is weird, it has a very slow modulation that sounds like the Doppler effect and it's not something I find useful at all. It actually sounds like something's wrong with it and at first I thought it might be bugged.

To me the sound is sort of metallic but not in a horrible resonant way. It has a quite pleasing sense of real space, especially in the early reflections. Just wish it didn't have that janky modulation.

I noticed this too. Sounds like a very slow LFO modulation.

[Frankie.T]

Frankie.T
Are you affiliated with Baby Audio?

I'm an independant engineer, producer and youtuber, my reviews and video are 100% my thoughts.

[koolkeys]

Frankie.T
Are you affiliated with Baby Audio?

I'm an independant engineer, producer and youtuber, my reviews and video are 100% my thoughts.

I don’t believe that is what they were asking. They were asking if you are an affiliate. Your link in the first post appears to be an affiliate link, which isn’t allowed. So that’s what they are likely wanting to know. If it is, you should probably change it to a normal link to their website. Actually, probably should change it regardless. There is no reason to use a short link for a commercial product link here.

Brent

[Frankie.T]

Frankie.T
Are you affiliated with Baby Audio?

I'm an independant engineer, producer and youtuber, my reviews and video are 100% my thoughts.

I don’t believe that is what they were asking. They were asking if you are an affiliate. Your link in the first post appears to be an affiliate link, which isn’t allowed. So that’s what they are likely wanting to know. If it is, you should probably change it to a normal link to their website. Actually, probably should change it regardless. There is no reason to use a short link for a commercial product link here.

Brent

Thanks for the explanation, i've fixed the link

[Twan52]

I've also noticed the crackling sound mentioned by Ambiphile and Andreya_Autumn when using the transient shaper. If you remove all the LPFs (make the reverb as bright as possible) and use a sustained audio source (e.g. piano) with the transient shaper on, Crystalline goes nuts.

I’ve tested it on two separate Windows machines with different DAWs (AAX / VST).

I sent a video showing this to Baby Audio and was told that they couldn't recreate it and that they were going to 'keep an eye out for more instances' and then they ghosted me. Their attitude towards me as a new customer reporting a bug was a bit off putting.

Can anyone else recreate this using v1.0.2?

[Stenis]

I have tried the reverb and it sounds really good in Logic.
Can recommend it!
Stenis

[tom995]

Are you working on solving the cracking sound in combination with the transient settings?

According to the video description text of a Youtube user, this should not be the case. The problem seems to be ignored. Is this the case?

It took me forever to figure out it was the transient settings. This was very frustrating.

[Twan52]

Are you working on solving the cracking sound in combination with the transient settings?

According to the video description text of a Youtube user, this should not be the case. The problem seems to be ignored. Is this the case?

It took me forever to figure out it was the transient settings. This was very frustrating.

I think it might have been my video you saw on YT - Anton Russell? Anyway, I spent nearly two weeks going back and forth with Caspar at Baby Audio about the bug supplying 4 videos demonstrating the issue. He flat out refuses to accept it's a bug. Caspar has an answer for everything ranging from utterly ridiculous to plain stupid. I've copied an excerpt from one of his emails to give you an idea of his position.

In my tests Crystalline causes crackling on every setting (including with their own presets) as soon as the transient shaper is engaged and is being triggered by overtones. If the LPF is being used the crackling is harder to hear but it's always there. This is clearly unexpected behaviour (a bug).

The issue I have with Baby Audio is that this is the second serious bug they've missed which affects audio quality (the other being with Smooth Operator) so at this point I have zero faith in their products. There is no way on earth I would run my audio through any of their plugins.

Straight from the horse's mouth - Baby Audio's response (excerpt):

"Do I agree that there is a bug in Crystalline?
I still don’t agree with your statement – but I’m happy to explain why. The parameter is sensitive, yes. It is so sensitive, indeed, that it will cause clear artifacts in some use cases, and you have demonstrated two great examples of that. (I’m not at all arguing against the fact that it sounds wrong in your examples, but as I’ve said earlier, there are other use cases where it works great - and I believe this is how it goes for most plugin parameters in general. I think most plugins I know have parameters that can sound both right and wrong).

To give some context, I’ve copied in a recent review from Sound On Sound Magazine and highlighted the part where the reviewer (who is also SOS lead editor) mentions the benefits of this specific feature, Transients. He highlights it as a positive. I also refer to the presets in the plugin created by some very credible engineers who all utilized this parameter for their presets and gave us great feedback on it. Feel free to Google these people and check out their credits, they have worked with some of the biggest artists in the world. Does it make them oracles, no - does it make them better than any other use, also no - but it shows that there are different ways to look at the same thing. And that's the point I want to get at in general with this email."

[Jiriho]

Hi, wondering if you had found a solution to this bug you were experiencing with this plugin re. crackling? I just downloaded the free trial for the Baby Audio Spaced Out plugin, and I'm experiencing quite noticeable crackling sounds when increasing the intensity of the ducking, and even moreso when engaging the 'ducking/sync' function. I am also hearing crackling when I increase the intensity of the 'clean up' function on the reverb side. My computer is a Mac Studio with 64gb ram.

It's disappointing because this is a great sounding plugin, and I'd purchase the full version if not for this issue.

I've searched everywhere to see if other also experienced this issue, and found this thread for Crystalline, which sounds similar.

I have just emailed Baby Audio.

[Jiriho]

Are you working on solving the cracking sound in combination with the transient settings?

According to the video description text of a Youtube user, this should not be the case. The problem seems to be ignored. Is this the case?

It took me forever to figure out it was the transient settings. This was very frustrating.

I think it might have been my video you saw on YT - Anton Russell? Anyway, I spent nearly two weeks going back and forth with Caspar at Baby Audio about the bug supplying 4 videos demonstrating the issue. He flat out refuses to accept it's a bug. Caspar has an answer for everything ranging from utterly ridiculous to plain stupid. I've copied an excerpt from one of his emails to give you an idea of his position.

In my tests Crystalline causes crackling on every setting (including with their own presets) as soon as the transient shaper is engaged and is being triggered by overtones. If the LPF is being used the crackling is harder to hear but it's always there. This is clearly unexpected behaviour (a bug).

The issue I have with Baby Audio is that this is the second serious bug they've missed which affects audio quality (the other being with Smooth Operator) so at this point I have zero faith in their products. There is no way on earth I would run my audio through any of their plugins.

Straight from the horse's mouth - Baby Audio's response (excerpt):

"Do I agree that there is a bug in Crystalline?
I still don’t agree with your statement – but I’m happy to explain why. The parameter is sensitive, yes. It is so sensitive, indeed, that it will cause clear artifacts in some use cases, and you have demonstrated two great examples of that. (I’m not at all arguing against the fact that it sounds wrong in your examples, but as I’ve said earlier, there are other use cases where it works great - and I believe this is how it goes for most plugin parameters in general. I think most plugins I know have parameters that can sound both right and wrong).

To give some context, I’ve copied in a recent review from Sound On Sound Magazine and highlighted the part where the reviewer (who is also SOS lead editor) mentions the benefits of this specific feature, Transients. He highlights it as a positive. I also refer to the presets in the plugin created by some very credible engineers who all utilized this parameter for their presets and gave us great feedback on it. Feel free to Google these people and check out their credits, they have worked with some of the biggest artists in the world. Does it make them oracles, no - does it make them better than any other use, also no - but it shows that there are different ways to look at the same thing. And that's the point I want to get at in general with this email."

Hi, wondering if you had found a solution to this bug you were experiencing with this plugin re. crackling? I just downloaded the free trial for the Baby Audio Spaced Out plugin, and I'm experiencing quite noticeable crackling sounds when increasing the intensity of the ducking, and even moreso when engaging the 'ducking/sync' function. I am also hearing crackling when I increase the intensity of the 'clean up' function on the reverb side. My computer is a Mac Studio with 64gb ram.

It's disappointing because this is a great sounding plugin, and I'd purchase the full version if not for this issue.

I've searched everywhere to see if other also experienced this issue, and found this thread for Crystalline, which sounds similar.

I have just emailed Baby Audio.

[Ou_Tis]

I like how wide and smooth it can sound, but it's not lush enough for me. It seems more oriented towards a thin, bright, relatively simple sound. Whereas I generally prefer dense, dark, and complex reverbs.