KVR Audio

superddman · Post by **superddman** » Sun Mar 27, 2005 4:48 am

Traction is interesting but I have tried it before and just can't get used to it, dont know why

I wonder if the new tracktion will be much better.

birrbits · Post by **birrbits** » Sun Mar 27, 2005 2:00 pm

BONES wrote:
birrman wrote:Also, show me a vst composition I can't do in FL....
For most of us, it is more about the journey. FL Studio is like travelling from Sydney to Melbourne via Perth - fine if you've got nothing better to do but not exactly ideal if you have businees at the end of the trip.
You can get the job done in any host, workflow is the issue and FL Studio's workflow is somewhat convoluted, to say the least.

but I've never been to Perth

soulata · Post by **soulata** » Sun Mar 27, 2005 8:38 pm

Lunch Money wrote:Regarding the MIDI, I wouldn't say it's a "joke" but it sure ain't Logic.

Greg

Agreed. It's certainly not for MIDI diehards though.

A bit OT but:

what can you do in other programs (midiwise) that you can't in T1?

Nah, better: what do you do with midi besides basic editing, painting notes in, quantizing? (that's all I do anyway)

k

braj · Post by **braj** » Sun Mar 27, 2005 10:05 pm

I personally like Live4's workflow better than Logic. I have LE7, But Live4 is a resource hog, and there is no pdc or freeze. These are it's biggest downfalls, it would be nearly perfect if you added a freeze function. But if you want to work with loops or edit your audio and tweak it easily, Live4 is the easiest to deal with of any host IMO. And the midi isn't bad, depending what you are after it can actually be a lot easier to deal with than Logic, but ultimately not as powerful. Did I mention it's a resource hog?

Mr Sleep · Post by **Mr Sleep** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 11:46 pm

kpop wrote:Been in the same boat. Looked for a few years for an alternative for Logic PC, but just could not. So I did what a never thought I would do; got me a mac (a mac mini w. 1 gb legacy RAM). Switchgraded already a year ago to 6.4. and after reading a few horror stories on L7, sticked to that. Did not want to abandon my fav PC plugs so I noded with MIDIoverLAN to my old PC lappie (Tracktion as a host). Got also a Yamaha O1X, which is a marvellous piece of hardware (on the mac).

The result: great! I am still amazed how easy the mac was set up, everything worked (almost) out of the box. The mini mac is very adequate for my needs, is almost completely silent, and I can use all the old PC plugs in L6 like they were on the mac (no latency issues). Very happy with this setup, not a single crash s far. So if you wanna stick with Logic, get a cheap mac and just continue to work like you want to.

kpop

kpop, hi.

One small question, do you use the internal core audio to provide the latency playback?

Do you have any idea how the internal core audio of Mac compares to ASIO4ALL drivers?

original flipper · Post by **original flipper** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 11:55 pm

HI

I ran out of sharp razor blades when I was using Live4 for Midi.

Flipper.

Lunch Money · Post by **Lunch Money** » Tue Mar 29, 2005 3:15 am

soulata wrote:Nah, better: what do you do with midi besides basic editing, painting notes in, quantizing? (that's all I do anyway)

Me, too. That's all I use it for.

Roland Babbage · Post by **Roland Babbage** » Tue Mar 29, 2005 6:29 pm

Korg Legacy works fine in Logic 5.5 for PC here. Patches save using Logic's system and are recalled on reopening a song. Unlike with VStation and Synth1 for example. What problems are you having? I use only the Poly6 and the MS20 - is it the Wavestation that gives you problems?

I can sympathise with the difficulty of finding something with Logic's ease of MIDI editing. After all the buzz around Tracktion, I was shocked to find out how ungainly its MIDI editing facilities are. Then again, maybe I was missing a trick.

OMU · Post by **OMU** » Wed Mar 30, 2005 7:16 am

Roland Babbage wrote: I can sympathise with the difficulty of finding something with Logic's ease of MIDI editing. After all the buzz around Tracktion, I was shocked to find out how ungainly its MIDI editing facilities are. Then again, maybe I was missing a trick.

Believe me, it is true, you didn't miss anything. But v2 seems to have a much better implementation of midi editing functions.

braj · Post by **braj** » Wed Mar 30, 2005 7:26 am

OMU wrote:
Roland Babbage wrote: I can sympathise with the difficulty of finding something with Logic's ease of MIDI editing. After all the buzz around Tracktion, I was shocked to find out how ungainly its MIDI editing facilities are. Then again, maybe I was missing a trick.
Believe me, it is true, you didn't miss anything. But v2 seems to have a much better implementation of midi editing functions.

Since it isn't out yet, that's a bit hard to tell. It should be much improved, anything would be better really. T1's midi sucked donkey balls.

Lunch Money · Post by **Lunch Money** » Wed Mar 30, 2005 7:26 am

I still don't know what was missing. I've little experience with other sequencers' MIDI, but I've never noticed it to be "ungainly". I guess entering my notes and editing their velocity is enough for me.

OMU · Post by **OMU** » Wed Mar 30, 2005 7:55 am

Lunch Money wrote:I still don't know what was missing. I've little experience with other sequencers' MIDI, but I've never noticed it to be "ungainly". I guess entering my notes and editing their velocity is enough for me.

And how do you edit velocities?
One by one, click by click, hour by hour...

A simple line tool would be soo easy to add but...
I was asured v2 has it.
But, it won't be free

Lunch Money · Post by **Lunch Money** » Wed Mar 30, 2005 8:01 am

Generally, I play my MIDI in with a keyboard, so yes... if I feel a velocity change is needed for an 'off' note, I will go in to an individual note and change its velocity.

Sascha Franck · Post by **Sascha Franck** » Wed Mar 30, 2005 9:29 am

Velocity editing (which IMO is one of the most crucial things when dealing with tracks that you really want to make groovy) in Logic is almost unbeatable. The velocity tool alone is worth a fortune, and I'm not kidding here at all.

I am in the same boat as many Logic/PC users:
Get another sequencer or get a Mac?
I will do the latter.

I allready have another sequencer (SX 3) and looked into quite some others too. Sorry, none of them is making it - and I consider myself being quite interested (and partially talented) in learning new audio/MIDI programs.

Basically, here's the things it comes down to:
- MIDI editing. Quantizing, velocity editing and the likes just aren't implemented as well in whichever host.
- Editors. Actually related to MIDI editing, but well... you just don't find anything comparable to Hyper Edit. You can't open editors as floats in, say, SX. Etc. etc.
- The mixer. Compare the SX mixer to Logic's and you feel like sending mail bombs to the Steinberg GUI developers.
- Several small functions. I can only compare to Cubase, but, try to solo something in SX. Then switch solo mode off. Then back on... impossible to keep the same "solo selection" active. Let alone the solo function is completely bugridden in SX (could you imagine something as simple as that to be broken?).
- Plugin handling. Record a VSTi track. Now record some plugin movements (done on the GUI) as MIDI parts. Not sure about other sequencers, but it's impossible in SX (and no, recording it as automation data doesn't do it on a LOT of occasions). Do the same with a send knob... etc. I'm doing these things in each and every project.
- Audio to MIDI. Great, they just left that out in SX (it's been there in previous Cubase versions). I do a MIDI track of each kick and snare from real recorded drumkits, just for the sake of enhancing the sound. No idea about other sequencers, there must be something doing it better than SX but only Logic...
- Screensets. Exisiting in SX but bugridden to a higher extent (still working on a 100% reproduceable scenario). Many others just don't have them at all.

I'm sure there's several more, I'm also sure that some sequencers will do some of the mentioned things (as said, I only know SX more or less well because I have to use it for teaching) - but there's no sequencer doing all of the above. And personally, I just need them all.

Bottomline: I will buy a Mac one day. Can't see much of a reason to do so right now as 5.5.1 is still performing nicely with most plugins (and as L7 still seems to be in quite some bad state too) and I don't like the idea of running two machines parallely either (I just love total recall). So it's gotta be a dual G5 or nothing.
Fortunately I've got time to wait - even the latest version of SX is still buttkicked big time by Logic 5.5.1 in most aspects being relevant to my workflow.

original flipper · Post by **original flipper** » Wed Mar 30, 2005 9:37 am

HI

Logic Midi editing IE: Inserting, deleting & Altering note values is second to none - the actual design & magnification is/was practically perfect for INTRICATE manipulation of very detailed (and even basic) levels of editing - Tracktion only gives you a limited screen size to play with, even when magnification is enlarged - somehow I think even T2 will still sufer in this department because I don't think (I don't know - I am taking a guess) that the gui design will let you expand the midi view (or any other view for that matter) beyond a certain size, I am not talking about magnification but the actual area of screen - Tracktion like Live only expands windows to take up a % of the screen.

Cubase SX also lets you use the entire screen for the Piano-roll/midi editing page, it's what you get used to - I start to think about the nightmare of editing on a 1"x3" LCD screen using a hardware sampler - at least we have moved on past that stage (well most of us!).

Flipper.

PS - I always seem to follow 'Sascha' on these Logic midi editing post's - it's not intentional!

Logic PC:: Again