All good things come to those who wait.. the Synth Squad 2 thread

[Kriminal]

Isn't SS only available as a bundle? Will SS2 be the same?

[lnikj]

Isn't SS only available as a bundle? Will SS2 be the same?

I am guessing from Angus's answer that the answer to that is 'no', or at least. not initially.

I am assuming, Angus, that there will be a discount for SS1 owners for the first release, SS2(1), then another discount for SS1 owners + SS2(1) owners for SS2(2) and so on, then a separate discount for SS2(1) owners for SS2(2). Once you add in SS2(3) then the permutations get quite complex.

Or have I got that completely wrong?

[kevvvvv]

Angus .... this is an incredibly organic sounding synth - long way from TB-esque.

If I had a GUI to commission then I'd let the design be inspired by the organic sound results the excellent dems suggest

Making it full of functional sliders is very me-too in the tough world of quality synths.

Today is the age of "big blocks for little hands" - immediacy and ease.

Sorry about the lecture but your dems inspired me


btw Angus, while I'm chatting, please take full plaudits for the BFD3 masterpiece.

I'm helpless before it's sound.

All my other good Kontact et al drum gear lies gathering dust

I'd like more euro electro ish midi files please, free preferably, but might pay a bit.

[db3]

The color combinations and graphics on the GUI look amateurish. Was that done by a professional graphics designer or is one of the developers doing it as a background task?

Sorry, have to agree...it doesn't look like a commercial product. The knobs with false perspective are particularly bad.
While the visuals don't impact the sound (apart from psychologically), the graphics should entice and reflect the quality of the audio engine.

[_leras]

@ VORT3X - we're accepting applications for testers. Drop me a line on email.

sendy / softska / spaceman (and others finding the UI delineation insufficient for your needs) - is the attached any better?

Gui looks great. When can we upgrade! ?

[Angus_FX]

@lnikj

Still some details to be worked out. The key point is whether SS1 owners get all their discount on the first release & then pay the same as others for second and subsequent purchases, or whether we'll stagger that out (meaning SS1 owners don't get quite such a deep discount on the first synth as they might, but save more on the others). The former sounds more straightforward to me, but the Keeper of Spreadsheets may have other ideas.

@softska

Logic X and Live factory skins, so mostly dark-grey and neutral grey; Logic surprisingly easy to read with screen brightness half way down, Live I always have to turn up the skin's brightness setting a bit if I keep the screen brightness low.

And thus the curse of the plug-in developer: we have to play nice with all of the above.. plus the guy who works on Pro Tools in a dark studio, and the Cubaser with a bright airy composition space overlooking a lake.. and this is why we decided some time ago that bitmap graphics must die.

@kevvvvv will pass your request for electro MIDIs on. Regarding UI...

- We need people to be able to transfer knowledge and learning from Strobe 1 and decades of using hardware and software synths.

- Most of the time, mice and touchpads offer the best ergonomics for 1D, linear input. There is a subset of cases where 2D is best (think X/Y controllers), but 1D wins 90% of the time.

- Having said that, TransMod knobs/sliders offer a lot of additional capability which can't be exactly replicated on any hardware instrument (Nord have the nearest thing, indeed their approach was something of an influence on ours). And yet you can still bring all your existing knowledge along.

- Big blocks for little hands? Sorry if this comes across as elitist, but this is a musical instrument. Provided every control justifies its purpose, it can have plenty of them. Alternative UIs work well for things that don't fundamentally need a lot of parameters, but with Strobe the emphasis is on making it easy for people who have a reasonable idea of what they're doing to work with what's there.

I'll post some versions without perspective next week (advantage of runtime created UI - it's changing one or two lines in a config file). Did you never play Red Alert games? isometric. IMO it helps them stand out from the background far more than flat or face-on controls, but apparently it's not to everyones taste.

[lnikj]

@lnikj
Still some details to be worked out. The key point is whether SS1 owners get all their discount on the first release & then pay the same as others for second and subsequent purchases, or whether we'll stagger that out (meaning SS1 owners don't get quite such a deep discount on the first synth as they might, but save more on the others). The former sounds more straightforward to me, but the Keeper of Spreadsheets may have other ideas.

Doesn't sound very "straightforward" at all TBH. I think you are going to be fielding hundreds of support queries on this one. Notwithstanding the financial complications, how about:

If Strobe 2 comes out on its own first, is it going to work with SS1 Fusor?

I don't want to tell you your business and I know people can't wait to get their hands on Strobe 2 but you might find it easier, technically and commercially, to release all three at the same time.

Just a suggestion, not a criticism.

[lnikj]

I'll post some versions without perspective next week (advantage of runtime created UI - it's changing one or two lines in a config file). Did you never play Red Alert games? isometric. IMO it helps them stand out from the background far more than flat or face-on controls, but apparently it's not to everyones taste.

I played Command & Conquer

But, I don't think the perspective works that well either; that said, it's no deal breaker. I think you are doing a fantastic job with the interface. People have a genuine lack of understanding about how difficult it is to design attractive scaleable vector interfaces for any application, let alone massively complex synth plugin GUIs.

[db3]

Did you never play Red Alert games? isometric. IMO it helps them stand out from the background far more than flat or face-on controls, but apparently it's not to everyones taste.

Isometric? perhaps if the GUI was turned 45 degrees....Zaxxon
Using perspective is fine (look at Slate VMR), but it needs to be applied consistently across the whole GUI. Otherwise look at something like Diva, which is top down, but generates dimensional depth through shading.

[Funkybot's Evil Twin]

@lnikjStill some details to be worked out. The key point is whether SS1 owners get all their discount on the first release & then pay the same as others for second and subsequent purchases, or whether we'll stagger that out (meaning SS1 owners don't get quite such a deep discount on the first synth as they might, but save more on the others). The former sounds more straightforward to me, but the Keeper of Spreadsheets may have other ideas.

I'd think the most reasonable thing to do would be for SS1 owners to get an X percentage discount off all new SS releases. So for instance, let's say it's a 40% discount. They'd get a 40% on all of the new releases as they become available. That honestly sounds like the easiest and most fair way to roll out the updates. For instance, I'm a Strobe and Amber guy. Fusor and Cypher were always a little beyond me. So if I were to update, it'd be nice to get just Strobe and Amber and get 40% off of each, rather than getting some huge discount off of Strobe and paying full price for everything else.

[Sendy]

@lnikjStill some details to be worked out. The key point is whether SS1 owners get all their discount on the first release & then pay the same as others for second and subsequent purchases, or whether we'll stagger that out (meaning SS1 owners don't get quite such a deep discount on the first synth as they might, but save more on the others). The former sounds more straightforward to me, but the Keeper of Spreadsheets may have other ideas.

I'd think the most reasonable thing to do would be for SS1 owners to get an X percentage discount off all new SS releases. So for instance, let's say it's a 40% discount. They'd get a 40% on all of the new releases as they become available. That honestly sounds like the easiest and most fair way to roll out the updates. For instance, I'm a Strobe and Amber guy. Fusor and Cypher were always a little beyond me. So if I were to update, it'd be nice to get just Strobe and Amber and get 40% off of each, rather than getting some huge discount off of Strobe and paying full price for everything else.

+1

[Angus_FX]

Strobe2 is not a drop in replacement for v1, and will run alongside, but not within, SS1 Fusor. SS2's Fusor is shaping up to be a rather different beast.

@Funkybot wouldn't you rather get Strobe for really cheap, and Amber for somewhat less, than have an unused 40% off Cypher? Nobody will pay full price for more than one synth - once you own one, the others are going to be significantly less.

[dave dove]

@Angus_FX
as you are releasing SS2 as individual instruments
would it be worth considering offering the full percentage off the first SS2 purchase
rather than tying the discount to Strobe?

dave

[Funkybot's Evil Twin]

@Funkybot wouldn't you rather get Strobe for really cheap, and Amber for somewhat less, than have an unused 40% off Cypher? Nobody will pay full price for more than one synth - once you own one, the others are going to be significantly less.

In the scenario where someone may only want one or two of the new synths, it might be beneficial, but then the people who want to buy all may feel short changed. Plus, having a static percentage discount is just easier to explain/understand. Plus a standard discount on all modules feels a lot more low pressure, and less gimicky if I'm being critical. So yeah, my preference would still be a standard 40% off discount on any new releases. Who knows, maybe someone in my shoes would buy all.

Question: if these are a staggered release, what does that mean for Fusor? Will people who buy one or more, automatically get Fusor when that's available, or will that be a separate purchase? If so, what would you charge for something that doesn't produce sound on it's own?

[Angus_FX]

@dave dove
Yes, that's certainly under consideration, as is Funkybot's suggestion. I suspect it's impossible to please everyone.

@Funkybot
Early days yet, but the general plan is for Fusor to be a free feature for anyone with any of the instruments (you can only load the ones you own, obviously). That's how we're covering the layer/stack/round-robin functionality you get with e.g. Dune2 or Lush101. As the synths now have a fully capable arp/sequencer and fx section individually, those aspects of Fusor are somewhat redundant.