AES Amsterdam.JonHodgson wrote:I'll still insist you buy the first beer if Dave gets any of those emails I described though!
In addition to that, I will see to it that it's Belgian beer.
Fredo
Don't know if anyone noticed... VST3
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- KVRist
- 41 posts since 10 Sep, 2005
In addition to that, I will see to it that it's Belgian beer.
Fredo
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- KVRAF
- 4030 posts since 7 Sep, 2002
If the invitation was on VST mailing list then I do not care. I dislike discussion mailing lists. Somebody from Steinberg could arrive on THIS public forum, or on another public forum. Such things should not be done in a local fashion.Fredo Gevaert wrote:Yvan told me that the number of reactions was dissapointing, probably due to the overload of work they were facing with MacIntel & Vista.
Or better still, they could organize 'developer area' like Apple, Digidesign, Nvidia and a lot other companies do, with all important news broadcasted to developer e-mail addresses.
Last edited by Aleksey Vaneev on Mon Jan 21, 2008 5:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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- KVRian
- 591 posts since 5 Feb, 2004 from southwest england
another vote here for either LV2, or something similar.
We really do need an open standard.
It's always suprised me why with the plugin architecture you can't just write one plugin, and then every host on every platform be able to use it...
Kind regards
Dave Rich
We really do need an open standard.
It's always suprised me why with the plugin architecture you can't just write one plugin, and then every host on every platform be able to use it...
Kind regards
Dave Rich
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- KVRAF
- 1981 posts since 29 Feb, 2004
... With VST2.4 you can ... if a host e.g. Logic decides not to support VST2.4 is another matter of course ...daverich wrote:another vote here for either LV2, or something similar.
We really do need an open standard.
It's always suprised me why with the plugin architecture you can't just write one plugin, and then every host on every platform be able to use it...
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- KVRAF
- 8476 posts since 12 Feb, 2006 from Helsinki, Finland
+1daverich wrote: We really do need an open standard.
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- KVRian
- 591 posts since 5 Feb, 2004 from southwest england
if a large number of devs decide to just release plugins in this new format, I'd be very intrigued to see how long any daw would go without supporting it.asseca wrote:... With VST2.4 you can ... if a host e.g. Logic decides not to support VST2.4 is another matter of course ...daverich wrote:another vote here for either LV2, or something similar.
We really do need an open standard.
It's always suprised me why with the plugin architecture you can't just write one plugin, and then every host on every platform be able to use it...
for Logic it'd be a case of - "well at least it's not VST", and for cubase "at least it's not AU" etc etc..
Kind regards
Dave Rich
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- KVRAF
- 1981 posts since 29 Feb, 2004
... for a number of reasons already mentioned earlier in this thread I think that some VST developers would like an open standard which is similar to VST2.4 ... LV2 looks like a deviation from that idea ...daverich wrote:if a large number of devs decide to just release plugins in this new format, I'd be very intrigued to see how long any daw would go without supporting it.
for Logic it'd be a case of - "well at least it's not VST", and for cubase "at least it's not AU" etc etc...
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- KVRian
- 1010 posts since 6 Aug, 2005 from England
I'm still in shock about your saying here!Urs wrote:Also, once I doubleclicked the numerical gain value to manually edit it, it wouldn't respond to changes of the slider anymore. Hmmm.Urs wrote:Btw. I just built again.vst3, but I can't resize the editor window...?
Years of man-hours of work, and they cannot even demo a single volume control in an SDK?!!
What in the world is that all about.
Dave Hoskins. http://www.quikquak.com
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- u-he
- 30186 posts since 8 Aug, 2002 from Berlin
I don't know...quikquak wrote:What in the world is that all about.
I'm still looking for MIDI inputs other than NoteOn/Off or SysEx. So far I wouldn't know how to do something as simple as make a synth react on ModWheel, let alone a hold pedal or anything...
Mebbe they just forgotten that?
Hmmm.
I'm confused.
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- KVRian
- 515 posts since 18 Jan, 2004 from PHX AZ
*sigh*
Another meta reply, I suppose.To the AudioEase comments viz. PT, we dropped RTAS support from our product line due to poor sales and annoying customers. You have a particular product which is essentially a "must-have" for PT users, so your experience is absolutely not translatable to what Urs or we experience. To address the general market share of the major hosts, it boils down like this:
PT and its offshoots are approximately 20% of the DAW market. Logic is another 20%. Live has about 15%, and Cubendo has another 15%. Sonar and its offshoots are about 10%, DP approximately 2% (although that's hard to tell), and all the other hosts make up the rest, with FL Studio leading the pack. My numbers are for the United States only, and based on hard retail sales of boxed products. Since FL is available online as well, unlike all the others, the number for that is absolutely incorrect. But...
While it seems that FL Studio has a huge market share if you read KvR, simply because it is omnipresent here, for a cross-platform plugin developer that does both AU and VST (e.g. us), as far as the plug-in purchasing public is concerned, it is not much more than a blip, like DP. The vast majority of our customers are Logic and Live users on OS X, and the Windows customers use a mixture of Live and Cubase, for the most part, with a fair helping of various Cakewalk products. I would surmise that a lot of people that purchase FL Studio don't actually ever buy plugins. (This is also the case for many PT users.) As such, they're of little concern to me, obviously. Or this conversation.
Aleksey brought up a good point, though. There is a lot of difference between the person that buys a dozen cheap plugins versus the one that buys a single expensive one. Altiverb is quite an investment, as are the Sonnox plugs. As such, they can't really be used as a metric when the majority of us sell products that are under $100, and under $50 in most cases.
So, with that out of the way, on to other stuff.
I'm not sure how one determines whether a VST developer is "major" or "minor," but we weren't invited, and I think it's safe to say that we sell far more VST plugins than AudioEase does. No other developers I know were invited. I'm not sure what this invitation consisted of, but as far as I can ascertain, it wasn't on the VST dev list.
That isn't really important, though. What is important is the following: this SDK is a f**king joke. It is essentially useless at this point. The people that put it together did it so half-assed, it almost can't be called an SDK at all. The docs are comical. The example code (such as it is) crashes Cubase, the ONE PROGRAM it should work in. It is basically pointless to even talk about it at this juncture.
Another meta reply, I suppose.To the AudioEase comments viz. PT, we dropped RTAS support from our product line due to poor sales and annoying customers. You have a particular product which is essentially a "must-have" for PT users, so your experience is absolutely not translatable to what Urs or we experience. To address the general market share of the major hosts, it boils down like this:
PT and its offshoots are approximately 20% of the DAW market. Logic is another 20%. Live has about 15%, and Cubendo has another 15%. Sonar and its offshoots are about 10%, DP approximately 2% (although that's hard to tell), and all the other hosts make up the rest, with FL Studio leading the pack. My numbers are for the United States only, and based on hard retail sales of boxed products. Since FL is available online as well, unlike all the others, the number for that is absolutely incorrect. But...
While it seems that FL Studio has a huge market share if you read KvR, simply because it is omnipresent here, for a cross-platform plugin developer that does both AU and VST (e.g. us), as far as the plug-in purchasing public is concerned, it is not much more than a blip, like DP. The vast majority of our customers are Logic and Live users on OS X, and the Windows customers use a mixture of Live and Cubase, for the most part, with a fair helping of various Cakewalk products. I would surmise that a lot of people that purchase FL Studio don't actually ever buy plugins. (This is also the case for many PT users.) As such, they're of little concern to me, obviously. Or this conversation.
Aleksey brought up a good point, though. There is a lot of difference between the person that buys a dozen cheap plugins versus the one that buys a single expensive one. Altiverb is quite an investment, as are the Sonnox plugs. As such, they can't really be used as a metric when the majority of us sell products that are under $100, and under $50 in most cases.
So, with that out of the way, on to other stuff.
I'm not sure how one determines whether a VST developer is "major" or "minor," but we weren't invited, and I think it's safe to say that we sell far more VST plugins than AudioEase does. No other developers I know were invited. I'm not sure what this invitation consisted of, but as far as I can ascertain, it wasn't on the VST dev list.
That isn't really important, though. What is important is the following: this SDK is a f**king joke. It is essentially useless at this point. The people that put it together did it so half-assed, it almost can't be called an SDK at all. The docs are comical. The example code (such as it is) crashes Cubase, the ONE PROGRAM it should work in. It is basically pointless to even talk about it at this juncture.
Chris Randall
Plug-ins: http://www.audiodamage.com
Blog: http://www.analogindustries.com
Music: http://chrisrandall.bandcamp.com/
More Music: http://rtsixy.bandcamp.com/
Plug-ins: http://www.audiodamage.com
Blog: http://www.analogindustries.com
Music: http://chrisrandall.bandcamp.com/
More Music: http://rtsixy.bandcamp.com/
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- KVRian
- 515 posts since 18 Jan, 2004 from PHX AZ
Urs:
They didn't seem to add all the MIDI stuff yet, as far as I can ascertain. Keep lookin', though...
They didn't seem to add all the MIDI stuff yet, as far as I can ascertain. Keep lookin', though...
Chris Randall
Plug-ins: http://www.audiodamage.com
Blog: http://www.analogindustries.com
Music: http://chrisrandall.bandcamp.com/
More Music: http://rtsixy.bandcamp.com/
Plug-ins: http://www.audiodamage.com
Blog: http://www.analogindustries.com
Music: http://chrisrandall.bandcamp.com/
More Music: http://rtsixy.bandcamp.com/
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- Banned
- 22457 posts since 5 Sep, 2001
[DELETED]
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- KVRAF
- 1981 posts since 29 Feb, 2004
I get the feeling that the original VST3 was a continuation based on VST2.4, and then somebody decided VST3 needed a complete new specification ...ttoz wrote:and the were going to release it one full year ago, so it makes you wonder, what the hell have steiny been doing?
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- KVRAF
- 11839 posts since 23 Nov, 2004 from west of east
I would disagree, in that the process is going to make all the difference in the results. When the setting and modifying of standards is controlled by a small number (sometimes just one) of companies that have their own agenda, bad things are more likely to happen for those who are not participating in the process. In the end, those who try to control the process may find themselves faced with competition from an open standard developed by everyone else. It's certainly possible in this case.Crandall1 wrote:*sigh*
I'm not sure how one determines whether a VST developer is "major" or "minor," but we weren't invited, and I think it's safe to say that we sell far more VST plugins than AudioEase does. No other developers I know were invited. I'm not sure what this invitation consisted of, but as far as I can ascertain, it wasn't on the VST dev list.
That isn't really important, though...
We escape the trap of our own subjectivity by
perceiving neither black nor white but shades of grey
perceiving neither black nor white but shades of grey
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- KVRist
- 279 posts since 13 Jan, 2008
LADSPA ?We really do need an open standard.
JACK ?
Apparently, there are some legal, mostly non-controverisal subjects you can't talk about on KVR, or even mention in your sig. Unfortunately, the guidelines don't actually talk about them, so the only way to find out is trial and error.