Bye bye VST2

[gaggle of hermits]

which elicenser issue? that they changed was a big episode? how so?
rsp

they basically just said "we're turning off the licensing server in a year* because it's no longer convenient to keep it running. good luck finding a replacement for your copy protection. sorry you won't be able to sell your stuff. we're fine btw because we started our migration a while back but didn't bother telling anyone".

as I say, not exactly a partner you can trust.

* and I'm not sure it was a full year.

[zvenx]

I remember getting an email from refx to that effect.. I am not sure that was actually done though..
elicenser and its database is still being updated.

This for instance is still on their help page..
https://helpcenter.steinberg.de/hc/en-u ... tion-codes
rsp

[zvenx]

.....

KVR is a place where you can actually listen to what developers have to say about coding for various formats, and to come in and deny that they have a point is just arrogant to some level I can't even understand if I tried.

Where did I say they dont' have a point?
I am saying it has not been a hard transition for all.
I believe Audiothing for one said it publicly wasn't hard for him and he is still developing.
rsp

[gaggle of hermits]

I remember getting an email from refx to that effect.. I am not sure that was actually done though..
elicenser and its database is still being updated.

This for instance is still on their help page..
https://helpcenter.steinberg.de/hc/en-u ... tion-codes
rsp

someone better tell harry then:

Steinberg has informed us that they are discontinuing the USB-eLicenser which we used in most of our plugins for license control. Steinberg will maintain the server handling for those services until June 30th, 2022. For this reason you currently can not buy any of our products using the Steinberg Key. You can use your eLicenser licenses with our products as long as you like, and as long as the eLicenser Control Center Software is running on your operating system.
We’re currently preparing the transition of all of our products to a new serial based license management solution. This will take some time, but this will make the entire process of purchasing and activating products more streamlined as we've already done for TERA and CUBE. As soon as we've finished this these products will get into sales again and our users can update them. Below you'll find the latest updates for these plugins supporting Mac OS 11/12 and Windows 10.

at this point you can only buy tera and cube at the shop on the virsyn website – those being the ones that never used elicenser - (and iOS plugins via the apple app).

so much for being nice to Steinberg.

[urosh]

and we've seen it's actually doing them more harm than good as, had they left it alone, CLAP would have found it way, way harder to get off the ground.

I don't see how would CLAP harm Steinberg. In fact, their situation right now would be much simpler if VST is used exclusively by Steinberg and CLAP already became standard for the rest of the market.

BTW, this discussion for last couple of pages, whether VST3 was easy or complicated to develop for, is of secondary importance in my opinion.
Main questions are:
1) Was VST3 backward compatible with VST2?
2) If it is not compatible does it provide all of the functionality of VST2?
Answer to the both questions is no. Had either of answers been yes, we would not have this discussion, and any issues with VST3 development would have been relegated to obscurity of developer forums.

[seafire]

and we've seen it's actually doing them more harm than good as, had they left it alone, CLAP would have found it way, way harder to get off the ground.

I don't see how would CLAP harm Steinberg. In fact, their situation right now would be much simpler if VST is used exclusively by Steinberg and CLAP already became standard for the rest of the market.

If none of their hosts support clap, customers may turn to those that do....possibly.

[pekbro]

Honestly, i cant imagine why anyone would want a private commercial entity with their
own best intetests in mind, in charge of an industry standard. IMO thats a recipe for disaster.

[zvenx]

......
Main questions are:
1) Was VST3 backward compatible with VST2?
2) If it is not compatible does it provide all of the functionality of VST2?
Answer to the both questions is no. Had either of answers been yes, we would not have this discussion, and any issues with VST3 development would have been relegated to obscurity of developer forums.

Not on inception, but now yes.. It was mentioned in an earlier page...
iplugincompatibility.. (one of three ways I believe).

rsp

[machinesworking]

.....

KVR is a place where you can actually listen to what developers have to say about coding for various formats, and to come in and deny that they have a point is just arrogant to some level I can't even understand if I tried.

Where did I say they dont' have a point?
I am saying it has not been a hard transition for all.
I believe Audiothing for one said it publicly wasn't hard for him and he is still developing.
rsp

Don't be obtuse, it's pointless, you stated in direct opposition to developers saying it was not easy that some said it was, this implies flatly that they're in the wrong, you even went as far as to pull up a developer from 2008 to make your point. The implications of what you're saying is clear, that it's not an issue of VST3 being a difficult transition, when the overwhelming amount of feedback on it says the opposite.

[urosh]

If none of their hosts support clap, customers may turn to those that do....possibly.

Do you really find it is plausible that Steinberg customer would jump ship they obviously like just because there is another format on the market? You think somebody dropped Logic in last couple of years just because it does not support VST?
They can loose customers only if plugins are consistently not developed for their format, but that would mean that they already lost large fraction of the customers.

[zvenx]

To make the point that it wasn't hard for all.
I beta test for Urs, even before beta testing for u-he I had issues that I would send bug reports for, I know it was not an easy transition for them personally.

rsp

[urosh]

Not on inception, but now yes.. Urs wrote about it in an earlier page...
iplugincompatibility.. (one of three ways I believe).

This is different topic (also botched, 2->3 migration for customers should have been first thing to think about, and as Urs said requirement for developers to implement). I'm talking about developer perspective. Had VST3 been superset of VST2, none of this would have been topic outside of developer corners.

[zvenx]

Got ya..
So you think SB did it this way to be a pita or for technical reasons?
rsp

[seafire]

If none of their hosts support clap, customers may turn to those that do....possibly.

Do you really find it is plausible that Steinberg customer would jump ship they obviously like just because there is another format on the market? You think somebody dropped Logic in last couple of years just because it does not support VST?
They can loose customers only if plugins are consistently not developed for their format, but that would mean that they already lost large fraction of the customers.

I'm saying, it's possible, that current or potential customers could do, or be forced to, if synths and fx are not updated in vst format or even made at all.

That's a long way off, but that's a scenario I could think of that would 'harm' Steinberg

It was just a suggestion

I dont use vst3 nor have a clap host, and I'm happily making music everyday more or less, so I don't have a dog in any race...

[rasmusklump]

...........

VirSyn Releases First VST3 Plug-in

(Hamburg, Germany (February 11, 2008))

https://www.mixonline.com/the-wire/virs ... lug-408931

rsp

oh dear...

"Harry Gohs, VirSyn‘s founder and lead developer commented on the release: “Developing the update for VST3 was problem-free, and it was a very easy transition. "

rsp

... And since three of the Cubase included synths back then were based on virsyn synth I'm sure most of the work wasn't done by Gohs. Probably he got paid for such statements.