How important is VST3 support for you as a customer

[bM3w]

By the way, exactly what VST2.4 functionality is crippled in Cubase 6? Just curious.

For someone who condemns SB and VST3 altogether you actually know very little about one of the most important hosts out there. Heck, how can you even try to convince us with your book long silly derail of everything SB and VST3 if you don't even know about Steinberg's hosts in detail? Speaking of knowing your market

And sorry Urs, but I'm too disgusted with SB to play crony-ism with them. I didn't get invited to the "Beer Hall Putsch" like you did, so my original take on VST3 still stands.

Why would anyone who read your book long silly derail of everything SB and VST3 invite you over to a party? Unless - for whatever reason - a party pooper is wanted...

Let me get that straight: I had my share with SB as well and for a handful of good reasons I switched to the competition (which supports VST3 as well), but I can still distinguish between what's important in my world of making music and the personal objections against some people at SB and some of their practices. You, AD, seem to completely miss that quality.

[koolkeys]

well the only issue seems to be the consideration of whether the "built in" side-chaining feature is really a feature, or just another work-around.

Well, technically, it's a feature. It's an "official" method for something that was already available "unofficially", but that was commonly implemented easily with previous versions.

since we both agree it's a kludge,

Not really a kludge to use, but possibly a kludge to code. Though being a kludge to code, in this case, seems to be just an inconvenience more than anything. But again, only going on what I've read here and elsewhere.

a work-around and doesn't do everything a proper implementation of routing would do

Of course. Better routing in general is possible outside of the VST spec though, so I don't think of them as the same thing. However, I do agree that when it comes to inputs and outputs on a plug-in, VST2 can do the same for the most part(though from what I understand, some of the dynamic nature of changing input numbers, etc., along with bundling different versions with different ins/outs, it is actually more 'tidy' then VST2).

, then you're right, there is nothing to discuss.

You're right. Though my words above get more specific, in general, we agree. Sidechaining was never something I disputed much in this conversation, and it the whole workaround thing was completely on another note.

Brent

[AdmiralQuality]

By the way, exactly what VST2.4 functionality is crippled in Cubase 6? Just curious.

For someone who condemns SB and VST3 altogether you actually know very little about one of the most important hosts out there. Heck, how can you even try to convince us with your book long silly derail of everything SB and VST3 if you don't even know about Steinberg's hosts in detail? Speaking of knowing your market

Wow, you're a pleasant guy, aren't you?

I was just asking as I didn't know of any. Seemed once we established he was talking about side-chains, and the old 2.4 way still works, I guess there AREN'T any. So I was right.

"Know about Steinberg's hosts in detail". You really don't understand what an API even is, do you? It's so you DON'T need to know anything about a host to plug in to it. If I had to know every esoteric detail about every host I'd have very little time left for development. Fortunately, I don't, and just like any of you, I know what I like.

And sorry Urs, but I'm too disgusted with SB to play crony-ism with them. I didn't get invited to the "Beer Hall Putsch" like you did, so my original take on VST3 still stands.

Why would anyone who read your book long silly derail of everything SB and VST3 invite you over to a party? Unless - for whatever reason - a party pooper is wanted...

Let me get that straight: I had my share with SB as well and for a handful of good reasons I switched to the competition (which supports VST3 as well), but I can still distinguish between what's important in my world of making music and the personal objections against some people at SB and some of their practices. You, AD, seem to completely miss that quality.

I'm AQ, AD's the other guy. And I'm not sure what to get straight. Like some others here, you're not actually saying anything, you're just being insulting. Urs was asking about why don't I make a VST3 plug-in just so I can get on Steinberg's supported developers page (which is a list so small, it fits on one page, case in point) and presumably sell "10 copies a day" due to the exposure. My answer was, and is, because I don't make development decisions based on marketing criteria. Development runs this company, we are not driven by the marketing dept. If an idea is good for the customers, that's what we'll do. Period. I've already extensively shown why, at this time, I feel VST3 isn't good for our customers. So making a VST3, just for some publicity, would be joining the bad guys in their exploitation of suckers who think VST3 is important. Perhaps you don't understand what morality is.

This also has nothing to do "with your world", because you're nobody. Urs' question is only relevant to developers (and was directed at me). And I was making a little joke about not being invited to the party. It's a long walk to Germany from Canada, SB and us don't hang out much. I'd probably just stick my dick in their mashed potatoes anyway...

[koolkeys]

"Know about Steinberg's hosts in detail". You really don't understand what an API even is, do you? It's so you DON'T need to know anything about a host to work with it.

But there is a difference between knowing an API and knowing a host. You have seen the API, but don't seem to fully understand Cubase, which doesn't specifically stick to the API on everything, hence your question about what was limited.

So there is a difference, and in terms of that particular conversation, knowing the API didn't matter.

But I think the answer was satisfactory, right?

Brent

[koolkeys]

What I don't get is the constant need to either insult or dismiss those who do feel VST3 is important. You're insulting legitimate, intelligent users. Calling them "suckers" kind of assumes they are blindly duped, and that is absolutely not the case with many, if not most of them.

If you think that nobody actually has a need for VST3, you're wrong.

Brent

[AdmiralQuality]

"Know about Steinberg's hosts in detail". You really don't understand what an API even is, do you? It's so you DON'T need to know anything about a host to work with it.

But there is a difference between knowing an API and knowing a host. You have seen the API, but don't seem to fully understand Cubase, which doesn't specifically stick to the API on everything, hence your question about what was limited.

So there is a difference, and in terms of that particular conversation, knowing the API didn't matter.

But I think the answer was satisfactory, right?

Brent

Dude, I make plug-ins. I'm not host demo guy for Steinberg. (THANK GAWD!) I edited my post above to change "work with it" to "plug in to it", as that's closer to what I meant to say. The API describes what I need to know to do my job. That's its point. And we test too. But I really have better things to do with my time than become a Cubase guru. (As I've said, it's actually still my favorite host for workflow. But I'm afraid almost all my music time goes into the company these days. I play guitar on the porch sometimes, but if I launch a host, 99.9% of the time it's because I'm testing my plug-ins.)

[AdmiralQuality]

What I don't get is the constant need to either insult or dismiss those who do feel VST3 is important. You're insulting legitimate, intelligent users. Calling them "suckers" kind of assumes they are blindly duped, and that is absolutely not the case with many, if not most of them.

If you think that nobody actually has a need for VST3, you're wrong.

Brent

I dismiss those who insult me, and don't make any points. Apparently all these FACTS I'm throwing out here are a "book long silly derail" of somebody's love-fest. Derail? THIS is the topic, exactly. Excuse me for making my point with POINTS.

[hibidy]

Who'd like fresh cookies?

[AdmiralQuality]

Who'd like fresh cookies?

Oh gawd, me?

[trimph1]

I think that those who want that perfect system have a long way to go to convince a lot of people that VST3 is the way to go ...

[hibidy]

Who'd like fresh cookies?

Oh gawd, me?

They are fresh and made with love

[AdmiralQuality]

Who'd like fresh cookies?

Oh gawd, me?

They are fresh and made with love

[bM3w]

Wow, you're a pleasant guy, aren't you?

Yes, I am

"Know about Steinberg's hosts in detail". You really don't understand what an API even is, do you?

Sorry to disappoint you again, but althoug I'm not a programmer I do know what an API is and what the principle idea behind an API is. You're really not that smart as you think you are.

"Know about Steinberg's hosts in detail". You really don't understand what an API even is, do you? It's so you DON'T need to know anything about a host to work with it.

But there is a difference between knowing an API and knowing a host. You have seen the API, but don't seem to fully understand Cubase, which doesn't specifically stick to the API on everything, hence your question about what was limited.

So there is a difference, and in terms of that particular conversation, knowing the API didn't matter.

But I think the answer was satisfactory, right?

Brent

Exactly!!!

I'm AQ, AD's the other guy.

Oops. Typo. Sorry, I really like Chris and Audio Damage.

And I'm not sure what to get straight. Like some others here, you're not actually saying anything, you're just being insulting.

This also has nothing to do "with your world", because you're nobody.

Look who's talking! Do you want me to pull some of your other insults towards koolkeys or are you sober enough to remember yourself?

Perhaps you don't understand what morality is.

Now that was funny

It's a long walk to Germany from Canada...

Well, give it a try. That long walk will give you some tome to recosnider your stance. Oh and watch out for that big pond called Atlantic. Don't get your feet wet

[koolkeys]

What I don't get is the constant need to either insult or dismiss those who do feel VST3 is important. You're insulting legitimate, intelligent users. Calling them "suckers" kind of assumes they are blindly duped, and that is absolutely not the case with many, if not most of them.

If you think that nobody actually has a need for VST3, you're wrong.

Brent

I dismiss those who insult me, and don't make any points. Apparently all these FACTS I'm throwing out here are a "book long silly derail" of somebody's love-fest. Derail? THIS is the topic, exactly. Excuse me for making my point with POINTS.

I never insulted you. You made inappropriate insults towards me that were completely uncalled for, and unprovoked by ANYTHING I said to you. I made several points, but since I disagreed with you, you called me a child molester. In the past, people didn't like your synth and you called them warez users(ya know, the actions you were BANNED for?). And you tried to accuse KVR of promoting warez as well.

I see a pattern, and it has nothing to do with facts being brought to the table or not.

Brent

[AdmiralQuality]

Wow, you're a pleasant guy, aren't you?

Yes, I am

"Know about Steinberg's hosts in detail". You really don't understand what an API even is, do you?

Sorry to disappoint you again, but althoug I'm not a programmer I do know what an API is and what the principle idea behind an API is. You're really not that smart as you think you are.

No, I'm not as think as you smart I aren't.

I'm AQ, AD's the other guy.

Oops. Typo. Sorry, I really like Chris and Audio Damage.

I thought you meant aciddose.

And I'm not sure what to get straight. Like some others here, you're not actually saying anything, you're just being insulting.

This also has nothing to do "with your world", because you're nobody.

Look who's talking! Do you want me to pull some of your other insults towards koolkeys or are you sober enough to remember yourself?

Perhaps you don't understand what morality is.

Now that was funny

It's a long walk to Germany from Canada...

Well, give it a try. That long walk will give you some tome to recosnider your stance. Oh and watch out for that big pond called Atlantic. Don't get your feet wet

OK!