otiumFX Sonitex STX-1260 Released!

[bduffy]

I'm not sure I totally get this plugin yet...love the GUI...love the basher presets...I need to sit with it...perhpas it's mostly being a spectator of the hardware sampling years that I'm missing the intention of this plugin...

[Rune L-H]

Hi,

I'll give some brief comments to a few of the posts here..

----I tried the demo, and on some patches I don't get it, it's triggering samples of *noise* or something ? The filesize would indicate there are samples in it too, so I don't think I'm just slinging mud here. What is the deal with samples in this plug ?

Jeff

Yes, adding noise to the signal is one part of Sonitex. Vinyl noise in particular. Besides the selection of 20 different noise-loops (or your own wav files), it contains A LOT of individually sampled vinyl pops & clicks that you can control the level, density and stereo-width of. This in itself offer a whole new level of authenticity to the noise. But in my opinion one of the most interesting features of Sonitex is the ways you can integrate the noise with the audio, and use the noise creatively and rythmic. You can enable Dynamic Density that scales the noise density according to the input signal, or you can use a noise-gate so the noise breathes and "syncs" to the audio. This gate can be delayed in sync to the host tempo, and this allows very interesting rythmic effects.

Presets are much more dependent on the source material than with a lot of plugins. I can get a really great sounding patch on on one drumloop, for instance, that sounds like nothing remotely interesting on another loop. There are just so many parameters to tweak.

Yes! Sonitex is neither a preset-machine or a magic black box. It is a lofi workstation with high tweakability which gives the user the ability to shape the processing exactly to his specific needs and use it creatively.

-Why is the "speed"-knob in dynamics limited to 72ms?

The "ms" on this control is not directly comparable with the usual time settings on dynamic processors. You are right that it might be a bit misleading that I choose to go with a ms interpretation of the internal parameters. In other words... rely on your ears here, and just use the ms value as a reference between patches.

-To my ear the distortion module sounds are all too fuzzy. I don't know why but I have Reason's Scream 3 and Izotope Trash which both have more pleasant (yet similarly harsh) distortion.

I haven't heard Trash or Scream 3, but my focus on the distortion in Sonitex has been to offer good sounding and flexible models. The distortion attributes are initially based on basic features of different real-life distortion circuits, but from there on they have been tweaked to please my ears with no compromise. The Digital modes often sound harsh, but I totally disagree that Saturation and Distortion modes sound harsh...of course if you push it too hard it might. Again, a lot of controls are made available to the end-user, so I do encourage you to experiment and learn the settings, and then I'm sure you'll be able to dial up something you consider a pleasant distortion.

-Couldn't the pitch instability module have an option for only slowing down or only speeding up instead of going down to slow and then up to too fast like a vibrato. (With only slowing down you could get better scratchlike sounds)

You could perhaps experiment with automating the Intensity knob.

-Noise module: Why max gain on faders +3db? I have a loud drumloop and can barely hear the noise with +3db.

That surprises me. Are you sure the Gate wasn't cutting the noise? Notice that you can also boost the overall noise level with the Master fader.

For a plugin that's meant to "funk up" this is needs more personality and freedom to really mash things up! IMO.

If you spend some more time getting familiar with the controls, I think you really will find that Sonitex provides plenty of freedom and loads of various ways to mash things up.

Amidst the last fifty or so plugins that have appeared on KVR:s news list this is definetely in the top ten.

Thanks, I'm happy to hear that.

I just tried the demo... It actually was a waste of time... It's just another Pitchshifter, Distortion, Compression, Filter, Cracklesamples, Clicksamples, Noisesamples etc.
Nothing to do with adding some grit or whatever you call it to your stuff...

I have no interest in splitting hairs about the definition about "grit". The fact is that Sonitex offers vinyl noise in more flavours, with more control and authenticity than any other product I know of. It does this with new approaches to how the noise can be used as an integrated part of your track. And the noise is only a part of the whole concept, but I honestly don't want to spend time explaing how the other parts of Sonitex also offer new possiblities to the user. No point in that when it seems it is the concept itself that has no relevance to you.

After a few hours now of treating drums: Brilliant plug-in- lots of room to shape and twist with all those parameters, very well laid out, and great sound!

Well Done Rune!

Cheers pw!

I'm not sure I totally get this plugin yet...love the GUI...love the basher presets...I need to sit with it...perhpas it's mostly being a spectator of the hardware sampling years that I'm missing the intention of this plugin...

Or perhaps it has to do with musical styles. I guess the use of noise and texture as part of the musical content, is most often found in Hip-Hop, TripHop etc. But I like to see Sonitex as a very flexible plug-in that can be tweaked to suit a lot of other purposes.

Best regards,
Rune

[bduffy]

I'm not sure I totally get this plugin yet...love the GUI...love the basher presets...I need to sit with it...perhpas it's mostly being a spectator of the hardware sampling years that I'm missing the intention of this plugin...

Or perhaps it has to do with musical styles. I guess the use of noise and texture as part of the musical content, is most often found in Hip-Hop, TripHop etc. But I like to see Sonitex as a very flexible plug-in that can be tweaked to suit a lot of other purposes.

If I can just quickly respond to my segment of this response (thanks for the lenghty comments!): I was hoping that this plugin would allow me to apply somewhat beleivable time-travel to programmed beats, so I could create my own 70's breakbeats and use them in my mixes (or market them, who knows?). Now, I assume that is the case, but the interface is much deeper than I expected, and I can't just dial up the "70s" preset, so I'm sure if I just work with it and get to know its parameters ("Dynamic Density"???), I can create vintage-sounding loops - correct?

[loomchild]

I can create vintage-sounding loops - correct?

It's quite unlikely, so in the end it will all depend on what you feed the plugin with. The thing is that what makes vintage sounding loops and drum beats sampled from old records so peculiar is nothing that this plugin can offer. It's a combination of specific drumsets/room/mics/compressors/gates/channel strips/tape/anything used when recording and mixing the original material. In other words, if you feed the effect with breakbeats you have sampled off a 70's funk CD, you may indeed succeed in giving them a somewhat "vinyl-something" effect providing you don't overdo it, but it won't turn your dull sounding drum samples into a perfect replication of the drumkit sound from the Amen Brother track. Yet in good hands... who knows:)

[bduffy]

I can create vintage-sounding loops - correct?

It's quite unlikely, so in the end it will all depend on what you feed the plugin with. The thing is that what makes vintage sounding loops and drum beats sampled from old records so peculiar is nothing that this plugin can offer. It's a combination of specific drumsets/room/mics/compressors/gates/channel strips/tape/anything used when recording and mixing the original material. In other words, if you feed the effect with breakbeats you have sampled off a 70's funk CD, you may indeed succeed in giving them a somewhat "vinyl-something" effect providing you don't overdo it, but it won't turn your dull sounding drum samples into a perfect replication of the drumkit sound from the Amen Brother track. Yet in good hands... who knows:)

Hey! Who says my drum loops are "dull-sounding"?!?

Seriously though, I kind of got the impression that was one of the intended uses of this plugin, what with "pops", "clicks" and "vinyl". If that's not the case, then again, I'm not sure I got the right idea with this plugin.

[SongMonkey]

I think the point loomchild is making (let me know if I don't have this right) is that a lot more went into those great drum sounds than vinyl noise and bandwidth limitations -- you had great engineers, awfully good external gear, and above all, amazing musicians.

In other words, this plugin won't make you a better musician, recording engineer, or mixer.

It will, however, once you have a drum track that's up to your standards, allow you to add the sonic artifacts that we associate with the reproduction technology of those old recordings -- i.e., record noise, bandwidth limitations, etc.

I actually don't need to create the impression that I sampled my tracks off old records, but I am using the plugin instead to shape individual tracks tonally within the context of the mix, and it's turning out to be great for that. Sometimes that means adding noise to the track, sometimes that means shaving off low or high end with the filters, sometimes it means adding a rhythmic element from the noise/gate combinations.

Did anyone here download the original individual 24-track masters to David Byrne and Brian Eno's "My Life in the Bush of Ghosts"? I think they're still available for download. When you listen to the individual tracks, those things are FULL of weird noise and rhythmic schmatz going on in the background. Really weird to listen to. It's part of why that album sounds so damned amazing.

Well, for my particular case, that's exactly why I like this plug. It lets me control how much of that kind of weird ambient noise I put into my tracks, and when I do that well it takes my overall mixes away from a sterile sound and into something that sounds much more like an actual human being made it, just funkier and more interesting. This plug is another tool in that arsenal.

Them's my two cents.

[jones-y]

I can create vintage-sounding loops - correct?

It's quite unlikely, so in the end it will all depend on what you feed the plugin with. The thing is that what makes vintage sounding loops and drum beats sampled from old records so peculiar is nothing that this plugin can offer. It's a combination of specific drumsets/room/mics/compressors/gates/channel strips/tape/anything used when recording and mixing the original material. In other words, if you feed the effect with breakbeats you have sampled off a 70's funk CD, you may indeed succeed in giving them a somewhat "vinyl-something" effect providing you don't overdo it, but it won't turn your dull sounding drum samples into a perfect replication of the drumkit sound from the Amen Brother track. Yet in good hands... who knows:)

Hey! Who says my drum loops are "dull-sounding"?!?

Seriously though, I kind of got the impression that was one of the intended uses of this plugin, what with "pops", "clicks" and "vinyl". If that's not the case, then again, I'm not sure I got the right idea with this plugin.

It sounds to me like this plug is intended to take individual tracks (like drumloops, or whatever) and make them sound like you sampled them from vinyl on a technics 1200, into an EMU SP1200. That being the case, one would probably still need to apply all desired processing (compressing drums, chorus-ing pads, etc.) before you run it through this plug.

I haven't demoed it yet, but if I were designing 70's style drum breaks (which I do sometimes) or vinyl-reminiscent pitched instrument loops/riffs using this plug, I'd add this as the last of a chain of plugs, doing all the EQ and compression, reverb etc., beforehand.

I partially disagree with you loomchild, because, in essence, vinyl sampled into classic samplers is a very influential part of what makes those old loops/riffs/breaks sound so interesting. And IMO that's a lot of what's been missing in the computer DAW world. I do agree though that the major part of it is the original recording medium, recording environment, recording equipment, and post recording effects of those old songs, but to discount the contribution of the distribution medium (vinyl), and the second-level recording medium (classic sampler) is a bit shortsighted IMO.

I have an Akai S900 and an EMU EMAX I Rack, so one of the things I will do when I get the chance is do some A/Bing against sonitex's classic sampler algorithms.

[bduffy]

Hmmm, well, this is getting interesting...I fully understand and appreciate what goes into the sound of the older recordings, and if I had tons of time I could explore and maybe create some reasonable facsimiles of it, but if someone encapsulated that into a plugin, then hell, sounds great! I've done cheats in mixes that get loops sounding "older", but was just looking forward to an easier way. If that's not what this is, then it's not for me, probably. No biggy.

[jones-y]

I noticed 26040 is one of the selections for bitrate on the sampling page. Good sign!!!

[soma]

Wow! Sounds great. Wish it were free or cheaper because I don't really need it but it would be fun to play with more.

[Rune L-H]

I can create vintage-sounding loops - correct?

It's quite unlikely, so in the end it will all depend on what you feed the plugin with. The thing is that what makes vintage sounding loops and drum beats sampled from old records so peculiar is nothing that this plugin can offer. It's a combination of specific drumsets/room/mics/compressors/gates/channel strips/tape/anything used when recording and mixing the original material. In other words, if you feed the effect with breakbeats you have sampled off a 70's funk CD, you may indeed succeed in giving them a somewhat "vinyl-something" effect providing you don't overdo it, but it won't turn your dull sounding drum samples into a perfect replication of the drumkit sound from the Amen Brother track. Yet in good hands... who knows:)

Well, of course it depends on what you feed it. What you are talking about are the production tools etc, but Sonitex is primarily about what happens after the production, i.e. vinyl pressing & playback and sampling.

Sonitex does indeed allow you to give drumloops a "vintage" flavour similar to sampling from old records. But of course it isn't some magic wand you can point at any material and make it sound instant "vintage". It is a creative tool like any other. One wouldn't expect an emulated vintage compressor to take in a bad mix and throw out a classic vintage master. Similarly, desaturating a digital photo of Britney Spears will not make her look like Marilyn Monroe... However, sometimes desaturating a picture is the best way to to reach a certain style. And the same goes for music when noise and lofi are used as creative tools.

[jones-y]

Hmmm, well, this is getting interesting...I fully understand and appreciate what goes into the sound of the older recordings, and if I had tons of time I could explore and maybe create some reasonable facsimiles of it, but if someone encapsulated that into a plugin, then hell, sounds great! I've done cheats in mixes that get loops sounding "older", but was just looking forward to an easier way. If that's not what this is, then it's not for me, probably. No biggy.

When I shoot for 70's sounding drums, I:

1. compress with an analog style compressor (PSP VW),
2. eq with an analog style EQ (Hydratone or Valvetone, depending),
3. add a little room reverb,
4. run it thru iZotope's Vinyl (with no added clicks n pops tho),
5. overlay some vinyl noise samples,
6. sample it into my EMAX and then
7. record it back into my DAW.

So for me, this plug may possibly eliminate steps 4-7. I'm just saying I don't think its gonna be a one plug to vinyl sample thing. And I don't think (unless a dev puts this all into one plug) there ever will be.

[sinkmusic]

Wow! Sounds great. Wish it were free or cheaper because I don't really need it but it would be fun to play with more.

Same for me.
Beatiful gui, but i do not need many of the features, only the good-looking old sampler emulation, and some distortion..
I'd prefer separate 10$ modules (i won't pay for a distortion as i already have dozens of free ones, and izotope vinyle is good for adding hum, scratch, etc. (which i never use !). Or even better : a cut-out version of sonitex fully working and not time-limited (that woud allow us to make the sonic difference between this payware and the other free that offers similar features.
But the lofi bitredux part looks way better than every simple bitreduction plugin i have).

In fact, i still have the idea that most of those plugins can produce the essential stuff SOnitex is aimed at. So the question is : what does SOnitex have that worths 50$ (except the nice gui) that others do not have ?
(i mean theses ones :
http://www.kvraudio.com/get/571.html
http://www.kvraudio.com/get/2219.html
http://www.kvraudio.com/get/2083.html
http://www.kvraudio.com/get/2199.html
http://www.kvraudio.com/get/2198.html
http://www.kvraudio.com/get/2148.html
http://www.kvraudio.com/get/1976.html
... and i don't quote the free bitreducers & distortion plugins here.

(the intention in my post is not to discredit OtiumFX work -his plugins are nice-, but I think i did not yet understand what makes the uniqueness, and then, the price).

[seamoss]

I would love to hear some mp3s if anyone is bored and feeling up to it.

[jones-y]

the good-looking old sampler emulation

Yeah! I hope it sounds as good (or should I say bad...) as it looks. Its also the most important of all sonitex's features to me.

In fact, i still have the idea that most of those plugins can produce the essential stuff SOnitex is aimed at. So the question is : what does SOnitex have that worths 50$ (except the nice gui) that others do not have ?

You've already said it, old sampler emulation. none of the plugs you linked has that, and AFAIK, sonitex is only the second plug period (first is SD2100) to even attempt classic sampler sound quality emulation.

And I've had several threads discussing why the average bitcrusher fails at emulating the sound of classic samplers.