the theory is everything phallus see?

[vurt]

It's the effect on all 5 senses,

hmmmm, you do know we have more than 5 senses?
i believe the considered figure these days is around 20ish...

i dont need to search, its something ive researched for a while now, which was why i said "considered" rather than "actual".
either way you said 5, which even if we discount the "undecided" senses doesn't leave 5.

[vurt]

I'm not picking a fight,

me neither, you were wrong, i was doing my bit to educate you.

[Gregjazz]

Toxikator, I would recommend reading the book Free Play by Stephen Nachmanovitch. It gives you a perspective of music which connects these things which you consider not to be a part of music--I.E. the experiential, process aspect of music and more. It also connects music to life and all sorts of other cool stuff.

http://www.freeplay.com/Main/fpbook.htm

11 dollars well spent (or a used one for $4.25). Here's the Amazon.com link:

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ISBN= ... productiA/

[Toxikator]

either way you said 5, which even if we discount the "undecided" senses doesn't leave 5.

Granted. I was aware, for example, of balance, but never really realized that the Aristotlean senses were truly discounted.

For those interested in the "long" list, this is the most exhaustive I've been able to gather:

(Sight)
1) Light
2) Red
3) Green
4) Blue

5) Hearing

6) Smell

(Taste)
7) Sweet
8) Sour
9) Bitter
10) Salty
11) Meat (umami)

(Touch)
12) Pressure
13) Heat
14) Cold
15) Itch
16-18) Pain (skin, joints, organs)

19) Balance

20) Physical self-awareness

21) Full bladder

22) Full large intestine

23) Thirst

24) Hunger

25) (mostly in the blind) Echolocation, adapted from hearing.

Those 25 are the purely nonpsychological senses.

The shortest list I could find was the biochemical list (3):

1) Light

2) Chemical

3) Physical

[vurt]

and now see how far you have come in one lesson

[Gregjazz]

15) Itch

What exactly is an itch? I always thought itches were "all in your head." Is there some physical purpose/need for itches?

All I know is, there are probably terrible consequences for ignoring an itch.

[Amberience]

This thread reached eight pages, and we never did figure out why people get so emotional about this stuff.

It's the only kvr subject that predictably generates this much controversy.

Other than religion.

And politics.

And Mac vs. PC

And Warez.

And file sharing.

And using uncleared samples.

And MySpace.

And the middle east

And Trent Reznor.

And Christina Aguilera.

And vegeterianism.








And, of course, using loops.

Every sperm is sacred...

[cron]

lol.

Tell me ANYONE owns a copy of 4'33''.

Anyone who owns a field recording.

[Toxikator]

How do you figure? 4'33'' is :"performed" by a full orchestra + pianist in a concert hall.

[cron]

No it isn't. It's for any instrument or instruments in no specific location played for no specific length.

[Toxikator]

It's for any instrument or instruments in no specific location

Possible, I was working from the only performance of it I recall. But still, it must be PERFORMED, intentionally, or I hardly think it counts.

played for no specific length.

It is "played" for the highly specific length of 4 minutes and 33 seconds, AFAIK. When it is (was) performed, a stopwatch is used.

[cron]

Firstly, pressing record and stop on a field recorder constitutes a performance (ironically a more visible one than playing the piece on a piano). I don't think insisting on a performance is really in the spirit of the piece anyway, tbh.

Secondly, that it must be 4'33 in length is just plain wrong. The very first performance was 4'33. Cage derived the length of that one particular performance from the I Ching, hence the stopwatch.

[vurt]

played for no specific length.

It is "played" for the highly specific length of 4 minutes and 33 seconds, AFAIK. When it is (was) performed, a stopwatch is used.

the composition isnt even actually called 4:33.
the title is derived from the length, which if you look at the score and notes cron is 100% correct.

[Toxikator]

the composition isnt even actually called 4:33.
the title is derived from the length, which if you look at the score and notes cron is 100% correct.

the score does not define the lenghts of the movements, no.

However...

"John Cage's most famous musical composition is called 4'33".
It consists of the pianist going to the piano, and not hitting any keys for four minutes and thirty-three seconds. (He uses a stopwatch to time this.) In other words, the entire piece consists of silences -- silences of different lengths, they say."

(http://interglacial.com/~sburke/stuff/cage_433.html)

"My candidate may not make many other lists. But its ultimate influence over the music of the future may come to tower over all of the more obvious choices. It's John Cage's 4'33" ("four minutes, thirty-three seconds")...

Here's how one performance went: A tuxedoed performer came on stage, sat at a grand piano, opened the lid, occasionally turned some music pages but otherwise sat as quietly as possible for 4 minutes and 33 seconds, then rose, bowed and left. And that was it."

(http://www.classicalnotes.net/columns/silence.html)

"The length of 4′33″ is in fact not designated by its score. The instructions for the work indicate that it consists of three movements, for each of which the only instruction is "tacet," indicating silence on the part of the performer or performers. The title of the piece in each performance is determined by the length of silence chosen." (remember, we're talking about "4'33''")

(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/4'33)

[vurt]

yeah i trust wiki far more than the score i have in my hand...