Geist or Tremor - confusion! (done, bought geist)

[ZenPunkHippy]

When I get the audio file to the slicer, there are only 16 pads, and when using the transients in Geist there are more transients than pads, what do I about this?

First obvious thing to check is the sensitivity of transient detection (use the knob between divide + classify buttons). If too sensitive, you'll end up with too many slices (AFAIK slicing only works within the current engine i.e. 16 pads max).

Also, the length of your loop is important. If the loops is too long, there will be too many slices which means you'll need to use layering. The "Use Layers" button turns layers on and off, so if there are more than 16 slices turn it off.

How layers are triggered (all, velocity sensitive, round robin, random) can be changed on the Pads page. Select the top layer and you will see a zone layout. The menu at the top right sets the layer play mode.

Peace,
Andy.

[jontah]

gah I double posted by mistake.. read question below!

[jontah]

When I get the audio file to the slicer, there are only 16 pads, and when using the transients in Geist there are more transients than pads, what do I about this?

First obvious thing to check is the sensitivity of transient detection (use the knob between divide + classify buttons). If too sensitive, you'll end up with too many slices (AFAIK slicing only works within the current engine i.e. 16 pads max).

Also, the length of your loop is important. If the loops is too long, there will be too many slices which means you'll need to use layering. The "Use Layers" button turns layers on and off, so if there are more than 16 slices turn it off.

How layers are triggered (all, velocity sensitive, round robin, random) can be changed on the Pads page. Select the top layer and you will see a zone layout. The menu at the top right sets the layer play mode.

Peace,
Andy.

Ok is it possible to split it into different engine parts then? (should be?)

What I want to use geist for, is resampling! like in Ableton live, where you can just set a loop from lets say a disco tune and just keep testing different loops out and then put it into Logic using this plugin. As well as slicing it up and making a beat out of that specific loop. I've tried this by resampling the master in Geist but I just cannot get around how to loop it in the sampler window (to get it looping and setting a perfect loop that is snapped to the grid lines, so I can choose the best part and then export that)

the goal is to find a plugin where I can set up my collection of samples and slice and sample ANYTHING. I know that Native Instruments Kontakt is a great tool for this, but since Geist had this feature (and since I love Geist), I was wondering if this was possible?

Aswell as treating the sliced samples so that I can reverse it and add envelopes to it such as increasing the attack or the release (just like Ableton Lives simpler). I want to use Logic, but I got Ableton. It's just that I want to find something that works really great with Logic, almost like an integrated simpler such as in Ableton. I just don't want to close Logic and open Ableton all the time to sample stuff. Do you get my point?

Thanks.

[ZenPunkHippy]

A better place to ask these more technical workflow questions would be the FXpansion forum ...

http://www.fxpansion.com/forum/index.php

is it possible to split it into different engine parts then? (should be?)

Checked the manual ... looks like slicing is limited to the current engine.

Geist is able to resample, but it's not quite the same as working directly in Live because it's a 3rd party plugin. Logic already has a built in function Convert to Sampler Track which converts an audio region, with adjustable transient detection, to an EXS24 sampler instrument with the required MIDI to capture the groove.

EXS24 is great, but Geist is much more flexible and can do most if not all of the things you want. I'm not sure if it's possible to replicate the workflow you are used to in Live.

What I would try is placing the audio file on an audio channel with Splitter, set up Geist to receive from splitter.

Set the Logic cycle point to the area of the track I want to capture, so that only this area plays. Set the Geist sampler to "Host" mode so that the sampler starts and stops with the Logic transport. Set the recording source to splitter, arm and hit play for one loop. Stop. You now have the audio between cycle points in Geist, ready to slice.

Peace,
Andy.

[pdxindy]

If you have a loop, just import it into Geist straight to the slicer...

regarding the slicer, the 16 slice limit is the weak point of Geist. FXPansion is not very communicative or really expressing understanding of the value of being able to send slices across engines. They do say it is on the feature list.

You can manually slice and send the first 16 to engine 1 and then repeat and send the next 16 to engine 2...

I do not often extract more than 16 sounds from a sample/loop so it is only a tiny frustration for me. Even though Ableton Live can do more than 16 automatically, I still would use Geist cause though it is more work initially, I like the workflow much better in Geist for subsequent tweaking. I really like the effects in Geist too...

[jontah]

A better place to ask these more technical workflow questions would be the FXpansion forum ...

http://www.fxpansion.com/forum/index.php

is it possible to split it into different engine parts then? (should be?)

Checked the manual ... looks like slicing is limited to the current engine.

Geist is able to resample, but it's not quite the same as working directly in Live because it's a 3rd party plugin. Logic already has a built in function Convert to Sampler Track which converts an audio region, with adjustable transient detection, to an EXS24 sampler instrument with the required MIDI to capture the groove.

EXS24 is great, but Geist is much more flexible and can do most if not all of the things you want. I'm not sure if it's possible to replicate the workflow you are used to in Live.

What I would try is placing the audio file on an audio channel with Splitter, set up Geist to receive from splitter.

Set the Logic cycle point to the area of the track I want to capture, so that only this area plays. Set the Geist sampler to "Host" mode so that the sampler starts and stops with the Logic transport. Set the recording source to splitter, arm and hit play for one loop. Stop. You now have the audio between cycle points in Geist, ready to slice.

Peace,
Andy.

yeah this works, but what I am looking for is a technique to simply find a good sample spot to use, something like this:

@ 3.10, look what he is doing, he is simply "finding" a good spot of a sample that he can use. I was thinking that IF this was possible within Geist, I don't have to open up Ableton while in Logic to do this. Because I logic in order to edit THAT slice, you'll have to make a separate bounce to lets say reverse it.

I was interested if this was possible directly in Geist, because then I would have an all-in-one package, just by using Geist! At the moment it seems that Kontakt5 is better at this than Geist is, because in Kontakt this is possible.. but I want to use geist

I really love Ableton too, but I want to use Logic.. Logic's mixer and all that feels so much more solid for me, eventhough Ableton is quick and easy aswell. I just cant be arsed to open up Ableton all the time, when I need to sample.

I've been thinking about rewiring, just use Ableton as a pure sampler since it's so quick and unique.. but then that would mean I would have to setup a default template that is adjusted for that specific rewiring with Ableton, and also that would really slow down the computer, to keep Ableton up all the time in parallel with Logic, wouldn't it? what's your suggestion on this? I need to find a solution, lols.

[jontah]

If you have a loop, just import it into Geist straight to the slicer...

regarding the slicer, the 16 slice limit is the weak point of Geist. FXPansion is not very communicative or really expressing understanding of the value of being able to send slices across engines. They do say it is on the feature list.

You can manually slice and send the first 16 to engine 1 and then repeat and send the next 16 to engine 2...

I do not often extract more than 16 sounds from a sample/loop so it is only a tiny frustration for me. Even though Ableton Live can do more than 16 automatically, I still would use Geist cause though it is more work initially, I like the workflow much better in Geist for subsequent tweaking. I really like the effects in Geist too...

Yeah but lets say I want to resample a bassline or lets say I'm importing a whole break from a track or just the intro and I want to find good loops from that..

[pdxindy]

If you have a loop, just import it into Geist straight to the slicer...

regarding the slicer, the 16 slice limit is the weak point of Geist. FXPansion is not very communicative or really expressing understanding of the value of being able to send slices across engines. They do say it is on the feature list.

You can manually slice and send the first 16 to engine 1 and then repeat and send the next 16 to engine 2...

I do not often extract more than 16 sounds from a sample/loop so it is only a tiny frustration for me. Even though Ableton Live can do more than 16 automatically, I still would use Geist cause though it is more work initially, I like the workflow much better in Geist for subsequent tweaking. I really like the effects in Geist too...

Yeah but lets say I want to resample a bassline or lets say I'm importing a whole break from a track or just the intro and I want to find good loops from that..

I think re-sampling a bassline in Geist is great... I think you can do everything you might want in Geist. It is easy to slice manually when you have longer melodic material...

The thing is, nothing is perfect in every area... Some things Live is better... some things Geist is better... etc... and everyones tasks are a bit different. You have to find what works best for you.

I own Kontakt and I have far more fun in Geist than I ever did in Kontakt. I stopped using it and took it off my machine. I don't use big libraries and Kontakt does not sample... Geist rocks (IMO)

[jontah]

If you have a loop, just import it into Geist straight to the slicer...

regarding the slicer, the 16 slice limit is the weak point of Geist. FXPansion is not very communicative or really expressing understanding of the value of being able to send slices across engines. They do say it is on the feature list.

You can manually slice and send the first 16 to engine 1 and then repeat and send the next 16 to engine 2...

I do not often extract more than 16 sounds from a sample/loop so it is only a tiny frustration for me. Even though Ableton Live can do more than 16 automatically, I still would use Geist cause though it is more work initially, I like the workflow much better in Geist for subsequent tweaking. I really like the effects in Geist too...

Yeah but lets say I want to resample a bassline or lets say I'm importing a whole break from a track or just the intro and I want to find good loops from that..

I think re-sampling a bassline in Geist is great... I think you can do everything you might want in Geist. It is easy to slice manually when you have longer melodic material...

The thing is, nothing is perfect in every area... Some things Live is better... some things Geist is better... etc... and everyones tasks are a bit different. You have to find what works best for you.

I own Kontakt and I have far more fun in Geist than I ever did in Kontakt. I stopped using it and took it off my machine. I don't use big libraries and Kontakt does not sample... Geist rocks (IMO)

This is true.

But lets say I want to cut a whole song such as this:



and I want to find bits of it to use in Glitch electro-house or something else, how would you do this?

Would you record the whole thing or would you slice it up in Logic first? so it's exactly lets say 1 or 2 beats playing of your favorite parts of the sample?

THIS is what I mean. Since I got the whole sample inside of geist, how do I set a loop and audition the loop I like and want to slice and process?

Anyways, it would be interesting to see what you guys would have done in my case.. I gotta find some good way of doing this

Also, is there any recommendations of what to sample? I find it hard to sound good on any of my samples actually lol, eventhough the actual samples sounds good chopped up, it doesn't sound good when I play it in a pattern (using the song above that I linked).

There's alot of vocals in there, is it recommended to NOT sample the vocals or part of the vocals?

I understand that this piece of software is mainly for beats, but I want to use it like a real sampler, just like MPC or Maschine or any other sampler.

[ZenPunkHippy]

THIS is what I mean. Since I got the whole sample inside of geist, how do I set a loop and audition the loop I like and want to slice and process?

Step by step ...

1. Load the long loop in to a pad
2. Go to the Pad/Layers page
- the file is displayed in the wave view
3. Use the yellow markers to define a loop
- click the pad to audition the current loop
- find the loop you want to slice
4. The pad now contains a huge sample, but is limited to the short loop
5. Open Sampler mode
6. Settings:

- trigger mode: Immediate
- source: Resample master
7. Click the Arm button
- recording begins because "Immediate" mode is active
8. Trigger the pad once
- the short loop is recorded in to the sampler
9. Stop recording
10. The yellow loop indicators are now visible in the sampler view
- use these to further refine the loop if necessary
11. Slice it how you want it

Job done.

Peace,
Andy.

[jontah]

THIS is what I mean. Since I got the whole sample inside of geist, how do I set a loop and audition the loop I like and want to slice and process?

Step by step ...

1. Load the long loop in to a pad
2. Go to the Pad/Layers page
- the file is displayed in the wave view
3. Use the yellow markers to define a loop
- click the pad to audition the current loop
- find the loop you want to slice
4. The pad now contains a huge sample, but is limited to the short loop
5. Open Sampler mode
6. Settings:

- trigger mode: Immediate
- source: Resample master
7. Click the Arm button
- recording begins because "Immediate" mode is active
8. Trigger the pad once
- the short loop is recorded in to the sampler
9. Stop recording
10. The yellow loop indicators are now visible in the sampler view
- use these to further refine the loop if necessary
11. Slice it how you want it

Job done.

Peace,
Andy.

wow that's EXACTLY what I meant! Thanks alot for this Andy!

What I'm wondering though, is.. can I snap the loop markers to some kind of grid or bar?

And, can I lock it so I can just move it around freely, trying new places where it might fit better? this was what I meant, in the end I finally could explain it, I hope? lol. I did define a loop, but how do I move that loop around without having to re-set the loop the whole time? you get my point? in Ableton Live you can just move a prefectly quantized loop around and try different bits and audition them.

Also, can I quantize or warp or anything like that in Geist? that would be awsome (I don't expect geist to have this feature) hehe.

Thanks for all the help so far! really helped. Hoping for the loop brackets to be movable

[ZenPunkHippy]

To move the loop section: hold own down the Option (Alt) key, click and drag one of the yellow loop markers.

Yes, Geist has time stretching - see the Pads/Layers page, it's disabled by default. Page 54 of the manual.

Don't know about snap to grid, can't find anything in the manual (which is really well written, btw - I would recommend reading it!!!).

Peace,
Andy.

[jontah]

To move the loop section: hold own down the Option (Alt) key, click and drag one of the yellow loop markers.

Yes, Geist has time stretching - see the Pads/Layers page, it's disabled by default. Page 54 of the manual.

Don't know about snap to grid, can't find anything in the manual (which is really well written, btw - I would recommend reading it!!!).

Peace,
Andy.

wow you really helped me out here, THANKS A MILLION! learned so much from you in just a few minutes!!

Again huge thanks, this will be so much fun now! I'll definately read through the manual. Amazing stuff!!! This was exactly what I was looking for!!

The last thing I wonder is if there's a stop button? I know by pressing spacebar and then space again the audio stops since it's synced with the DAW. and also the "stop preview" button. But what if I want to stop all of the audio from geist? is there any command or button for this? as well as the start button.

lets say I import a whole song (like I did in the example you described for me), and I press one of the pads. It won't ever stop playing, unless I clear the pad. hehe. really annoying!

NEXT: digging into the users manual!

Andy, you're the man! Really made my evening.

EDIT: Never mind! I found the Panic button now! phew, finally! but is there any short command for play and stop? or do I have to map it to some hardware in MIDI learn?

The only thing I'm lacking now is that when my loopmarkers are set, I want the start and end point to be set at those points aswell, and start looping so I can just move it around while it's looping. What is REALLY irritating is that the loop markers aren't locked to the start and end points in any way. Lets say I want to loop from the start to the very end (which you want if you are searching for goods spots to sample), I cannot move them both at the same time, I have to set them up manually each time I move, really annoying. Or do you know any way of doing this?

Also, how do I get a loop going when I have set up the markers? hehe. I want it to continue looping when I press, lets say pad #1. The idea is to get the song to loop all the time and just move the markers around so I can find a good spot, without stopping.

btw, love alchemy, such an underrated synth!

[jontah]

Cant find this Last shit in the manual , sigh... This is exactly Why I love tutorials..

[ZenPunkHippy]

Video tutorials are useful for a quick overview, but they can't cover all the nitty gritty details.

Anyway - when auditioning possible loop points I would set up a looped region in Logic to trigger the pad. You can map a CC number (or possibly a MIDI note) to the panic button, so a looping region with the pad note + panic CC/note just before the Logic loop point is reached would work.

I don't think it's possible to adjust the loop markers in real time.

Peace,
Andy.