The 'free' Steinberg SLM 128 Loudness meter

[chk071]

Doesn't Studio One host VST3 as well?

If so, has anyone tried this in it?

(I have S1-2 pro, but haven't installed it yet.)

Steinberg said "It can be used in Cubase 6.5 and Nuendo from version 5". Which means it will run in these hosts. Only. Seriously.

[4damind]

Nice plugin. It's a good job by Steinberg to release some free stuff for Cubase users (or better "for VST3 users"... this plug-in works with every VST3 host?)

[Compyfox]

Nope, just Cubase 6.5 it seems, and Nuendo 5. Return one page to see what's up.

[careyletendre]

I couldn't be happier that Steinberg is rewarding their loyal customers with this fantastic plugin.

Carey

[bduffy]

The loyal people who upgrade. :S

[Roger-S.]

b) Cubase 6 and 6.5 didn't change drastically in code - dare I even say not at all. Nuendo 5.x is even older than Cubase 6 and uses the same code - yet this plugin is working there, but not in the version I've listed.

Normally you don't change the code in an update, because that way you really may lock out users. I remember updating Macs (automatically) and afterwards several applications didn't run anymore.

It is common knowledge that Nuendo is pretty much Cubase's code and we Cubase users are the beta testers for Nuendo (they get the best of the cake, we just the breadcrumbs).

Although it's not my way of expressing myself, but this comment is COMPLETE BULLSHIT. I am certified trainer for Steinberg, the engine is identical, but the differences between Cubase and Nuendo are only relevent to users in broadcast/movie (thinking of syncing options for example, or importing/exporting MXF and AAF) due to certain very special features in Nuendo.
All you need in music production, is included in Cubase, all the MIDI stuff, almost all the effects, notation, VariAudio etc.
Nuendo actually lacks a lot of MIDI and notation features, so I guess, I just proved you wrong.

Sorry if I sound a little harsh...

Unbelievable that people get all heated up over a free plugin!

Really good one, and very true.

Technically it's not free. That would mean it's "free for everyone in every VST3 host". I consider it "free to use by Steinberg users only". It could have been part of a maintenance update.

With Cubase 6.x, VST specification has reached VST 3.5. I think, that's the reason, you cannot see it in other hosts. But as VST is free to implement by other programmers, they should be able to integrate that...if they want. I am especially thinking of Presonus StudioOne, one of the head programmers of them actually developed the VST 3 specification.
It is running in my Cubase 6.06, I didn't update to 6.5, although I think, it's well worth updating.

Actually, I think the maintenance updates had a hidden code that "unlocks" certain plugins. Example: the old Steinberg bundled plugins (EQ, Compressor, the tape machine, the tube plugin, etc) - they only work within a Steinberg environment or only Cubase. I think this is the case as well, which is why they insist on having "most recent versions".

My guess is, those plugins wre proteted by the same Cubase licence, so if there's no Cubase licence, you won't be able to use those plugins.

The fact that it's not(!) working in Wavelab (whichever version, reported by
several users) is just a stupid move. Wavelab was and is still made for engineering and authoring purposes, the EBU R-128 recommendation is mainly for broadcasting only (not necessarily mastering), there are tons of similar tools available...

In that one you are right, and I am sure, they will soon provide an updated version of WaveLab.

Peace.

Roger

[Compyfox]

Although it's not my way of expressing myself, but this comment is COMPLETE BULLSHIT. I am certified trainer for Steinberg, the engine is identical, but the differences between Cubase and Nuendo are only relevent to users in broadcast/movie (thinking of syncing options for example, or importing/exporting MXF and AAF) due to certain very special features in Nuendo.
All you need in music production, is included in Cubase, all the MIDI stuff, almost all the effects, notation, VariAudio etc.
Nuendo actually lacks a lot of MIDI and notation features, so I guess, I just proved you wrong.

Sorry, but this didn't prove anything. I'm with Cubase since (hold your horses) v1.4 on old Windows (read: pre/around 95) days. Nuendo was always built upon the Cubase code indeed. But don't tell me we Cubase users are not the public beta testers for Nuendo. Because sometimes Nuendo runs better than Cubase - thanks to us "bugfinders".

Sorry if I sound a little harsh...

Different viewpoints, different opinions.

With Cubase 6.x, VST specification has reached VST 3.5. I think, that's the reason, you cannot see it in other hosts. But as VST is free to implement by other programmers, they should be able to integrate that...if they want. I am especially thinking of Presonus StudioOne, one of the head programmers of them actually developed the VST 3 specification.

IIRC, VST3.5 has arrived with Cubase 6.0 already. I'm not so sure with Wavelab since it doesn't offer the feature to load VSTi (see Halion Sonic SE). It was the main feature to "pimp out" back in the day to actually upgrade to Cubase 6 - "VST3.5, enhanced expression maps, only we have it"

And VST3 is still flawed - take a dive into the DSP section in here and read how many complaints there are.

It is running in my Cubase 6.06, I didn't update to 6.5, although I think, it's well worth updating.

If you read my last post, I updated(!) to 6.0.6 the other day. It does not(!) work there - reasons are unknown. So if it's workin on your end, and since you're a cerrified trainer for Steinberg (especially Cubase), then please show us obviously stupid users how you pulled that off.


Unless you're running Nuendo in parallel - then the riddle is solved.

My guess is, those plugins wre proteted by the same Cubase licence, so if there's no Cubase licence, you won't be able to use those plugins.

I have both a valid Cubase and Wavelab license, yet it's not working. It's not even showing up in the plugin list.

I slowly get the feeling it's either a code-unlock within the DAW, or a specific driver add-on that is needed but not installed. Come to think of it, the installer is a MSI file and pretty much only "copies" the files into their folder - nothing more.

In that one you are right, and I am sure, they will soon provide an updated version of WaveLab.

If you've been to their boards, they said that it won't happen.



I can emphasize once more that there are suitable(!!!) alternatives out there. Free even or affordable (10bucks!!!) that are not only crossplatform, free of this crappy VST3 nonsense and less hassle to install/test if the installation worked.

I rather support a developer that knows what he's doing. Jeroen Breebaart for example - while his tool is not as detailed as (say) Nugen Audio or TC, it's at least working right out of the box and also has a histogram function. Steinberg only offers a plain 2.0 "compact" measurement system.

And, it's still wrong advertising for the musicians, since they don't even need it. EBU R-128 (or ITU 1770-2 for that matter) is still mainly aimed at broadcasters only.

[Roger-S.]

Sorry, but this didn't prove anything. I'm with Cubase since (hold your horses) v1.4 on old Windows (read: pre/around 95) days. Nuendo was always built upon the Cubase code indeed. But don't tell me we Cubase users are not the public beta testers for Nuendo. Because sometimes Nuendo runs better than Cubase - thanks to us "bugfinders".

Yes, Cubase is based on Nuendo engine, I never said it didn't. But when you feel like bugfinder, that you may change to Nuendo, buy the NEK, and you'll be able to do everything you claim, you can't...and you'll have paid about 4 times a Cubase. A software NEVER is bugfree, when it reaches a certain complexity. So this is certainly no Cubase-specific issue. The plugin is declared to run on Cubase 6.5, so what's the confusion?

IIRC, VST3.5 has arrived with Cubase 6.0 already. I'm not so sure with Wavelab since it doesn't offer the feature to load VSTi (see Halion Sonic SE). It was the main feature to "pimp out" back in the day to actually upgrade to Cubase 6 - "VST3.5, enhanced expression maps, only we have it"

And VST3 is still flawed - take a dive into the DSP section in here and read how many complaints there are.

I was giving you a hint about possible reasons. I also thought, we were talking about why the plugin isn't showing up in Cubase 6.0.6., and not critizing VST 3 standard itself, or simply put.... you are off your own topic.
And critizing the plugin for being VST 3.5 is like critizing ProTools for not supporting Audio Units, even more off.

If you read my last post, I updated(!) to 6.0.6 the other day. It does not(!) work there - reasons are unknown. So if it's workin on your end, and since you're a cerrified trainer for Steinberg (especially Cubase), then please show us obviously stupid users how you pulled that off.

I never said STUPID USERS, but if you feel yourself that way, I am sorry.
Anyway, I am not running Nuendo parallel, I don't even have a Nuendo licence, and yet it's working. If you need, I may send you a screenshot.

Besides, users have to understand, that there are almost as many PC configurations out there, as there are PCs. So the problem might be, believe it or not: Your computer. Also, Steinberg declared the plugin UNSUPPORTED, they might probably have their reasons to do so.

Unless you're running Nuendo in parallel - then the riddle is solved.

Answered above.

I can emphasize once more that there are suitable(!!!) alternatives out there. Free even or affordable (10bucks!!!) that are not only crossplatform, free of this crappy VST3 nonsense and less hassle to install/test if the installation worked.

I rather support a developer that knows what he's doing. Jeroen Breebaart for example - while his tool is not as detailed as (say) Nugen Audio or TC, it's at least working right out of the box and also has a histogram function. Steinberg only offers a plain 2.0 "compact" measurement system.

I know the work of Jeroen. I also have bought plenty of plugins in every price range, from those from Jeroen to Alchemy. The advantage of Cubase is, that there are a lot of plugins around, so yes, you can use their software, free or cheap or more expensive. That's what they 're for. With this, what you are looking for is within your means, so why all this hate? About a freeware???

Another option for you might be, to leave the "crappy" VST 3 standard behind, and get yourself Protools. Let's see, what will be the cost for you...

And, it's still wrong advertising for the musicians, since they don't even need it. EBU R-128 (or ITU 1770-2 for that matter) is still mainly aimed at broadcasters only.

This is like saying, you should'nt advertise products off context, like advertising for cornflakes at the super bowl. Come on, what else does bother you? The plugin does not work for you, but there are alternatives, so go one and get them. Also, the loudness war isn't a broadcasting issue only...

So, get the software, that works for you and take yourself more time to make music. This may avoid a heart attack. Music technology is in constant development, you decide, til which point you go with it.

And before you ask: No, I am not sponsored by Steinberg (although I'd like to be), and I work with the same software as every user. I am no beta tester neither.

All the best.

Roger

[chk071]

Sorry, but this didn't prove anything. I'm with Cubase since (hold your horses) v1.4 on old Windows (read: pre/around 95) days. Nuendo was always built upon the Cubase code indeed. But don't tell me we Cubase users are not the public beta testers for Nuendo. Because sometimes Nuendo runs better than Cubase - thanks to us "bugfinders".

Bit of a wild statement don't you think? And why on earth should Nuendo not be based on Cubase? Would you completely rewrite your code if you want to create a similar software?

[Roger-S.]

Some of you people would complain and moan if you were given cash for free.

'but now ill have to pay taxes on this! thanks A LOT pal!'
or
'paypal!! why cant you just paypal me the funds!!??'

it is surreal! Truly.. It boggles my mind as you want the world to wrap itself around you and it doesn't work that way. Where did you learn that society worked this way?


If your host doesn't support VST3 either upgrade to one that does, request that it support VST3 and be patient, or let it go. Obviously Steinberg wants to push the VST3 format along. It doesn't do that by continually supporting VST2.4 forever.

Besides.. its just a loudness meter.

100% correct. I am with you.

Roger

[Compyfox]

I'm not touching most of that "I'm a Steiny - I know better" crap.

Besides, users have to understand, that there are almost as many PC configurations out there, as there are PCs. So the problem might be, believe it or not: Your computer.

I'm sure as hell not investigating any further. It's not working right out of the box, and I have other issues to take care about than getting this trainwreck to run on my rig.

Also, Steinberg declared the plugin UNSUPPORTED, they might probably have their reasons to do so.

Then one big question pops up:
Why even release it if it's not supported?

There you have it, thread over.

...
Another option for you might be, to leave the "crappy" VST 3 standard behind, and get yourself Protools. Let's see, what will be the cost for you...

You run out of arguments it seems.

BTW:
I'm using more than just Cubase and Wavelab. ProTools does count to that. You barked up the wrong tree.

This is like saying, you should'nt advertise products off context, like advertising for cornflakes at the super bowl. Come on, what else does bother you? The plugin does not work for you, but there are alternatives, so go one and get them. Also, the loudness war isn't a broadcasting issue only...

You missed the point of this whole thread.


The rest is just yadda yadda without any context or helping at all.

Bit of a wild statement don't you think? And why on earth should Nuendo not be based on Cubase? Would you completely rewrite your code if you want to create a similar software?

There you are again - nice to you once more.
And... what did you contribute? Nothing - just like your last posts.



I'm definitely out of here. The argumentation is going nowhere. Obviously to some this is the "nice freeware holy grail", to others it's a trainwreck. Not worth the hassle.

[Roger-S.]

Then one big question pops up:
Why even release it if it's not supported?

There you have it, thread over.

On the official Steinberg webpage they put it very clearly:

"...we decided to create a loudness metering tool in the very short-term, which enables our customers to create R 128-compliant mixes," says Timo Wildenhain, product marketing manager at Steinberg."

...

You run out of arguments it seems.

BTW:
I'm using more than just Cubase and Wavelab. ProTools does count to that. You barked up the wrong tree.

I am not even close to run out of arguments. My point is here: You don't like VST 3, then don't use it.
Get another plattform to work with.

You missed the point of this whole thread.

Well, I missed the point, because I dared to answer to your comment.

There you are again - nice to you once more.
And... what did you contribute? Nothing - just like your last posts.

Like if your comments would have been helpful to anyone...

I'm definitely out of here. The argumentation is going nowhere. Obviously to some this is the "nice freeware holy grail", to others it's a trainwreck. Not worth the hassle.

A forum is supposed to provide help and information to other users. I put you valid information, but you don't even read it carefully. If you are a legal Cubase user, you might consider using the official Cubase forum. They have qualified moderators, who might actually answer your question, if you ask in the right way.

All the best.

Roger

[bduffy]

That is a good point: it looks like it's a "temporary-fix"-type plugin, so I guess there may be a more universal version coming soon. Will it be pay? Will it work in all Steinberg apps? Hard to say...

[Compyfox]

*sigh* why do I even do this?

Then one big question pops up:
Why even release it if it's not supported?

There you have it, thread over.

On the official Steinberg webpage they put it very clearly:

"...we decided to create a loudness metering tool in the very short-term, which enables our customers to create R 128-compliant mixes," says Timo Wildenhain, product marketing manager at Steinberg."

They also made it clear, that it's a "non mass-tested" release and advised to "use at own risk".

Or in short:
"Let's jump on the bandwagon before August, even with bugs, while totally ignoring the educational side (like: "what does EBU R-128 actually do, and is it even needed for musicians?") of things - cause we're smart and are a leading audio firm!"


Sums it up pretty much.

I am not even close to run out of arguments. My point is here: You don't like VST 3, then don't use it.
Get another plattform to work with.

If I'd hate VST3 so much, then I'd not use Brainworx or MeldaProduction plugins in VST3 mode. Apparently, they can do it right - while the host itself can't. And it's not a good embodiment of a firm that "drives" the VST technology forward, that half of the recent released VST3 plugins don't work without any issues.

Solution: Use the old VST2.x standard and hope that VST3 will turn bugfree and backwards compatible by the time Steinberg ditched VST2.

Or the simpler answer: blame it on the programmers to not code within specs.

Well, I missed the point, because I dared to answer to your comment.

Sorry, but... B'tch, please.

Like if your comments would have been helpful to anyone...

I'd still love to get a detailed answer by everyone who got this plugin to run in earlier Cubase versions. How did you pull that off?

Here's my rig (again):
Intel Core i7 920, non OCed
Windows XP pro SP3, 32bit
Cubase 6.0.6 32bit and Wavelab 7.2.1 (also tested Wavelab 7.0.x and Cubase 6.0.2 32bit)
Elicenser Version - ??? (the last installed one from Cubase 6.0.6

SLM 128 (windows, 32bit) version from 26th May 2012, rebooted my engine several times.

Tested on two user accounts, both with administrator rights.
Having several visual C runtimes installed due to the fact that several plugins need them. .net Framework is v3.5, if that is even relevant (don't think so).


Unless there is some driver missing, according to your last post (and the one from someone else with Cubase 5), it should work right out of the box. Alas - it does not - and it's IMO not a PC issue.


Your turn.

A forum is supposed to provide help and information to other users. I put you valid information, but you don't even read it carefully.

Saying "it might be your PC's fault, since it's working on my end" doesn't count as help. But YMMV.

If you are a legal Cubase user, you might consider using the official Cubase forum. They have qualified moderators, who might actually answer your question, if you ask in the right way.

Now you even accuse me of using illegal licenses - good times. What makes you think I do not read over there and get similar answers already? If you(!) would read over there, you'd realise that I'm not the only one having troubles and/or is dissapointed. Also our opinions seem to differ greatly on "qualified moderators" or "suitable customer support".

That is a good point: it looks like it's a "temporary-fix"-type plugin, so I guess there may be a more universal version coming soon. Will it be pay? Will it work in all Steinberg apps? Hard to say...

It was said so right from the start, which I pointed out in an earlier post - great move by Steinberg to cut away every support with the "use at own risk" sign.

At this point however, I don't care anymore if there will be a more "universal version", may it be expenso-payware (Neve Portico anyone) or not.



Don't feed the trolls, eat more trees.