Strictly speaking, wouldn't real spam be something entirely OT, like a Mexican Viagra ad or some junk about how you can refinance your mortgage at a low, low rate?
I mean, you are on a music software website. And it doesn't take a lot of energy to ignore something.
Devs hijack every thread?
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- KVRAF
- 4329 posts since 26 Jun, 2004
Id just like to say that if KvR had the opposite "problem" (e.g. Not a dev in sight) it would not be the same place at all.
I rarely feel that the 'marketing' is intrusive. It is generally helpful first, and by 'coincidence', marketing.
George is an easy target. He is.. thorough.
But I dont think I have ever seen a post from him that would be considered intrusive or out of place.
To me the test is this:
If the post had been made by a random member, would it hold water? Basically- Is it valid as anything but marketing? If it is, then I think its ok. I think we should value it kinda.
Afterall, the dev is usually going to be the expert on the app right?
I rarely feel that the 'marketing' is intrusive. It is generally helpful first, and by 'coincidence', marketing.
George is an easy target. He is.. thorough.
But I dont think I have ever seen a post from him that would be considered intrusive or out of place.
To me the test is this:
If the post had been made by a random member, would it hold water? Basically- Is it valid as anything but marketing? If it is, then I think its ok. I think we should value it kinda.
Afterall, the dev is usually going to be the expert on the app right?
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- Rad Grandad
- 38041 posts since 6 Sep, 2003 from Downeast Maine
as a consumer I dislike when salesmen are down my throat the minute I walk in a store, acknowledge me but please do not hover over me and allow me to look around and if I have questions please be available to answer those questions and you will likely not only make a sale but have a returning customer.
As a salesman my approach was to greet someone with a friendly hello and a smile, let them know if they need anything I'm there, then let them go about their business while I observe from a distance. After a bit checking in with the shopper, asking light open ended questions is the next step. Sometimes I would see a customer looking at a particular item and go with that, but never pushy. Once a dialog has been established I found as a salesman, features, brand names and such were useless if you wanted a repeat customer. The key was establishing the customers needs, addressing those by pointing out the benefits of different products features. (benefits that from my observation I know will work best for the customer)
People love to talk about themselves, not just me as some here will pipe in and troll about but all of us...we love to talk about our gear. The best salesmen listen first and talk second, get the customer to talk, address his/her needs and you make a friend as well. (from both sides)
There is a fine line between being pushy and being attentive to the customer, customers do not want to be ignored but they want to have time to think on their own and not have a salesman pushing everything down their throats. As a customer I have walked out of many stores (not just music stores) because of this very thing.
There are some reps here (and some developers) who are beyond pushy and from my own experience in sales and as a customer I see it hurting more than helping their company. This thread should be a red flag to them because it is clear that many people feel this way. (I'm glad there is a thread about this subject so no one has to hi-jack threads to make this point) Like I said there is a fine line and professionals need to know where that line is because once they cross it they might not recover.
The bigger problem here is that these people are not selling all the brands associated with one product but only their own product. As a result that line is much clearer because it is easy to figure out that they are not concerned with your benefits at all, all they care about is pushing their products and the features of their product, quite often with hype. They see the line, they cross it with no regrets and in the end people seem to resent that company. They have an agenda and a narrow one at that.
I said it all starts with listening but these people are not listening and only when they see failure will they look back and see their mistakes. Even though the customers who's trust they want are telling them flat out they dont like it they refuse to see the writing on the wall because they are not listening. So why would a customer have faith in that company if they blatantly ignore the customers criticisms (or worse, actually argue with them about how they feel, no one has the right to tell another how to feel), especially when often it comes down to dropping a large sum of money on something during a very rough economy?
Terrible to use such a cliche but to those people I say we have two ears and only one mouth for a reason. Please stop telling us what we need and listen to us about what we need.
As a salesman my approach was to greet someone with a friendly hello and a smile, let them know if they need anything I'm there, then let them go about their business while I observe from a distance. After a bit checking in with the shopper, asking light open ended questions is the next step. Sometimes I would see a customer looking at a particular item and go with that, but never pushy. Once a dialog has been established I found as a salesman, features, brand names and such were useless if you wanted a repeat customer. The key was establishing the customers needs, addressing those by pointing out the benefits of different products features. (benefits that from my observation I know will work best for the customer)
People love to talk about themselves, not just me as some here will pipe in and troll about but all of us...we love to talk about our gear. The best salesmen listen first and talk second, get the customer to talk, address his/her needs and you make a friend as well. (from both sides)
There is a fine line between being pushy and being attentive to the customer, customers do not want to be ignored but they want to have time to think on their own and not have a salesman pushing everything down their throats. As a customer I have walked out of many stores (not just music stores) because of this very thing.
There are some reps here (and some developers) who are beyond pushy and from my own experience in sales and as a customer I see it hurting more than helping their company. This thread should be a red flag to them because it is clear that many people feel this way. (I'm glad there is a thread about this subject so no one has to hi-jack threads to make this point) Like I said there is a fine line and professionals need to know where that line is because once they cross it they might not recover.
The bigger problem here is that these people are not selling all the brands associated with one product but only their own product. As a result that line is much clearer because it is easy to figure out that they are not concerned with your benefits at all, all they care about is pushing their products and the features of their product, quite often with hype. They see the line, they cross it with no regrets and in the end people seem to resent that company. They have an agenda and a narrow one at that.
I said it all starts with listening but these people are not listening and only when they see failure will they look back and see their mistakes. Even though the customers who's trust they want are telling them flat out they dont like it they refuse to see the writing on the wall because they are not listening. So why would a customer have faith in that company if they blatantly ignore the customers criticisms (or worse, actually argue with them about how they feel, no one has the right to tell another how to feel), especially when often it comes down to dropping a large sum of money on something during a very rough economy?
Terrible to use such a cliche but to those people I say we have two ears and only one mouth for a reason. Please stop telling us what we need and listen to us about what we need.
The highest form of knowledge is empathy, for it requires us to suspend our egos and live in another's world. It requires profound, purpose‐larger‐than‐the‐self kind of understanding.
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deleted deleted https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=1
DELETED
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- KVRAF
- 9096 posts since 5 Feb, 2004
I don't mind a sales pitch, I don't mind a forum thread about a new product, but developers bumping threads like some people fart just gets on my nerves. George makes post in a thread then shuts up, i don't mind that even when it is maybe irrelevant, but when developers knock other developers and constantly promote their own wares, I could do without that. i feel if a developer really wants to have an active presence on KVR they should get a subforum, even if they have their own forum on their own website. That way if they want to ask their users for FR 's or whatever it won't be at the top of the instruments forum every time I check it. It just seems inappropriate and definitely more a marketing ploy than some really 'useful information' for the benefit of the community.
If you have requests for Korg VST features or changes, they are listening at https://support.korguser.net/hc/en-us/requests/new
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- Banned
- 28 posts since 22 Oct, 2011 from France
The developers' who are not frustrated by their total commercial failure do not.Devs hijack every thread?
BUT
At the same time The developers' who are frustrated by their total commercial success can...
AND
...how many cases are possibles. may be that the developer is an only child who was used to be the center of the world, maybe he's just self-centered...maybe he's just drunk...
You cannot determine why someone hijacks every thread...And I'm sure you don't really want to know why he get nuts...
Life it's just like that...you have to deal with the others...
Last edited by wiwatti on Wed Aug 22, 2012 7:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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- KVRAF
- 42529 posts since 21 Dec, 2005
I'm obviously (and thankfully) missing something. I don't see that. Is it more geared at instruments (which I'm not in as much? ) Other than some potentially spammy-ish stuff (which I don't even complain about anymore) I just don't see this. I have 30000 f**king posts. I'm here all the time.
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- KVRAF
- 9096 posts since 5 Feb, 2004
That explains everything!wiwatti wrote:maybe he's just drunk
If you have requests for Korg VST features or changes, they are listening at https://support.korguser.net/hc/en-us/requests/new
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- KVRAF
- 9096 posts since 5 Feb, 2004
It's because you are always drunkhibidy wrote:I'm obviously (and thankfully) missing something. I don't see that. Is it more geared at instruments (which I'm not in as much? ) Other than some potentially spammy-ish stuff (which I don't even complain about anymore) I just don't see this. I have 30000 f**king posts. I'm here all the time.
If you have requests for Korg VST features or changes, they are listening at https://support.korguser.net/hc/en-us/requests/new
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- KVRAF
- 42529 posts since 21 Dec, 2005
why you!!!!braj wrote:It's because you are always drunkhibidy wrote:I'm obviously (and thankfully) missing something. I don't see that. Is it more geared at instruments (which I'm not in as much? ) Other than some potentially spammy-ish stuff (which I don't even complain about anymore) I just don't see this. I have 30000 f**king posts. I'm here all the time.
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- KVRAF
- 10260 posts since 19 Feb, 2004 from Paris
Just ask and I will answer.michi_mak wrote:sounds the opposite ofLotuzia wrote:...for your information, I'm not a Xils employee...
doesn't it ???Lotuzia wrote:...As for the intro price, well we received a lot of demands to extend the intro price because people were either on holydays and could not get it or try the demo, either were a bit broke for a few of them. We choose the 5th September because we thought that everybody will be back from holydays at that time, so it seemed to be fair...
I collaborate with Xils from sound design to the creation of specific modules, and also GUI and UI concepts. And I'm deeply involved in the development of some of the instruments. I collaborate also with many other companies, but no one as closely as Xils.
I help Xils to communicate on forums and to answer users questions on my free time.
So believe it, or not, I'm not a xils employee and if I say "we", its because its much easier for people than explaining all that in each post and I have the autorisation to do so by the Xils staff. (ie representing this company on some forum, but I do it pro bono because I love these instruments ( and eventually you can say I'm biased about that, but I believe a lot of people involved into the creation of instruments feel the same, be them freeware or commercial ; You dont go that road, wich is sometimes a bit hard, to offer instruments to musicians if you dont have a certain passion for that )
I admit however that the situation could easily make people think this.
So this is just a bit of information.
http://www.lelotusbleu.fr Synth Presets
77 Exclusive Soundbanks for 23 synths, 8 Sound Designers, Hours of audio Demos. The Sound you miss might be there
77 Exclusive Soundbanks for 23 synths, 8 Sound Designers, Hours of audio Demos. The Sound you miss might be there
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- KVRAF
- Topic Starter
- 1865 posts since 18 Feb, 2012
Ok, but don't spam 1 millions threads with your products and don't hijack like there is no tomorrow. I check a synth thread which has nothting to do with Xils or Georges synths and than I see post like: Corona or Oxium can do that...and even more...Who cares? You have your own thread for your own product, write there.
I think some rules should be applied for everyone here.
I think some rules should be applied for everyone here.
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- KVRAF
- 6113 posts since 7 Jan, 2005 from Corporate States of America
Hah, I must have missed the thread where that happened. What was the last straw?Tricky-Loops wrote:Since Ernest is banned, it's getting much more boring here... His posts at least had an entertaining character...
Because we don't know anything if the other developers have pretty daughters, too...
- dysamoria.com
my music @ SoundCloud
my music @ SoundCloud
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- KVRAF
- 7504 posts since 14 Nov, 2006 from Ankara, Turkey
Duh! You have serious issues dude. [mod edit]? Stop harrasing me!michi_mak wrote:you could add some others too ( i'd vote for ik and synthmaster dev)
When was the last time I "hijacked" a thread smart guy just show us, you seem to be keeping logs of me!
For the record, I wrote in some threads in the past to show folks what my plugin can do, but thank God I dont have to do that anymore because the entire world already realized what my plugin can do...
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- KVRAF
- 9590 posts since 17 Sep, 2002 from Gothenburg Sweden
Finally we're getting somewhere.