Swingbeat; How do I do it?

[jancivil]

Well, at least insofar as not wanting to read more shit.

This Wreckx-N-Effect - Rump shaker (original video) was brought in as though to show something.

Pretty basic drum part. From my experience, if someone played the thing somewhere it is going to reveal as about this quantized, typically:

no swing.jpg

And I thought the topic was New Jack Swing, while this has no swing at all. NB: 4.4.4.333 there, which is where the triplet (per 1000 ppqn) falls, there's nothing there. Where the kick does buh-boom, into the first downbeat of a bar, it's straight 16ths.

But the initial point remains, if its drums have anything you'd put in a funk or R&B whatever "Urban" track, somebody somewhere in the form of a human person did it; if it was sampled and recycled this changes nothing. To argue otherwise only shows people the extent of some real stupidity. There isn't a lot to this understanding really, certainly to act like someone who, after showing you the very details of it technically can't know it because they don't do what you do (let's hear you play some drums, then) is idiotic.

[christian f.]

Dude, all that LSD in the 70s might have completely melted your brain.

Are you really saying that this (Teddy Riley produced) track is NOT swingbeat because you're little analysis says it is a pretty basic drum track and some irrelevant bla bla ?

This is one of the biggest bangers in swingbeat history not even debatable and I posted this relevant example, because the last 20 seconds reveal a lot of how the beat was constructed.

And since you love Wikipedia :

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_jack_swing

Educate yourself before posting all that nonsense and try to cover your ignorance with pseudo scientific analysis of rhythms. You obviously don't know anything about this style and don't have any experience producing it.

I already explained that I know how funk and soul records were made. My favourite drummers are Billy Cobham, Clyde Stubblefield, Zigaboo Modeliste and Buddy Miles.

You're too busy blowing your own horn telling everybody what a big forgotten superstar drummer you are and self promoting your subpar youtube videos to get that view count above 25.

[jancivil]

Yeah, beyond that last point I really can't be arsed. You haven't the first clue what happens, apparently

[cthonophonic]

I'm pretty sure the Bobby Brown track from the OP is a quantized swing. Taking a beat from the middle of the song and marking all the identifiable drum hits by hand, the off 16ths have a very consistent lag of about 25ms. At this BPM, that would correspond to about 60% shuffle on an MPC60 or Linn 9000. So it's not swung all the way to the point where the syncopations align with 6/8 time, but close.

[IncarnateX]

I already explained that I know how funk and soul records were made.

...yes, they grow on sample trees to be plucked and multilayered with individual hits and therefore everything is quantified in these beats

FYI, in terms of logic, you have not explained anything or even provided one valid argument for anything. It is but a hysterical child cursing at this point. You are so pathetic, this whether Brown’s beat is quantified or not. A pile of ad hominem shit from the lowest common denominator of KVR.

[IncarnateX]

Moved

[IncarnateX]

Apart from Beat King Christian’s absurd sample growing tree argument to prove quantification, you just have to look at the quotes below to know what levels of rational thinking we are dealing with here:

Hahahaha ... you clearly don't know anything about producing swing beat or anything with a beat .I checked the noise on your Bandcamp and it looks like you spent more time posting here than actually producing music. lmfao

This forum is your only outlet, but no one wants to hear your "music" looking at the views and your "knowledge" of this style is sub zero.

All you guys do is talk and analyse , but Jan's music (and demand for it) speaks for it self.

Going for people’s music within one genre to prove he is wrong about another? And seeking validation by how few times it is shown Just the impulze to do that shows we are dealing with so called low-route thinking where higher cortex is passed and reactions are dealt with by the limbic system only. Apart from that, dissing people’s music in the course of supporting your own opinion is simply vulgar, and below any point with making music at all, apart from that which resembles hate-songs from right wing losers.

[IncarnateX]

And the answer to the thread should really not be such a big deal. So how to make swing beats?

1. If you do not mind robotic swing, experiment with the swing settings on your sequencer.
2. If you do mind, find a sample with a good basic groove, loop and add hits if needed
3. If you do mind, try play free hand and record it, either on audio or in a seq with high resolution.

Simple as that. Nothing to go scum about, really.

[christian f.]

swing beats ....

I'm pretty sure Everyone knows how to make a beat "swing" .
The question was how to make "Swingbeat" ... the style ... looks like that went totally over your head.

I posted a link above with the wiki definition .. perhaps you should click and read.

Nothing to scum about .. for real !

[IncarnateX]

swing beats ....

I'm pretty sure Everyone knows how to make a beat "swing" .
The question was how to make "Swingbeat" ... the style ... looks like that went totally over your head.

Here you go again. Swinging beats do not grow on trees either. To make swing beat as a style, you will have to make beats swing in the first place, and in particular the way it does in swingbeats, which YOU (not me) have defined as samples with layers of hits as opposed to Jan’s non-quantification, which therefore is rubbish to the extent that 70s soul records are used for samples, which YOU also said. Unless you are going to tell us these records are quantified too, your argument does not work by default, thus everthing else based on it becomes nonsense.

Seems like you forget this contradictive argument of yours all the time doesn`t it? Well, note that we in this thread not are two but actually three that have identified it as contradictive. No wonder, really.

I posted a link above with the wiki definition .. perhaps you should click and read.

Yes like all selfmade experts at KVR you think you are so wise that you can leave out any argument and just post a vid or a link without further explanation than you think something is evident and support your sayings. Well, the wiki does not support the rubbish above.

Nothing to scum about .. for real !

The scum thing was not related to your recent wiki posting but the quotes dissing Jan’s music. That should be obvious to anyone but you, which hereby seems confirmed in the latter case.

[christian f.]

Here you go again. Swinging beats do not grow on trees either. To make swing beat as a style, you will have to make beats swing in the first place, and in particular the way it does in swingbeats, which YOU (not me) have defined as samples with layers of hits as opposed to Jan’s non-quantification, which therefore is rubbish to the extent that 70s soul records are used for samples, which YOU also said.

Seems like you forget this contradictive argument of yours all the time doesn`t it? Well, note that we in this thread not are two but actually three that have identified it as contradictive. No wonder, really.

Well, at least insofar as not wanting to read more shit.

This Wreckx-N-Effect - Rump shaker (original video) was brought in as though to show something.

Pretty basic drum part. From my experience, if someone played the thing somewhere it is going to reveal as about this quantized, typically:
no swing.jpg


And I thought the topic was New Jack Swing, while this has no swing at all. NB: 4.4.4.333 there, which is where the triplet (per 1000 ppqn) falls, there's nothing there. Where the kick does buh-boom, into the first downbeat of a bar, it's straight 16ths.

This is not contradictive ??

There's no denying that Rumpshaker is a Swingbeat Classic ... Your hero Jan says it doesn't "swing" and you say you have to make beats swing in the first place to make this style.

Did you read the specific question about snare compression ?
Which is why I gave the Rumpshaker last 20 secs example and talked about layers in the first place.

The guy never asked for your scientific crap about making the beat swing.
We all can find the swing button / slider in our daw or drum machine.
We all know how to just extract the grooves/quantization from any groove we want.

LSD one helluva drug

[IncarnateX]

If we cut the crap and look at what could have been arguments, it is all down below

Pure Nonsense. You clearly don't know the style.
It's all about samples and layers and layers of them.
Breakbeats

Are going to tell us it is not part of the style to have loops from drummers playing real drum sets and use them for e.g. Break Beats? Far from all your hear in this style are programmed quantifications. Afaik both individual drum hits and loops apply to “samples” whether they are layered or not, so there is no real argument up there ^^^^ that would qualify your “nonsense” outburst.

This is urban music and has nothing to do with analysing or record live drummers and then turn those into break beats. ALL the famous songs from that era are SAMPLED beats from 60/70's soul funk records.

I did not say anything about analysing drummers but recording them. Pathetic strawmen too? And have you considered that the sampled soul records corresponds to samples of live players too, which you just said it is not about? (look up)

To infer one conclusion among other: The one who has told us least about what Swingbeat is...is Christian. It is quantified but it is not, or something.

Unless some finds it significant that a Swingbeat is quantified even though it is a loop of a 70s soul band, but that is obviously incomprehensible to at least three of us.

Now let us go back to the first definition and take it a face value

“It's all about samples and layers and layers of them.
Breakbeats”.

Apart from the fact that “layers and layers” sounds somewhat dramatic to me according to the examples in question, the definiton would really cover a lot of hip hop, RnB, DrumNbass and related stuff and not Swingbeats in particular, could even be straight 4/4 acid under this wide umbrella.

[christian f.]

The fact you keep on calling this "swingbeatS" is beyond adorable.

I think the three of us trashed this topic enough and it was fun.

Peace to you both and keep on Swingin'

[IncarnateX]

This is not contradictive ??

There's no denying that Rumpshaker is a Swingbeat Classic ... Your hero Jan says it doesn't "swing" and you say you have to make beats swing in the first place to make this style.

Did you read the specific question about snare compression ?
Which is why I gave the Rumpshaker last 20 secs example and talked about layers in the first place.

The guy never asked for your scientific crap about making the beat swing.
We all can find the swing button / slider in our daw or drum machine.
We all know how to just extract the grooves/quantization from any groove we want.

LSD one helluva drug

I have not reponded to this part of the debate, so give up moving goals as far as my objections concerns. The contradiction was about your attitude in relation to your statement not the one you respond too above. It sounds like the rhythm is swinging in my ears too, though I would have no opinion on how many % it should to call it Swingbeat or any other style. But that neither qualifies your own definiton or save it from contradition. I could also be convinced that there are quantifications going on as well as non quantifications but you would not be the one here that provide anything I can use to point me in either directions about which is which in this case.

[christian f.]

On topic :
For those early signature Guy / Bobby Brown / Keith Sweat sounds :

Korg DDD 1
Yamaha DX100 Solid/Lately Bass Preset
Roland D550