Waves Abbey Road BTR Tape Machine

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plastic wrote: Yeah so why would I want to use a tape plugin, which is by definition a retro sound degradation effect, if I wanted my music to sound better/more pristine?
I want distortion, tape compression, wobbling, etc.
Not a mastering EQ plugin that calls itself "tape emulation".
Have you read the manual, or at least gotten yourself a bit familiar with magnetic-recording technology?
In our opinion, there were just so many plugins on the market which claim to sound like tape but were just a caricature of it, mainly because they create sheer distortion and overly listening fatigue.

[Side note: run a sine sweep through tape plugins of your choice, trap an analyzer on the output, dial-in various amounts of gain and inspect the harmonics structure change and watch aliasing creep in.
Side note 2: here's a helpful video by Slate's Fabrice:
It doesn't cover the whole story, IMO. Perhaps we should make some educational videos ourselves, at least we might supply our test files and procedures for everyone to see and apply elsewhere.]

A 'tape' product aiming for the instant 'wow' factor doesn't do the studio-tape category any good. It leads to wrong expectations and degrades serious technology to to something like a guitar fuzz stomp box. That is NOT what tape recorders were originally made for. It's half-fine when you're attempting to recreate cheap consumer tape decks, but this in no way applies to pro-audio tape gear.
The latter is what we were after with Satin. In fact, a good studio machine does sound remarkably clean and uncolored, compared to domestic gear. The 'magic' comes in when you multiply these subtleties and, moreover, when you *learned* what to listen for (transients smear, spectral changes, front-to-back localisation, stereo-image alteration etc.). People who never used studio-grade tape recorders might need longer to get a hang on things, but it'll be worth it in the end. At least when one attempts to make things sound better, as opposed to just overcook.
Sascha Eversmeier [formerly digitalfishphones]
TOURAGE DSP
croquesolid drum processor- mix real drums fast & focused

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sascha wrote: Side note 2: here's a helpful video by Slate's Fabrice:
It doesn't cover the whole story, IMO. Perhaps we should make some educational videos ourselves, at least we might supply our test files and procedures for everyone to see and apply elsewhere.]
Since you are at it, i've seen him and Steve claim (over at gearslutz) that true Tape plugin is impossible without introducing large (i mean really huge...look at VTM plugin it does have really large amount of latency...something of 1730 samples) latency. Your Satin have much much smaller latency. It's a bit weird claim or he is right?

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kmonkey wrote:Since you are at it, i've seen him and Steve claim (over at gearslutz) that true Tape plugin is impossible without introducing large (i mean really huge...look at VTM plugin it does have really large amount of latency...something of 1730 samples) latency. Your Satin have much much smaller latency. It's a bit weird claim or he is right?
Since I know nothing about their interiour, I can't say what actually causes latency there. Perhaps some FIR filtering or convolution is involved, but I'm only speculating. You'd have to ask Fabrice. Whatever they do, it might be valid within their concept. They got their model, we got ours. A 'model' is a view on the world, there's no right or wrong per se, as long as it covers the scope and remains realizable.

Naturally, latency occurs through a record and repro head and the space between the two. In the real world, that's a couple of ms, depending on speed and machine type and its parts. In a digital model, this can be omitted, at least physical dimensions have no impact and tiny stray flux effects are negligible.
Sascha Eversmeier [formerly digitalfishphones]
TOURAGE DSP
croquesolid drum processor- mix real drums fast & focused

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Before we get too far down the rabbit hole...
Back in the 70's engineers in the studios I recorded in dreamed of the kind of technology we have now and when Dolby introduced their noise reduction system and Sony came out with their massively popular digital multitrack it seemed like the dawning of a new noise free era. Most of the engineers I worked with in studios like Air-London/Townhouse/Olympic/Decca found recording technologically frustrating, they had to deal with crosstalk/tape hiss/wow and flutter/mixing desk noise floor/tape degradation and a whole bunch of break downs. Most professional studios had a full time technician/s whose only job was to keep the machines running, whilst the tape ops had to deal with the daily grind of having to calibrate almost anything with a a VU meter. But they got on with the job at hand working with the tools available finding solutions to what was for them at that time (as I remember) quite daunting obstacles. The great records from that time are a testament to their talent and ingenuity. Today we have the luxury of choice and with or without tape/desk emulation there are some amazingly well produced and engineered albums being made by professionals and hobbyists... So maybe it's as well to remember that as in the 60'/70's it's not always about what you have but more about the way you use what you have.
:wink: :love:

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Tried the demo... It's good!

But I already have VTM and Satin. So I don't think there's any need for a third. Nice product all the same tho'.
I will take the Lord's name in vain, whenever I want. Hail Satan! And his little goblins too. :lol:

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sascha wrote:at least we might supply our test files and procedures for everyone to see and apply elsewhere.
I think this is a good idea.

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Phil999 wrote:
sascha wrote:at least we might supply our test files and procedures for everyone to see and apply elsewhere.
I think this is a good idea.
Here it is:
http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=394533
Sascha Eversmeier [formerly digitalfishphones]
TOURAGE DSP
croquesolid drum processor- mix real drums fast & focused

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J4R1O wrote:I don't know why but I believe they actually might release another tape plug-in sooner or later. Then they would have a nice Abbey Road Bundle to sell (REDD + RS56 + BTR). :)
http://www.waves.com/bundles/abbey-road ... collection
Optimal number of audio plugins is one more than you currently have.

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Compyfox wrote:Let's just hope...we get the RS-124 again.
+1
"Time makes fools of us all. Our only comfort is that greater shall come after us." Eric Temple Bell

http://thetomorrowfile.bandcamp.com/

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J4R1O wrote:I don't know why but I believe they actually might release another tape plug-in sooner or later. Then they would have a nice Abbey Road Bundle to sell (REDD + RS56 + BTR). :)
People called it, I was among them:
Compyfox wrote:...
Too large GUI, too pricey, pretty much unusable for regular stuff only for "tape recordings" (to supplement the POP EQ module and a tape machine of the Abbey Road Studios).

Why the F did Abbey Road even stop support, and then drop their plugin range in the process. This is getting worse by every minute. And the one company that profits from that - is Waves. You pay tripple once again just for the brand name - not the tool.
In the other thread, I even mentioned a bundle at the price of the SSL set. And what do you know:

http://www.waves.com/bundles/abbey-road ... PX_VFH0wlc

Price of the SSL set (600USD), and still no RS-124 Comp, Passive EQ modules or the Chandler/EMI TG12410 transfer console. But - hold your horses - ADT and "The Kings Microphones" - two absolute essential needed tools in the studio! So much to piss off former Abbey Road plugin users.

Might as well give other developers the chance to still sell their tools (Nomad Factory with the TG comes to mind - I'm surprised that the ALTEC 9063B wasn't pulled yet, which is the closest to the ABBEY ROAD stuff as it can ever get.


Either way...
TRIPPLE FACEPALM, if a double facepalm is not sufficient enough anymore. :dog:
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