Brainworx bx_console Focusrite: support fail

[vurt]

im near 50 and i think music is doing as ok as ever. there's always been great stuff and dross, we just forget most of the shite of yesteryear as it is forgotten. but every hits of the decade compilation, usually has the same or similar 20 or so songs, radio plays the same and in time we forget things like englebert humperdinck or max bygraves...

[machine_spirit]

here's a few pop from recent years things i unironically enjoy and like:

I'll just say that i stand by what i said in my previous post
There's something distinct about this music and it frustrates me to no end that i can't figure out what it is.

Haven't heard a beat this odd and groovy

Oh god how is that groovy? You're in dire need of some funky basslines. I can't give your post and this topic the attention it deserves right now, i'll see if i can make a thread later if nobody else does. It's not like we're disrupting some discussion here but who knows, the thread might be locked or all the off topic stuff just disappears.

[Ploki]

You don't find Stromae's Santé groovy?????
that's like the sickest beat i heard in a long long while and everytime i hear it i'm -amazed- that he was able to pull it off

[chagzuki]

You don't find Stromae's Santé groovy?????
that's like the sickest beat i heard in a long long while and everytime i hear it i'm -amazed- that he was able to pull it off

In the same way that a random preset for whatever plugin is also amazing. Yeah, there's nothing there. Actually, most plugin demo videos have more musical content... kind of an ironic thing whereby musical content that has no economic value has more musical value than that which is generated for the purposes of providing social memetic currency for young minds, who need a way to enact group solidarity through shared experiences. But that was generally the driving force of pop music, it's just that for a long time there was a lot of uncharted territory to invent or discover, interconnected with technological invention, but there isn't really anymore. So the days of constant musical revolution ended quite a while back. Probably the next revolutionary thing will be when AI can compose to suit your needs in real time, something the equivalent of which is already becoming a reality in the visual domain with recent AI image creation tools.

[jamcat]

If you want the authentic mixing desk work flow in the box, you should do something like this:
Put an instance of your channel strip on every channel;
Print to audio;
Create a new project and import that audio;
Put a channel strip on every channel;
Now mix.

To emulate using different studios for recording and mixing ( a common practice) use a different channel strip.

Any pros out there to help us out?

I talk about this process a lot. I don't print to audio and create a new project, though.

What I do is create two separate mixer scenes in Studio One. One for the "tracking" console, and one for the "mixing" console. Each one gets a channel strip on every mixer channel. On the "tracking" console, I use a strip that has full preamp modeling. This means either Lindell Audio, or Waves SSL EV2. No Brainworx, unfortunately, because Dirk's "full" console emulations aren't actually full console emulations, though I usually use the bx SSL 4000 E and G strips on the "mixing" console, because preamps aren't needed there. Custom SSL boards with a mix of E and G channels have been pretty common since the '80s, so I mix the two freely. If I'm doing something orchestral I'll use the bx SSL 9000 J instead.

The "tracking" console has an IK Tape Machine following each channel strip, typically the Studer 80, though the MCI is also an option. They all just have to be the same, with the same tape type. I use the preamp gain and EQ on the channel strip to drive the level into the tape. I will do most of my tone shaping on the "tracking" console to get the rough sound I want "to tape." I don't really use compression here much, instead using this tape regimen as a kind of compression. For vocals I may do an 1176 into an LA-2A vocal chain, using the IK T-RackS models. Sometimes a kick or snare might get a special treatment, such as a Pultec or a dbx compressor model. If there is some effect like delay or flanger that is really central to a sound from the start, that will go on the "tracking" console. And of course ampsims are the first slot before anything else. All other "printed" effects go between the channel strip and tape.

I use aux sends to send each "tracking" console channel to a "mixing" console channel. The "tracking" console channels are then routed to a "dead end" FX channel with the fader all the way down. The reason for this is because Studio One's Mix Engine FX do not passthrough FX channels, and I don't want any Mix Engine FX interaction with the "tracking" console. Doing this walls off all the channels that terminate at an FX channel from the Mix Engine FX. This means I will only get crosstalk from Mix Engine FX on my "mixing" console, which all terminate at the Master. I use the console model that matches my "mixing" console on the Master buss, so that usually means the Brit Console on "Vintage" from Retro Mix Legends.

I use the channel strips in the "mixing" console for polishing and getting tracks to sit in the mix. The SSL EQ is really good for that. I'll use the SSL compressors only if I really need it to get a track to sit right. Otherwise, they stay off, which is most of the time. I do "sweetening" FX in the "mixing" console. If a part needs a little zing, that happens here. These are going to be things like reverb, chorus, harmonizers, and other rack effects through aux sends. These are going to be effects that weren't essential to building the foundation of the sound, but maybe keep things interesting or add some space in the mix.

This holistic approach is designed to replicate the studio sessions and organic decision making process of the classic studio era, and of course, the sound. When you follow a similar paradigm, you will never say things like "when should I use compression?" or "help, I don't know how to EQ!" because these things become obvious. Back in the day, mixers used their tools to get the job done, and get a good sound to tape, not simply because they were there and their inserts looked empty.

[licasto2]

I’m a bedroom producer, and was given a free copy of “brainworx bx_console focusrite sc” when Native Instruments/Izotope/Plugin Alliance/brainworx launched their ‘Soundwide’ alliance back in April of this year (2022 - there were a bunch of other freebies that came along with the launch too).

I’m interested in learning more about producing with a virtual console, and have done some research into how eg. a Neve console works. With the Focusrite console emulation, I couldn’t work out what the signal path is through the components. I know that on some Neves you can route the compressor before or after the EQ, but that path is not obvious from the brainworx Focusrite GUI. It’s not mentioned in the PDF manual either.

I contacted the brainworx support team to ask for a description or a block diagram of the Focusrite console signal path, and that’s when things got disappointing…

The first guy who replied said that they don’t provide that information. I found that a terrible response and wrote back to say so, but this ‘support’ guy just closed the ticket.

I emailed back and said I wanted to speak to his manager. The manager came back to me and would only say that the plugin is a 1:1 emulation of the hardware, and there are many videos explaining how the hardware works. He did not provide a link to any such video. I am still trying to find one.

Just wanted to post this here as I think it’s such a massive fail. How can the software manufacturer’s own support not describe how one of their flagship products work? How can they be so unhelpful (and in the first guy’s case = rude) to a customer? If I had bought this software at the launch price of $350, would they still have had no answer to give me?

My overall take is that if the software requires a working knowledge of the actual console, then they shouldn’t have chosen it as a giveaway to thousands of users. If anyone knows how the signal path actually works on the Focusrite Console, I’d be very keen to know!!

Why do you think you're owed any explanation regarding a product you didn't pay for? That particular plugin is pretty easy to figure out...

[sjm]

Why do you think you're owed any explanation regarding a product you didn't pay for? That particular plugin is pretty easy to figure out...

That's a really short-sighted way of seeing this. The more pertinent question would be: if you're giving away free plugins as a PR exercise in the hope of enticing people into your ecosystem - and hopefully convert them into paying customers - why would you want to give them a poor experience? Will that help the conversion rate?

[sikdrumz]

Why do you think you're owed any explanation regarding a product you didn't pay for? That particular plugin is pretty easy to figure out...

I didn’t pay for it, I was given it as a promo by the manufacturer.

They have a support desk. Users should be able to ask simple questions to the support desk, and receive a courteous and helpful response. I didn’t.

Users should also be able to rely on the manual to provide understandable guidance. I couldn’t.

Forums like this exist to help users find out info about commercial products. I’m happy to have added some meaningful information.

[jamcat]

What if you bought a $15,000 PA plugin during INSANE PROMO (3/3) for $1.50?
Are you entitled to support then?

[sikdrumz]

If you’re a legit user of the product (ie you’re not using a cracked version) then it’s pretty obvious that you are entitled to support.

[Googly Smythe]

If you want the authentic mixing desk work flow in the box, you should do something like this:
Put an instance of your channel strip on every channel;
Print to audio;
Create a new project and import that audio;
Put a channel strip on every channel;
Now mix.

To emulate using different studios for recording and mixing ( a common practice) use a different channel strip.

I talk about this process a lot. I don't print to audio and create a new project, though.

<big snip/>

This holistic approach is designed to replicate the studio sessions and organic decision making process of the classic studio era, and of course, the sound. When you follow a similar paradigm, you will never say things like "when should I use compression?" or "help, I don't know how to EQ!" because these things become obvious. Back in the day, mixers used their tools to get the job done, and get a good sound to tape, not simply because they were there and their inserts looked empty.

A different approach to the reach same goal - to recreate the classic mixing desk workflow:
->record to multi-track tape;
->mix from multi-track to stereo;
->master for whatever format.
The trouble is, DAWS enable the worst of bad habits in the production of music, and I'm as guilty as the next man. But being a 100% hobbyist who gives his music away, I can afford not care!

[licasto2]

Why do you think you're owed any explanation regarding a product you didn't pay for? That particular plugin is pretty easy to figure out...

I didn’t pay for it, I was given it as a promo by the manufacturer.

They have a support desk. Users should be able to ask simple questions to the support desk, and receive a courteous and helpful response. I didn’t.

Users should also be able to rely on the manual to provide understandable guidance. I couldn’t.

Forums like this exist to help users find out info about commercial products. I’m happy to have added some meaningful information.

Page 16 in the manual. I have the Focusrite ISA 430 which is a clone on the original mixer channel strip. The only routing is EQ/filters pre or post comp/gate. You couldn't get more info because there isn't more info than that. FYI The hardware sounds much better but the plug has its uses.

[pixel85]

There's something distinct about this music and it frustrates me to no end that i can't figure out what it is.

- autotune/ melodyne
- overprocessing
- robot-like perfectionism in editing

Those are the things that are taking away human part from the music. No place for natural "feeling", tiny mistakes and everything what makes us humans.
Today, to make music more "natural" we are using "humanization" in MIDI instead of letting professional musician play its part. And even if we do, it's quantized to perfection or fake imperfection.

Today even church choirs are using autotune. Vocalists getting panic attacks on a thought that they could sing a few cents away from the perfect note.
Robot music ut it's not electro thus it sucks

Ps. I'm still finding good pop music (way more in the underground) and I'm in my late 30s. My mind is not (yet) set to "everything new is bad and evil" But I can see major differences before and after music became made entirely in DAWs.

[pixel85]

Back on topic:
Hey, it's plugin alliance. Next week they will have another "the best ever console ever emulation ever". Just join PA slutz and buy the next one

[standalone]

radio plays the same and in time we forget things like englebert humperdinck

I still blame Tom Jones, that vengeful Welsh impresario