KVR Audio

chk071 · Post by **chk071** » Thu Sep 15, 2016 6:41 pm

How can a comparison like that be objective even? This well shows that we're all perceiving things differently.

And the loads of synths out there show well enough, that every developer has a different interpretation of "sound". Why does Diva sound different to Monark, even though they both sport Minimoog oscillators, and filters? Obviously someone finetuned something a bit differently. And, yes, i know, Diva is not a dedicated emu, and the parameters, and envelopes may differ, and also different models of the same synth sound different. But, it's quite day and night for some patches, if you compare those. And the difference obviously become even more massive, when comparing different non-modelled synths. And, to stick with the supersaw thing, i think there are big difference between synths with that type of sound. Some sound fizzy and don't have a very wide stereo impression (Dune 1), some sound a bit harsh and metal-y (Z3TA, still good for those type of sounds), some sound airy (Waldorf synths), some sound a bit rough, and saturared (Sylenth1), and so on. All i can say is that with Sylenth1 for example, it really is no coincidental accident, or marketing (they didn't do that at all AFAIC), that it became so popular for "that" sound. It just is damn good at that.

Elektronisch · Post by **Elektronisch** » Thu Sep 15, 2016 6:43 pm

So what are you arguing about?

recursive one · Post by **recursive one** » Thu Sep 15, 2016 6:45 pm

I think I can hear difference between Hive and Sylenth even in case of supersaws. Well, if we talk bare oscillators, the difference may be not that big, but actual useable patches sound different also because of the filters and the envelopes.

Which one is better is purely a taste thing, I prefer Sylenth, but as for super/hypersaws, I rate Virus TI, Spire and Diva above them both. Sylenth does some other things extremely well (Arp 303 saw!!!

). Not sure how Hive handles these kinds of things - acidic sequences and squelches, psytrance rolling basslines, some kind of legato/glide sequences with filter resonance heavily cranked up - its filter is tuned somehow differently so I was unable to recreate these patches when I was demoing Hive.

In any event I'm not going to buy Hive in its current state as I have all the other synths I've mentioned here but I'm looking forward to see more things added to it.

chk071 · Post by **chk071** » Thu Sep 15, 2016 6:45 pm

Elektronisch wrote:So what are you arguing about?

About the question in the topic title.

recursive one · Post by **recursive one** » Thu Sep 15, 2016 6:51 pm

chk071 wrote: All i can say is that with Sylenth1 for example, it really is no coincidental accident, or marketing (they didn't do that at all AFAIC), that it became so popular for "that" sound. It just is damn good at that.

I think "the Sylenth fenomenon" is easily explained by the fact that it has hit the market in the right time. Uplifting trance was extremely popular, everybody was raving about Virus and JP80x0 which were crazy expensive, plugin synths were in their early teens and suddenly a 200 dollar VSTi does this trance thing almost as good as the hardware. Should Sylenth be first released after 2014 i think it would be put into "nice but nothing special" cathegory by most users.

Nielzie · Post by **Nielzie** » Thu Sep 15, 2016 6:54 pm

aumordia wrote:
This video with Tom Morello (the guitarist for Rage Against the Machine) is worth pondering:

WOW.. That's really really surprising, and for me personally quite inspiring actually

Nielzie · Post by **Nielzie** » Thu Sep 15, 2016 6:55 pm

Oops Double Post

Synthetic Wav · Post by **Synthetic Wav** » Thu Sep 15, 2016 6:57 pm

recursive one wrote: Which one is better is purely a taste thing, I prefer Sylenth, but as for super/hypersaws, I rate Virus TI, Spire and Diva above them both. Sylenth does some other things extremely well (Arp 303 saw!!! ). Not sure how Hive handles these kinds of things - acidic sequences and squelches, psytrance rolling basslines, some kind of legato/glide sequences with filter resonance heavily cranked up - its filter is tuned somehow differently so I was unable to recreate these patches when I was demoing Hive.

it s also good at it , acid sounds, psy bassline..personaly i resold it cause i find it too limited for my needs and i find it expensive compared to what you get with dune 2 and spire for a little more.

Elektronisch · Post by **Elektronisch** » Thu Sep 15, 2016 6:59 pm

Sylenth1 became popular because of being a pioneer that matches hardware synths has great gui easy on cpu and it is made by developer that lives and breaths in a country wheres all your favorite electronic dance music producers come from. Alot of those famous artists are not typical synth geeks or right would be to say not so "clever" when it comes to technology in music production and theyr tools, especialy learning something new. Word of mouth is the thing that works the best. Trust me i am working in electronic dance music scene for nearly 10 years i talk i work i do buisiness with high tier artists. Sylenth1 popularity just pure coincidental luck because of right time and promotion to the right people who needed this tool most.

chk071 · Post by **chk071** » Thu Sep 15, 2016 7:00 pm

recursive one wrote:
chk071 wrote: All i can say is that with Sylenth1 for example, it really is no coincidental accident, or marketing (they didn't do that at all AFAIC), that it became so popular for "that" sound. It just is damn good at that.
I think "the Sylenth fenomenon" is easily explained by the fact that it has hit the market in the right time. Uplifting trance was extremely popular, everybody was raving about Virus and JP80x0 which were crazy expensive, plugin synths were in their early teens and suddenly a 200 dollar VSTi does this trance thing almost as good as the hardware. Should Sylenth be first released after 2014 i think it would be put into "nice but nothing special" cathegory by most users.

Yeah, fair enough. Spire came, and it had quite an impact too, IMO because it sounds "right" for these kind of sounds. I mean, the whole EDM soundset marketing rather came after its success, and rather was a product of that, and not the reason why it became so popular in the first place.

Anyway, i will rest my case now. I simply posted why IMO Hive isn't a Sylenth killer, as proposed in the thread title, and laid out the reasons why i don't think it is. It doesn't have to be necessarily right, it's just the way i perceived it here. There are other synths, which were supposedly "Sylenth1" killers too, like Dune 2, at least i read that a couple of times here. Well, maybe, if you're into some specific genres. I haven't really heard much about Dune 2 used in EDM music either, nor have i seen as many soundsets for those genres like for other synths. As Dune 2 has a very flexible unison architecture, it would be kind of predestined for typical sounds of those genres. But, no sir. It's great pad machine though, i'm sure about that.

Elektronisch · Post by **Elektronisch** » Thu Sep 15, 2016 7:02 pm

P.s. i have both synths and i prefer Hive.

fluffy_little_something · Thu Sep 15, 2016 7:03 pm

Wow, 32 pages already

I guess it is safe to say by now that the answer to the thread title question is: not at all.

aumordia · Post by **aumordia** » Thu Sep 15, 2016 7:03 pm

Don't underestimate the importance of ergonomics. Sylenth1 always has been the total package, even back when it had a butt ugly Synthedit GUI. I looked at it (and others) here and there for years while I was in FL land, only finally pulled the trigger when I switched. I'm honestly surprised I bought it, I thought for sure something would supplant it.

The thing is, there are all these synths that can do things Sylenth1 objectively can't, but I don't see anything else that can do what I (subjectively) say Sylenth1 has a near monopoly on: steering you past the bad sounds and letting you rapidly dial in your own great sounds without sucking you down a rabbit hole of tweaking. I'd call it the Apple of soft synths except that it's historically been too ugly for that title

Synthetic Wav · Post by **Synthetic Wav** » Thu Sep 15, 2016 7:06 pm

sylenth also become popular cause of the presets , as many trance producers have no clue how to tweak a synth except tweaking the cutoff and spreading the unisson

with sylenth they could make professional tune just like the guys who owned a virus, using these synths like expanders browsing presets.

chk071 · Post by **chk071** » Thu Sep 15, 2016 7:07 pm

Elektronisch wrote:Sylenth1 became popular because of being a pioneer that matches hardware synths has great gui easy on cpu and it is made by developer that lives and breaths in a country wheres all your favorite electronic dance music producers come from. Alot of those famous artists are not typical synth geeks or right would be to say not so "clever" when it comes to technology in music production and theyr tools, especialy learning something new. Word of mouth is the thing that works the best. Trust me i am working in electronic dance music scene for nearly 10 years i talk i work i do buisiness with high tier artists. Sylenth1 popularity just pure coincidental luck because of right time and promotion to the right people who needed this tool most.

I've seen dozens of artist videos, where they said that Sylenth1 sounds "spot on" for the sounds in Trance music (Markus Schulz for example almost exclusively uses it for synth sounds in many of his tracks). I have a hard time believing that it's pure "coincidence" that it became so popular among producers. Z3TA was already available for years back then, but people still opted for Sylenth1 after. Z3TA offers much more options, and is also fairly straight forward to program, at least as long as you're not fiddling widh moudlations much. Sylenth1 sort of wipes the floor with it regarding the filter though, and the unison also sounds better. And that should also be the reason why it has grown to become more popular after its release.

Now Hive is here, is it RIP Sylenth?