KVR Audio

sonicpowa · Post by **sonicpowa** » Fri Mar 21, 2014 9:52 pm

"a built-in spectrum analyzer "?
Voxengo SPAN is great and free, the development time should be used for other things IMO.

hibidy · Post by **hibidy** » Fri Mar 21, 2014 9:52 pm

5 more days for you guys.

Ogopogo · Post by **Ogopogo** » Fri Mar 21, 2014 9:59 pm

sonicpowa wrote:"a built-in spectrum analyzer "?
Voxengo SPAN is great and free, the development time should be used for other things IMO.

You may be able to find a random midi generator plug as well. Some freeware tools or some stuff that may be even more powerful. Thomas seems to know about that stuff.

sonicpowa · Post by **sonicpowa** » Fri Mar 21, 2014 10:14 pm

Bitwig could take a voting system in place for the most needed and urgent features.
..or they could build a system to vote if we would prefer such a system.

Ogopogo · Post by **Ogopogo** » Fri Mar 21, 2014 10:24 pm

I dunno if voting really helps anything. If they do a decent job of following user opinion they will know what people want most. Having a voting system can make things confusing sometimes because people might imagine features in different ways but you can only vote for the way that it has been described already. And the Bitwigs need to reserve the right to implement their own versions of what people ask for or not implement stuff at all if it will conflict with the paradigm. I think Reaper has shown that if people are invited into the process they will simply ask for everything. Reaper is having problems incorporating everything people want and keeping it simple. And Reaper is sort of made as the roll your own daw; in Bitwig it is even more important to keep things sleek because it intends to be a more straightforward and intuitive working environment. The Reaper devs don't seem to follow the most voted for features that faithfully anyway, last time I checked there was still some high level stuff that they had not bothered with for one reason or another.

Ogopogo · Post by **Ogopogo** » Fri Mar 21, 2014 10:34 pm

Reaper also has this issue where it is driven by forum geeks, not that I have a problem with being a forum geek, hehe. It's just that since the forum is where all the thinking and voting goes on the needs of people who will hang around a forum and vote on a bunch of FRs are over-represented. This could be part of the reason that Reaper lacks polish; the non geek types are not there to push for everything being smoothed out. In fact the non-geeks are probably staying away from Reaper in the first place.

sonicpowa · Post by **sonicpowa** » Fri Mar 21, 2014 10:38 pm

^ Yea.. relevant points.. so NO to the voting..

ZenPunkHippy · Post by **ZenPunkHippy** » Fri Mar 21, 2014 10:39 pm

Voting is useful to get an general idea of what users want, but not when selecting specific features. The final design decisions are best left to the developers (of any software or product, not just Bitwig)

Ogopogo · Post by **Ogopogo** » Fri Mar 21, 2014 10:43 pm

I'll bet they will just have a wishlist section on the forum like ableton.

Redukt · Post by **Redukt** » Fri Mar 21, 2014 10:51 pm

Ogopogo wrote:
sonicpowa wrote:"a built-in spectrum analyzer "?
Voxengo SPAN is great and free, the development time should be used for other things IMO.
You may be able to find a random midi generator plug as well. Some freeware tools or some stuff that may be even more powerful. Thomas seems to know about that stuff.

I'm fully aware of the fact that there are a lot of free spectrum analyzers and MIDI generators around - on the other side, so are also a lot of free reverbs, delays, samplers and EQs, still there are such devices in Bitwig.

The point is, i like to work as much "in the box" as possible. Integrated plugins usually are much faster, lighter on the CPU, don't require addtional space as they live inside the device lane and, last but not least, look A LOT better as they share the same GUI.

I'm pretty sure these are not very high on the list for planned features and it's no dealbreaker in any way for me but i hope they will be implemented some time in the future.

We all have features we'd like to see and are important to the way we work. Some want to see comping as soon as possible, others need a MIDI to audio function and everyone else want it to go on sale for 99 bucks. Some is realistic, some is not...

Everyone wants cats, though - the one thing we can all agree on.

ZenPunkHippy · Post by **ZenPunkHippy** » Fri Mar 21, 2014 10:54 pm

Not to dismiss your needs, but I think most users of any host would agree that effects such as reverb, delay, compression take precedence over a visual spectrum analyser. Less urgent features will likely be implemented in a future update (as already discussed many times).

ThomasHelzle · Post by **ThomasHelzle** » Fri Mar 21, 2014 11:11 pm

I can see more modulation and midi tools in BWS future too.
But I'd say let them release it as it is, have them go through the initial storm that will follow and I'm sure after that has settled, they are very eager to implement a lot of cool stuff.

As for Random Midi, I found the Pizmidi Tools pretty good.
I tried to create my own midi tool in Reaktor but it's way too heavy for such a simple task, so in the end I either need go get into VST coding myself or wait for the BWS SDK/v2.
Although I also have high hopes for the Loomer - non-Epoch plugin which seems the über-midi tool from what was shown so far. And Loomer is as cross Plattform as BWS...
Hopefully I will live to see it

Cheers,

Tom

Ogopogo · Post by **Ogopogo** » Fri Mar 21, 2014 11:13 pm

Redukt wrote:I'm fully aware of the fact that there are a lot of free spectrum analyzers and MIDI generators around - on the other side, so are also a lot of free reverbs, delays, samplers and EQs, still there are such devices in Bitwig.

The point is, i like to work as much "in the box" as possible. Integrated plugins usually are much faster, lighter on the CPU, don't require addtional space as they live inside the device lane and, last but not least, look A LOT better as they share the same GUI.

I'm pretty sure these are not very high on the list for planned features and it's no dealbreaker in any way for me but i hope they will be implemented some time in the future.

We all have features we'd like to see and are important to the way we work. Some want to see comping as soon as possible, others need a MIDI to audio function and everyone else want it to go on sale for 99 bucks. Some is realistic, some is not...

Everyone wants cats, though - the one thing we can all agree on.

Yeah, I can relate. There are plenty of granular synths out there but I think I'd like one integrated in Bitwig. It would fit in the device lane, be easier to use the mod system with, and maybe browse presets with. Plus I wouldn't have to pay extra for it...

hibidy · Post by **hibidy** » Fri Mar 21, 2014 11:23 pm

Ogopogo wrote:I'll bet they will just have a wishlist section on the forum like ableton.

I hope it isn't largely ignored like other forums

chadjohnson · Post by **chadjohnson** » Fri Mar 21, 2014 11:32 pm

dom@bitwig wrote:
As 1.0 is obviously more focussed on being an inspiring music creation tool, which i think the DAW scene is lacking more than editing DAWs, i think this decision was totally ok. Protools, Cubase and the likes are around for ages and do a great job when it comes to recording and editing. No need to reinvent the wheel in that department...

Cheers,
Dom

I don't think the daw scene is missing inspiring tools. Ableton is quite good at what it does. The daw scene is missing an integrated platform that has all the electronic music friendly tools Ableton has (and more) while also having the essential tools of the classic daws. From what I have seen, BitWig is off to a great start, but I hope for getting the essential daw tools in place quickly. Comping is essential to me because even though I make regimented "commercial" electronic music, I play every part into the sequencer with a keyboard and I do it using 20 takes until I settle on a pattern I like. That is inspired music creation to me.

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