2x New Moog Hardware - 'Sub37' and 'Theremini'

[himalaya]

First the matrix approach in the Pulse 2 works nicely if you are used to it

Ingo

and a mouse + computer works nicely too if you are used to it. Right?

The Matrix doesn't actually work nicely if you want to be spontaneous and treat the front panel as a performance set up or just edit very quickly:

As I turn the cutoff knob, I want to change the envelope attack at the same time, can't be done. Now while I'm tweaking the pulse width on osc 1, I want to lower the volume of osc 3...ooops can't be done either. Etc...

There is nothing like a panel full of direct access knobs since it allows you to be spontaneous and fast - which is the main appeal of an analog synth for me (that and the sound, obviously).

The matrix has its place obviously - it's a cost and space saving design - but that's all.

[spacecult]

But this one is a work of beauty.

It sure is!

I'll do everything I can to afford it on it's release!

Impressive mod options for a new analog synth. I remember the Sub Fatty being able to kb track the LFO rate, if this is true for the Sub 37, that would be awesome... analog FM for filter and waveform anyone?

1kHz max rate for lfo hasn't been bumped up, unfortunately. BUT, you can use one of the oscillators as a mod. source, now, so... everything looking all right still on the new moog.

(I think, anyway. Says osc 1/osc2 pitch. Suppose that could possibly be the pitch control voltage, but, surely not..?)

[EvilDragon]

One feature i find nice in the Pulse 2 is that you could switch off keytracking for Osc 1 and/or 2 to create drone like sounds. Does the "KB CTRL" control at Osc 2 do the same in the Sub 37?

It is possible to disable keytracking on Sub 37 as well, Amos shows that in Sonicstate video.

BTW the envelopes of the Sub 37 seem to have a "loop" mode now like in the Pulse 2 envelopes. This is an interesting feature for certain sounds.

Sub Phatty has loopable envelopes as well, no new things here.

[himalaya]

Studio Electronics Boomstars have loopable envelopes too, which I believe was the first of the new breed of standalone analog synths to introduce this (correct me if I'm wrong).

[faun2500]

I had to stop watching that video to post this...

WOW!!

That thing sounds good!
I bet it will be expensive lol

$1500. Not expensive for what it is, really. Could clear out 1000 units at a little over $2000, I would think. Very nice that Moog has been feeling competitive, lately. A little bit vicious, even?

Thats about £900. It is doable... one day.

[faun2500]

Got A Waldorf Pulse 2 and Moog Slim PHatty here so not really feeling tempted here.
If envelopes are digital like in the Pulse 2 i don't see big advantages for the Sub 37 in comparison.
While the paraphonic mode in the Pulse 2 is limited to the variable Pulse waveform it got up to 8 voices and also a mode with unison is available. In the APW modes depending on the pulsewidth you could also add a sub-harmonic to the sound.

Anyway like with other new products of them (like the Sub Phatty last year) i'll try to test this new Moog in March at the Musikmesse.
A few things i like about the Sub 37 compared to the Sub Phatty are e.g. aftertouch (like that very much in the Pulse 2), a bigger keyboard (3 octaves), a LCD display and a bigger patch memory.

I bet that they'll offer a "Stage" version of the synth after the Tribute Edition is sold out which should be cheaper than this. Maybe a rack version will follow too which then will be again interesting for me as a possible replacement for my Slim Phatty.


Ingo

If there was a version without the keyboard I would be more interested too. I remember you saying you were going to sell the slim phatty because you got the pulse 2.

You can have three synths you know?! lol

I intend to get a few more anyway! Pulse 2 next

[Ingonator]

. I remember you saying you were going to sell the slim phatty because you got the pulse 2.

Could still happen that i sell the Phatty but not at the moment.

I had created a full 100 patches bank for the Slim Phatty starting back in 2011 that is still unpublished but i had published demos here:
http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... 2&t=371174

Was never totally happy with it yet to a point where i thought i would publish it.

Anyway i had recreated some of those patches when i did my factory sounds for the Pulse 2. Currently i started working on a commercial bank for the Pulse 2 and maybe will recreate some more of those patches there (which could involve some changes/improvements). That Pulse 2 bank should include a minimum of 100 patches but more (maybe 150) if possible. It will not be based on any specific category or genre but based on what comes to my mind or whhat i get inspired by. While i also got the Pulse 2 editor from Synnys (including a Max4Live version) i still like using the hardware interface for programming patches. First because i am used to it from the beta testing and second because i think it just works nicely.
Hope to have a "preview" version of the bank ready for the Musikmesse in March. Will also check what will happen to the bank for the Slim Phatty.

Waldorf usually invites all Beta testers to the Musikmesse and i participated during the last 3 years.
Of course the Moog booth is always one of the most important to visit.


Best wishes,
Ingo

[vurt]

screw the booths, ill be in the bar.

[Jim Y]

Back in the 1970's, a new MiniMoog D cost in the region of £700-800 (UK pounds).
On that basis, the Sub37 is a steal. And like the Mini, it's got the right features in the right form. It should sell itself!

[Vectorman]

This does look pretty cool. I see the Multidrive control, so I'm assuming the overall sound of this will be more akin to the Sub Phatty than the Little Phatty. Only $300 more than I paid for my last LP and so much more value for money. Nice.

[Sequent]

I'm with Himalaya... especially for that kind of money, I prefer the immediacy of individual controls for every function. For the price, the matrix on the Pulse 2 is okay... and I'm well familiar with the matrix setup via my other Waldorf synths. Waldorf seems to have implemented it pretty well. But even so, I really prefer the individual knobs as on my XTK.

What I also like about the Sub 37 is that I expect it to have top notch build quality... as opposed to say the MS20 Mini - which (to be perfectly honest) you almost feel like you kind of have to be careful not to sneeze too hard on it.

I also like that the Sub 37 is made in Ashville by people who have been crafting Moogs for all these years.

And I like that for your $1500 you're getting a pretty solid piece of hardware and not just a big hunk of plastic like the Bass Station II. Granted, the BSII feels super solidly put together and of course, ultimately the sound is all that really matters, but it's also nice to have a really lovely instrument that I expect should easily last for the next twenty years or even more.

IMO, they seem to really have hit one out of the park with this one.

[olikana]

damn i'd be tempted to buy one even just for the hardware.
it's the best synth midicontroller money can buy for my needs
37 quality keys with aftertocuh (perfect)s
40 quality 14bit knobs (superperfect)
moog build quality etc

there's no recall/endless knobs....but as i start from scracth each sound as i go along that's no issue personally.
active panel can send knob positions to the soft synth, plus it has optional relative snapping of knobs if minor live tweaks are needed etc.

and the fact it comes with a killer fully featured analog synth in it makes it almost a no brainer.
only issue as always is the UK price
1500$ should be 900£ in theory....but with VAT/ import taxes etc...it will will cost 1200£ (=2000$) at least that's the price UK retailers are starting to list it for :/

[spacecult]

(I think, anyway. Says osc 1/osc2 pitch. Suppose that could possibly be the pitch control voltage, but, surely not..?)

Anyone know if this is oscillators as mod source or just some pitch cv type of thing? Can't find an answer really. First assumed it was oscillators like an older moog but maybe naive due to .

[Ingonator]

(I think, anyway. Says osc 1/osc2 pitch. Suppose that could possibly be the pitch control voltage, but, surely not..?)

Anyone know if this is oscillators as mod source or just some pitch cv type of thing? Can't find an answer really. First assumed it was oscillators like an older moog but maybe naive due to .

In the "old" Little Phatty (and Slim Phatty) you could use Osc 2 as a mod source.

Did not find that on the panel of the Sub 37 yet:
http://www.moogmusic.com/imgs/SUB_37_TRIBUTE.pdf

On the other hand it seems to be possible to switch the LFOs to a higher rate (up to 1000 Hz AFAIK)


Ingo

[spacecult]

Yes, Ingo, it's not on the panel but something in the blurbs about osc1/osc2 as a 'programmable source', so guess this is something you access via the lcd. But, it says pitch right after it says osc1/osc2. So... Hmm...