Does FLStudio have PDC?

[xander]

"by default" with directX

DX plugins indeed allow latency compensation, but it's in fact more the way DX plugins are processed that make latency compensation unneeded for them (and in a way, that's why some of them don't work in FL or other hosts than Sonar). It's totally different, in fact better than VST's, but you know like me that DX filters kinda failed (as usual with recent microsoft stuff, it's well thought, fully expandable, but too complex and there hadn't been enough simple examples).

-it would be a lot of work to implement that I dont really want to bother with

you know, at some point it will be overhyped and FL will have it. It won't have it fully working, since as I'm saying it's not logically doable. But since people barely need it, no one will notice. Hey you didn't notice in other hosts, so..

-in some cases, I might not even have an idea on how to implement it

if you have, tell me

Umm, so Magix, Steinberg, Emagic and Digidesign are magicians?

no, but you didn't test them far enough to realize it doesn't always work

But since people barely need it, no one will notice. Hey you didn't notice in other hosts, so..

Gol - go do another splif and think about this.

Get five or six instances of any decent synth/FX plug/whatever and you've got big latency issues in FLS. You give me the keys to JMC's Porsche for a week and I'll fly up there and prove it - prove that it's needed.

As far as the 'live orchestra analogy* is concerned, I had more than one baton thrown at me for 'dragging' the rhythm section.

I want layered kicks to kick when they're supposed to kick and chords to up-strum with the snares - on beat.

There's a big damn difference in making your tracks sound *tight* and sounding like you're f**king drunk.

My HO - dude.

[Rik]

i think i just said something like this.

theres 2 people with the same idea!!!

come on gol

I wouldn't mind even if the PDC would disable features in the bussing..

PDC has been a big feature in the latest major updates of the main sequencers (just look how much Steinberg and Digidesign have been advertising on it)... I think it should be on the top of the list for new features.

And Gol, now that Mike Oldfield is using FL, you don't want him to have delay for some fxes in his next album, do you?

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[ericj23]

Does SX do the bussing pre or post send?

not sure what you mean but the latency compensation for bussing is not a doodle if you start bussing the inputs to several groups then start passing info between the groups

lets say you have 4 channels all of which send to a bus

then two of them send to another bus, which is mixed with the ouput from the first bus

then both buses and all 4 inputs are sent to the same send

grouping the four together into the first bus is easy enough - just delay certain tracks so they all arrive at the first bus at the same time- but because the second bus needs the output from the first bus plus some of the four inputs the inputs effectively have to be sent twice - and then with all of them going to the send the inputs and the groups ahve to arrive at that at the same time - so thats the inputs being sent 3 times

the free routing of logic, live etc is what stops them from being able timpliment pdc throught the system - cubase does have a fixed cascading system - so bus 2 cannot send to bus 1 - but 1 can to 2

now im not very fmiliar with the groups and sends in fruity so I dont know if its easy or not

but as someone who uses powercore reverbs alot - thank god its there

[tony tony chopper]

I think that the people most likely to be affected by a complete lack of PDC in FL Studio are the ones running DSP cards like UAD-1 and TC PowerCore

That's different. Those have problems in FL not because of delay, but because they expect the host to have a fixed buffer size. It's the case for many hosts, but FL asks plugins (totally according to the VST specs) to process a random amount of samples (under the maximum amount). That's the problem DSP card-assisted plugins have in FL.

cubase does have a fixed cascading system - so bus 2 cannot send to bus 1 - but 1 can to 2

FL has a kinda cascading system as well (well it's the only way anyway), but it computes a mapping to sort busses, so that you can send track 2 to track 1, because it then internally processes 2 before 1. But then you have nightmares like a mixer track with its own delay sending to a send (or more), then mixing into another mixer track with its own delay, and sending to the same sends. And then you have to take 'fruity send' plugins into account, those send signals in-between effects. Sytrus can send as well..

And when you have solved the above problem, now think about mixer tracks 1 & 2 mixing into track 3, then tracks 5 & 6 mixing into track 3 as well, all with their own latency and using the same sends.

Get five or six instances of any decent synth/FX plug/whatever and you've got big latency issues in FLS. You give me the keys to JMC's Porsche for a week and I'll fly up there and prove it - prove that it's needed.

define 'decent', because I may only know undecent ones that don't cause any delay then. I'm sure this is gonna be an overhype feature and people will start to think that more than 1% of their plugins introduce a latency. How about a PDC group buy thread?

[tony tony chopper]

oh, and I even didn't mention the problem with FL's internal controllers. In the above example, picture a peak controller plugin on one of the mixer tracks, controlling something in another..

[Kriminal]

Whats PDC? Seriously.

Plugin delay Compensation

i.e. when you use an effect like sir that delays the audio, the hos compensates automatically and puts everything in time, AS LONG as the plug in itself reports the delay data to the host.

You're using orion right Krim? then definitely you don't have it.

Actually, i do

Its called a Unit Delay plug:

here's the numbers you enter in the Unit Delay (the delay is now 8960 samples in the latest version 1.008)

93.33 when working @ 96 kHz
186.67 when working @ 48 kHz
203.17 for 44.1 kHz

[tony tony chopper]

mmh if you want a delay plugin that you'll have to insert into each mixer track, and insert latency values manually, well I can do that

[Kriminal]

mmh if you want a delay plugin that you'll have to insert into each mixer track, and insert latency values manually, well I can do that

I dont, i dont use SIR. I dont feel the need for a 'Gregorian Hallway On A Wednesday Just After Tea' type reverb on my snares

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[Rik]

define 'decent', because I may only know undecent ones that don't cause any delay then. I'm sure this is gonna be an overhype feature and people will start to think that more than 1% of their plugins introduce a latency. How about a PDC group buy thread?

Compressors with lookahead are the most common ones... I patch trackplug on almost every track and I use very often lookahead. I can't say I have much compressors plugs with lookahead but their are my most used ones.

Erik.

[VitaminD]

Actually, i do

Its called a Unit Delay plug:

...

that is NOT actual PDC.. well not automatic PDC.. which is what the thread is speaking of..

you could get the same type plugin as you are mentining in DX format from the analogx website for free..

though with PDC the host *automatically* masks the delay (without the use of a plugin) which then makes it a lot easier to manage as well as frees up extra insert fx slots.. Orion (as beautiful as it is) still doesnt have this feature.

hopefully for v6? but then again some of us are still hoping on seeing collapsing mixer strips in orion..

[bmanic]

Gol,

How about giving us pdc on that one simple master output channel.. ok?

bManic "Fruit cake" bTm