Software vs Hardware Synth (better investment for beginners?)

[Effectsworks]

Buy a good midi controller and a couple good hi-end soft synths. You'll save yourself heaps in the long run... Unless you're really after a specific piece of hardware that is.

[jbananas]

I love my grandmother moog, it sounds more natural than the vst equivalents imo.

[BONES]

Then your opinion is flawed and not worth much.

[justin3am]

If we are talking about an educational investment, rather than a monetary one, then it really depends on what the student wants to learn.

In my tech support role, one thing I hear very often is, "I'm learning to play piano/keyboard and I just want something which will make sound on it's own". Of course, I provide instructions for using a MIDI controller with the included DAW software; but ultimately, if they aren't interested in learning the production side of things, a MIDI controller and DAW might be overkill. Not in terms of money but in terms of the amount of (potentially irrelevant) new concepts. Learning how to setup a computer for low-latency audio can be an insurmountable obstacle to some. In that case, maybe a keyboard with built-in sound module is a good place to start and then add a portable recorder when needed.

When I talk to people who are starting from no experience about starting to make music, I often recommend a software setup. If they already have a computer, the initial investment (money wise) can be basically zero, so there is no risk. They can try some free/demo things, and then start making purchases when they have an idea of the direction they would like to go.

[kritikon]

It often boils down to something really simple like "I like twiddling knobs". "I don't like twiddling a mouse."

In terms of investment for a newb - almost certainly s/w is a better investment initially. Also depends on what they want to achieve though. Once they've learnt their newb stuff - it's entirely down to personal taste and enjoyment. Horses for courses. I'd personally rather spend thousands and have fun making weird noises twiddling knobs. If I was in it for a job, or I wanted to concentrate on making actual tunes and end product, I'd probably use VSTis a little more. If I was gigging - not sure. There are pros and cons for s/w and h/w for live use.

I could drink crappy lager that tastes of onions and granny piss - it contains the same amount of alcohol as boutique brewed IPA, but ultimately I enjoy the taste of IPA. I can afford it, I don't have to drink cheap piss. End of. Same with synths - I can afford to waste my own money on my own enjoyment - don't care if I can do similar with s/w. I could live in a hole in the ground in a sleeping bag and have loads of spare cash as a result. But I can afford and choose to live in a nice house by the beach and consequently have less money. End of.

[pdxindy]

It often boils down to something really simple like "I like twiddling knobs". "I don't like twiddling a mouse."

One of the things I like about hardware is they are self contained and have their own limits so never run out of CPU in a way I have to think about. They never start crackling or glitching.

Most of my favorite softsynths are on the heavier side for CPU use. So adding in some hardware I can have more 'live' voices. And that also gives me the option to not use software and the computer sometimes as I have enough hardware voices to create an entire composition.

[BONES]

That's not accurate. Hardware runs out of CPU long before software does, it's just that those limits are hardwired into the device - via limited polyphony, tiny mono screens, etc. - so the boundaries are fixed and, therefore, known up-front. That's why you can't buy a hardware synth that can generate 384 saw waves, like ArcSyn does, and play 10 note chords with it. Then there are limitations in terms of things like sequencer tracks. How many tracks in an Analog 4? How many tracks in any software sequencer/host? Seriously, can you imagine anyone paying for a VSTi that only let you have a single instance, with 8 notes maximum polyphony, or a DAW that only had 4 tracks? You'd be laughed at if you even suggested it. But you want us to believe that when you've paid thousands for hardware, those pointless limitations make it better. Do you not see how utterly stupid that is?

I'd also point out that in 20 years of working ITB, I have never come close to running out of CPU and that on my current laptop it is rare to see Studio One's CPU meter go above 30%. Better still, 30% on Studio One's meter usually translates to less than 20% in Task Manager. I'm hoping that next time we play live, I'll be able to run everything on a 7 year old Surface Pro (Core i5) I paid $300 for. That's how much of an issue CPU use is to me.

[pdxindy]

That's not accurate. Hardware runs out of CPU long before software does, it's just that those limits are hardwired into the device

Yes, that is what I said... hardware never runs out of CPU in a way I have to think about.

[pdxindy]

That's how much of an issue CPU use is to me.

If only every human was exactly the same as you... 7 Billion Bones

[donkey tugger]

7 Billion Bones

That's about 34 million full humans (given that each has 206 in a body). Still a lot of grumpy Australians, I'll grant you.

[johnwoo]

I like and use a lot software , crazy sounds I get from my vst synths ... But my joy is my Korg M3 with Radias exb inside and my Yamaha EX7 ... Karma from Korg M3 still amaze me every time I use it .

[zerocrossing]

It often boils down to something really simple like "I like twiddling knobs". "I don't like twiddling a mouse."

One of the things I like about hardware is they are self contained and have their own limits so never run out of CPU in a way I have to think about. They never start crackling or glitching.

Most of my favorite softsynths are on the heavier side for CPU use. So adding in some hardware I can have more 'live' voices. And that also gives me the option to not use software and the computer sometimes as I have enough hardware voices to create an entire composition.

Electronic music has always involved resource management. From the early days of low track counts to modern times of buffer overruns. A self contained instrument never runs out of its own resources (except the notorious Blofeld) but you have to think of a computer as a tape deck, mixer, instruments and effects. Sometimes it boggles my mind how much I can do with something I picked up at Best Buy for $800.

But I’m like you. I often bump up against the limits of what my virtual recording studio full of instruments and effects can do. Having a hardware synth or 8 around can really free things up. I’d describe the likes of you and I as “power users,” though. I don’t think a beginner would have the same issues, and there are a lot of great sounding synths that are pretty low CPU, and that’s not even counting sample based instruments which mostly take up RAM. I say explore that world and find out what it’s made of and then if you feel constricted, start buying hardware synths.

[zerocrossing]

7 Billion Bones

That's about 34 million full humans (given that each has 206 in a body). Still a lot of grumpy Australians, I'll grant you.

Children have more bones, so you need to factor that in.

[BONES]

I like and use a lot software , crazy sounds I get from my vst synths ... But my joy is my Korg M3 with Radias exb inside and my Yamaha EX7 ... Karma from Korg M3 still amaze me every time I use it .

How so? How, for example, is it more powerful/useful than probablity sequencing like you get in Pigments or Studio One?

Yes, that is what I said... hardware never runs out of CPU in a way I have to think about.

Except you do have to think about it, you just think about it at a different time. OTOH, I never have to think about it when I'm working ITB. It was one of the first big advantages I appreciated when I started dabbling in software - the freedom to be able to use as much of everything as I needed with virtually no limits, after years of having to carefully ration the polyphony of my workstations - M1 (16 voices across 8 parts), O1R/W (32 voices across 16 parts) and Trinity (35 voices across 18 parts) - to make sure there were enough for all the parts I needed, which included drums for the Trinity.

If only every human was exactly the same as you... 7 Billion Bones

Nothing special about me. If I can do it, so can absolutely anyone. That people go out of their way to make their own lives so hard for no good reason is a constant source of bemusement to me.

I’d describe the likes of you and I as “power users,” though.

I'd describe you as poor resource managers, far from power user status.

[donkey tugger]

Children have more bones

Probably better than the reverse.