Got Fu**ed by FabFilter (Got fixed by FabFilter, cause after all we're only human)

[jamcat]

A FabFilter license can only be transferred to another person via the FabFilter account of the seller, using the official license transfer feature. If the seller does not agree to do this, he is not selling a legit license, and you should not purchase.

And yet according to the email from FabFilter, that's not what happened here. They admit they sold the license transfers to somebody other than the account holders, and allowed the licenses to be transferred from outside of those accounts!

So once again,

• Proteinshake operated within the rules of FabFilter's second hand license policy.
• FabFilter sold the license transfer to the illegitimate seller.
• FabFilter validated the serial numbers as legit and allowed them to be registered to Proteinshake's account without incident.
• FabFilter allowed Proteinshake to sell and transfer one of the second hand licenses in question, again, without incident.
• FabFilter did not contact Proteinshake about the situation at any time after they became aware of it, and chose to take away even the software he purchased directly from them without any refund or compensation.
• FabFilter created the licensing and transfer system in question, and continue to operate it as is, despite knowing it exposes their customers to exploitation. Instead they're trying to displace responsibility for their flawed system onto its victims.

[jens]

That seems to sum it up nicely!

[billcarroll]

they shouldnt have waited on you getting in touch.
they should have emailed to resolve, as soon as they realised there was an issue.

Exactly this!

The OP could have tread the license transfer info in the FAQ and had FabFilter check the license before purchasing.

This is not FaFilter’s fault or responsibility to fix after the fact when the OP has purchased stolen software. He got scammed and that truly sucks. Not cool to blame FabFilter though.

https://www.fabfilter.com/support/faq#c ... bay-seller

Can I safely buy a (second hand) FabFilter license via an eBay seller?

Most of the times, (second hand) FabFilter licenses that are offered for sale on eBay are not legit.

A FabFilter license can only be transferred to another person via the FabFilter account of the seller, using the official license transfer feature. If the seller does not agree to do this, he is not selling a legit license, and you should not purchase.

Please keep the following things in mind when purchasing (second hand) FabFilter plug-ins via eBay or other websites:

If the price looks too good to be true... it's probably too good to be true.

If people offer OEM licenses, or Windows- or Mac-only licenses: scam, these types of licenses do not even exist.

The only valid way to sell/transfer FabFilter licenses, is via a FabFilter user account.

If you are in doubt about an eBay offer, e-mail us and we'll have a look!

What has this got to do with anything?

Fabfilter themselves accepted the licences (initially) and transferred them to him so that check would have changed absolutely nothing for him. Had they not accepted them his loss would have been smaller than it is atm, since they locked him out of his entire account.

You seem to think you know exactly what happened here with out talking with FabFilter. I doubt we have the full story.

My understanding is these were second hand licenses purchased via the internet from some seller, and had the OP followed the FAQ and had FabFilter verify the licenses it would be FabFilter that was liable.

“If you are in doubt about an eBay offer, e-mail us and we'll have a look!”

[jamcat]

There is one more possibility here.

I clicked on the second hand sale linked a few posts before and then looked at the user profile. He's been on GS for some years and all the sales (from his stats) seems to be recent... then I searched his username on the web and it looks like he uses it on various sites (all legit places). Maybe I'm playing the devil's advocate but, for what we know, it's possible someone hacked/stole his account/identity.

If there has been a data breach at FabFilter, multiple accounts may have been hacked, and those licenses may have in fact been transferred from within the exploited accounts.

If I had a FabFilter account, I would be changing my password right now.

[jamcat]

My understanding is these were second hand licenses purchased via the internet from some seller, and had the OP followed the FAQ and had FabFilter verify the licenses it would be FabFilter that was liable.

“If you are in doubt about an eBay offer, e-mail us and we'll have a look!”

This only protects buyers from buying fake serial numbers, not real ones.

And if you followed FabFilter's advice to its logical conclusion, you wouldn't be buying a second hand license from anyone. Which is actually good advice. But in that case, they just should stop allowing it.

[jens]

You seem to think you know exactly what happened here with out talking with FabFilter. I doubt we have the full story.

I don't at all - but without assuming the OP is a complete liar (which there is zero reason for) I can still say with utter confidence that your suggestion that he should have let FF check the license first is fully off topic as it in no way applies to the situation at hand.
Again: the licences were already in his account. The OP clearly stated that right from the start.

[__Karlo__]

We want names!

terry duckworth.

“Everyone liked Terry. No one suspected a thing. When the news broke, everyone was shocked! How could Terry do something like this?!”

[billcarroll]

You seem to think you know exactly what happened here with out talking with FabFilter. I doubt we have the full story.

I don't at all - but without assuming the OP is a complete liar (which there is zero reason for) I can still say with utter confidence that your suggestion that he should have let FF check the license first is fully off topic as it in no way applies to the situation at hand.
Again: the licences were already in his account. The OP clearly stated that right from the start.

The OP already stated they knew the price was too good to be true.

[jens]

Now that is some proper goal-post moving!

[FakeNatty]

Has Fabfilter not yet replied to OP?

[zerocrossing]

New or “new?” The quotes designate your being sarcastic. Are you being sarcastic?

I'm being realistic. Or do you see much different in a serial number that's "new" vs "used"?

Sure. A huge difference. For the consumer, a used license usually becomes non transferable, so that’s the end of the line for that license. For the company, it’s way worse. They may have spent hours trying to resolve a clueless user’s issue, effectively making no money on the sale of the license, and then they lose another potential sale. Frankly, if I were a software developer, there would be zero license transfers. Every time a license is sold “used,” it’s just one less source of income for someone who worked very hard to make something, and also worked to support it.

But I do hope FabFilter is going to chime in. I have sent support the link to this thread, so they know this is happening.

Yeah, I hope they ignore it. Trying to shame a well respected company when it’s clear that something odd was going on, to say the least, is poor form. If you actually had a logical explanation, I’m sure FabFilter would be happy to fix the issue..

[Jac459]

New or “new?” The quotes designate your being sarcastic. Are you being sarcastic?

I'm being realistic. Or do you see much different in a serial number that's "new" vs "used"?

Sure. A huge difference. For the consumer, a used license usually becomes non transferable, so that’s the end of the line for that license. For the company, it’s way worse. They may have spent hours trying to resolve a clueless user’s issue, effectively making no money on the sale of the license, and then they lose another potential sale. Frankly, if I were a software developer, there would be zero license transfers. Every time a license is sold “used,” it’s just one less source of income for someone who worked very hard to make something, and also worked to support it.

But I do hope FabFilter is going to chime in. I have sent support the link to this thread, so they know this is happening.

Yeah, I hope they ignore it. Trying to shame a well respected company when it’s clear that something odd was going on, to say the least, is poor form. If you actually had a logical explanation, I’m sure FabFilter would be happy to fix the issue..

I agree mostly to what you say with one point on the transferable licence. I don't think it is no value for the editor, it is better to have an active consumer than a consumer not using your product. For example, I bought here Avenger and Falcon. I would never have bought them full price because I have already so many.
First thing I have done is by a lot of extensions... That's good fresh money for them, still better than nothing (even if less good than a new full licence).

Same for fabfilter, I discovered here their products and bought more directly from them thanks to that.

I am not saying that it is same value, I am saying that it has "some" values.

[jamcat]

I agree mostly to what you say with one point on the transferable licence. I don't think it is no value for the editor, it is better to have an active consumer than a consumer not using your product. For example, I bought here Avenger and Falcon. I would never have bought them full price because I have already so many.
First thing I have done is by a lot of extensions... That's good fresh money for them, still better than nothing (even if less good than a new full licence).

Same for fabfilter, I discovered here their products and bought more directly from them thanks to that.

I am not saying that it is same value, I am saying that it has "some" values.

You don’t want to pay the developer the value of their product. That’s pretty much the beginning and end of it.

All these justifications remind me of people arguing that pirates help developers by acting as “brand ambassadors.”

[Jac459]

You don’t want to pay the developer the value of their product. That’s pretty much the beginning and end of it.

All these justifications remind me of people arguing that pirates help developers by acting as “brand ambassadors.”

So you never ever bought anything second hand ? That's a pretty hard stance... I don't think that's something you should be proud of by the way... Not for software in particular, but in general.

Your parallel between something that is legal and accepted by the vendor and something that is illegal is just plain stupid, I will not comment it...

[jamcat]

You don’t want to pay the developer the value of their product. That’s pretty much the beginning and end of it.

All these justifications remind me of people arguing that pirates help developers by acting as “brand ambassadors.”

So you never ever bought anything second hand ? That's a pretty hard stance... I don't think that's something you should be proud of by the way... Not for software in particular, but in general.

Your parallel between something that is legal and accepted by the vendor and something that is illegal is just plain stupid, I will not comment it...

I buy all of my software directly from the developer. Because I want to support their work. Buying secondhand does not support the developer. They see the same amount of income from your secondhand purchase as they see from piracy (zero). It is no different from that standpoint.