How about a host, OS, AND hardware for $499? Off the shelf?

[BONES]

And there's one other interesting thing about the new macs that I've been wondering about - they look almost silent.

I was going to respond to several of your ill-informed points until I read this. Clearly you're an idiot.

[BONES]

OK, throw in an extra $80 or so for a two year on-site warranty covering hardware and software.

But your box wasn't over $1000 now was it?

Hence the $80. If a PC cost the same as an equivalent Mac, I would still buy a PC because it will run all the software I use every day. Even the couple of things I use that are cross-platform [e.g.combustion] run noticably better on PC because that's the platform they are developed on.

Have you installed a Linux distro lately? Me either but about 3 years ago when I last tried I found it conisderably easier and much faster than installing WinXP. It auto-detected all my hardware and configured it. In fact I could get much better graphics quality under Linux than I could under Win98SE and noticably faster/more reliable dial-up access. Maybe I just don't know people as stupid as the people you know?

Have any of you guys read In the Beginning Was the Command Line... by noted fiction author and programmer Neal Stephenson? Its a very thin paperback that is well worth tracking down.

[shamann]

Have any of you guys read In the Beginning Was the Command Line... by noted fiction author and programmer Neal Stephenson? Its a very thin paperback that is well worth tracking down.

Great book, and it is in fact freely available for download here.

One could easily get through it in a single sitting as it's only about 100 pages, and well worth it. Go already.

[neverwhere2012]

i can't understand why you're so angry about this mac mini, bones? your attitude gives the impression that steve jobs may very well be following you around all day whispering propaganda in your ear. no one is making you buy this thing, nor suggesting that you should. if you want to use a PC then for christ's sake, do so and be happy with that.

[bewing77]

OK, throw in an extra $80 or so for a two year on-site warranty covering hardware and software.

But your box wasn't over $1000 now was it?

Hence the $80. If a PC cost the same as an equivalent Mac, I would still buy a PC because it will run all the software I use every day. Even the couple of things I use that are cross-platform [e.g.combustion] run noticably better on PC because that's the platform they are developed on.

Have you installed a Linux distro lately? Me either but about 3 years ago when I last tried I found it conisderably easier and much faster than installing WinXP. It auto-detected all my hardware and configured it. In fact I could get much better graphics quality under Linux than I could under Win98SE and noticably faster/more reliable dial-up access. Maybe I just don't know people as stupid as the people you know?

Have any of you guys read In the Beginning Was the Command Line... by noted fiction author and programmer Neal Stephenson? Its a very thin paperback that is well worth tracking down.

You said that it was free assembly for anything over $1000 not warranty. The $80 was for the warranty. So since your specs are at less than $1000 the assembly and testing would cost money to.

Great, you'll buy a PC and be happy with it, no one is stopping you. I never claimed a mac is better for everything and everyone, I mearly responded to your indication that the PC might be more cost efficient. And sure, Mhz for Mhz it is, but for alot of people that isn't everything.

You are mistaking inteligence for knowledge. An inteligent person does not automaticly posess skills. I for example do know alot about software development and computers since that is my profession. I do however know very little about plumbing. Does this make me more stupid than the plumber? I do know alot of computer users that would rather buy a new computer than having to install a new OS. Heck, there are even businesses that thrive on fixing things like that. But hey, maybe alot of people are really stupid. I am sure that you could give your mom a box of computer parts and she would have a PC with Linux up and running within a day. Maybe my mom is stupid because she sure as hell wouldn't be able to.

Oh and about Linux. Yes I have. I am not saying that it is very difficult to do, but it still is quite a chalenge for less computer litterate people.

[Sascha Franck]

And honestly, a lot the PC folks around here just don't want to say anything good about anything Apple has to offer. That's their choice of course, just probably not the most objective people to listen to. And they have to use Windows, so no wonder they are grouchy.

Oh yeah right, it's the Mac people being the most objective people - spot on...


OK, not to start another war - but the specs on this make it a bad choice for any serious music work. Even at that price.

Advances:
- Will run Garage Band, which is a nice program for some people.
- Will run internet stuff with less risk of being attacked.
- Will work as a Logic node (how well it'll do that is another question...).
- Is more or less transportable. Less because you still need keyboard, mouse, monitor.
- Everything is pre-configured or installed which will make it a very good choice for beginners.

As for the rest of the things that have been mentioned, such as it running Reason well - uhm.
256MB of RAM are laughable for serious music work these days, even my 7 year old Celeron 466 has got more in it - at almost no cost.

For around 400 you can get a 2+ GHz machine with 1GB of RAM and 80 GB of harddrive space.
OK, there's no software such as Garage Band installed, but for anything else you install on it (and you'd still have 100 bucks left) it will eat any Mac mini for breakfast, period.

[neverwhere2012]

For around 400 you can get a 2+ GHz machine with 1GB of RAM and 80 GB of harddrive space.
OK, there's no software such as Garage Band installed, but for anything else you install on it (and you'd still have 100 bucks left) it will eat any Mac mini for breakfast, period.

but you'd have to build it yourself, it wouldn't come with an OS or any other software. as far as the mac mini goes, i want to buy something small and portable to do stereo recording work. it comes with garageband 2 setup and ready to go -- which will do 8 tracks of simultaneous recording in case i feel like dragging my 896HD with me. i can get the ram bumped up to 512mb for an extra $60-70 (which is by far more than enough to record in stereo) and i don't have to think about anything else when i get it. don't have to install anything but my motu drivers and i can just start using it.

however, audio work CAN be performed on this machine. i'm running a 1.2 ghz G4 currently and i have to push reason 2.5 so friggin hard it would make anyone's head spin to get the cpu usage OVER 50%. before i upgraded my current mac's processor, i was able to get a hell of a lot accomplished in reason 2 with the old 350mhz G4 processor. will the mac mini run logic 7 and sculpture like a champ? probably not, but i don't think anyone planning to do serious work with logic 7 has their sights set on anything less than a dual G5. i think the biggest problem with all of the PC users' complaints and assumptions about what this little box can or cannot do is that most of them haven't put a G4 of any speed through it's paces, let alone many G4's of various speeds.

so, what it really boils down to is this: as a mac user, i don't tell people what their PC is capable of doing because i don't work on a PC. and i really don't need someone who's never used a mac telling me my machine can't perform tasks that it performs every day.

[kuniklo]

doesn't get infected with viruses all the time

WTF is this krap I keep seeing around here. I do ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to prevent viruses on my PC and I have never had one. Ever. I don't understand why this is such an issue for people.

Can I have my parents call you next time?

[ouroboros]

BONES

. I do ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to prevent viruses on my PC and I have never had one. Ever. I don't understand why this is such an issue for people.

Are you visiting the same porn sites as everybody else?
Perhaps you have been fortunate enough not to be put on someone's "You gotta' see this" e-mail list...

[BONES]

i can't understand why you're so angry about this mac mini, bones?

I'm not angry about anything. I am just constantly amazed that Apple can have such a mesmerising effect on people. My experience with Mac is absolutely, completely and utterly the same as it is with PC. I cannot find any clear advantage in using one or the other except that a PC represents incredible value for money by comparison. Even if I went and bought a proprietary system from someone like IBM, which eliminates all the pseudo-advantages of preinstalled OS/support/etc, I would get a much better machine for the money with a much longer upgrade life. The fact that I couldn't build a PC for $500 is purely down to the fact that I couldn't source components slow/old enough to compete with the minMac. I'd probably have to resort ot one of those late-night advertisers who do reconditioned, ex-govt PC's for $300 to get similar spec's.
Its a con-job that some people fall over themselves to swallow hook, line and sinker. Just like the fanless Cube that overheated and died if you left it on overnight.

[BONES]

"You gotta' see this" e-mail list...

Or maybe I'm just not stupid enough to look.

[Sascha Franck]

but you'd have to build it yourself, it wouldn't come with an OS or any other software.

No, I won't have to build it myself. 2 GHz machines just can be had that cheap. And they're more or less ultimatively upgradable, which the Mac mini isn't.

don't have to install anything but my motu drivers and i can just start using it.

Same for any PC.
As said, the preinstalled Garage Band is a plus - but that's about it.

[kuniklo]

Have you installed a Linux distro lately? Me either but about 3 years ago when I last tried I found it conisderably easier and much faster than installing WinXP. It auto-detected all my hardware and configured it. In fact I could get much better graphics quality under Linux than I could under Win98SE and noticably faster/more reliable dial-up access. Maybe I just don't know people as stupid as the people you know?

I spend about 9 hours a day on a Linux desktop and I love it as a programmer's workstation. It's really come a long way in the last few years. It's still much more difficult than OsX or XP. It's great if it already does everything you need it to do but the second you need to start plugging in random printers from CompUSA or watching quicktime trailers online it can still get very ugly. It looks like the CD burning apps on Linux are finally starting to get to the point that just about anybody could use them at least.

[Green Red Brownell]

i can't understand why you're so angry about this mac mini, bones?

I'm not angry about anything. I am just constantly amazed that Apple can have such a mesmerising effect on people. My experience with Mac is absolutely, completely and utterly the same as it is with PC. I cannot find any clear advantage in using one or the other except that a PC represents incredible value for money by comparison. Even if I went and bought a proprietary system from someone like IBM, which eliminates all the pseudo-advantages of preinstalled OS/support/etc, I would get a much better machine for the money with a much longer upgrade life. The fact that I couldn't build a PC for $500 is purely down to the fact that I couldn't source components slow/old enough to compete with the minMac. I'd probably have to resort ot one of those late-night advertisers who do reconditioned, ex-govt PC's for $300 to get similar spec's.
Its a con-job that some people fall over themselves to swallow hook, line and sinker. Just like the fanless Cube that overheated and died if you left it on overnight.

Heh, obviously, you have not yet followed the link that I posted previous:

http://www.gizmodo.com/gadgets/images/iProduct.gif

I think the folks at gizmodo are trying to bolster your argument! Try it!

[BONES]

BRILLIANT!