Record: New DAW from Propellerheads

[lotus2035]

..without all the usual dongle shite this thread would be a lot slimmer..

[djanthonyw]

I'm suprised that there are actually people that stick up for and prefer dongles. I wonder if they also voluntarily walk around with a ball and chain attached to their ankle...

Lot of people get married...

The problem is that people talk, but don't actually *listen* when others speak. There are very good reasons why some people prefer to use a dongle over some other forms of copy protection like challenge/response.

The reasons (very logical reasons) have been voiced many times.

A. Even if my Internet connection is down I can still launch my daw on any system no matter what.

B. I get more installations via dongle than the available challenge response licenses and I don't have to ask anyone to cross a certain limit.

C. If you're a musician with a good relationship with a pro studio (or 4) you can install your products there for 100% compatibility with your home projects. You only need bring my dongle and project files. This also goes for you buddies home computer where you collab sometime etc, etc.

Many more reasons with the main one being independent free will to decide what we like or don't like. You shouldn't be surprised to find (in this world) large groups of people who disagree on most anything.

One man's ball and chain is another man's emancipation.

At what point did I say "over some other forms of copy protection"? I was talking in general. From my perspective it seems like some people actually like turning their software (that they could backup) into a useless piece of hardware.

[koolkeys]

It doesn't matter how it compares to other forms anyways. Yes, it IS preferred by many over challenge/response.

But once again, the features and usefulness of a program is FAAAAAAAR more important to me than what protection it uses. Apparently some people focus on their anti-dongle crusades and completely miss that point much of the time.

I don't like dongles over the choice of having no copy protection. But don't think for a second that I'll miss out on the best software for what I do, just in order to prove a point. I think that's useless.

Brent

[djanthonyw]

I'm not trying to prove a point. I've said the reasons why many times here. I like knowing that I can backup and recall my software licenses when need be. You can't do that with dongles. Once I purchase software, I like knowing that even if the dev disappears off the face of the earth I can still run what I purchased.

[5bongo5]

Propellerhead Record Preview

So here's your preview video. He says it's modeled on an SSL.
I noticed it in the comments on CDM's blog about Record.

The Gerry Basserman videos linked on page 40 or so of this thread are *much* more informative, IMO. Make sure you check those out if at all interested. This guy doesn't do a great job of presenting the product.

[grymmjack]

this is interesting. i'm looking forward to trying it. as a reason user, i'm happy right now for the most part with reason rewired into live, however, what i dislike about live is the linear arrangement part of the program. perhaps record will come to my rescue there. the arrange view leaves a lot to be desired in live.

i wonder, will this record product actually take inputs of audio from rewire masters? ie: if i load live up as i do now as rewire master, then record, will i get some I/O into record? or would record actually have to function as a rewire master?

not sure if i'll go for this or not because as i recall live when in rewire slave mode (assuming record can be rewire master) cannot even use vsti/vst plugins.

regardless of how compelling the live suite instruments are, i already have several synths that i'm totally content with at this moment; so even if i do drink the live 8 suite upgrade koolaid (a very tempting offer as it's just $100 more from the current upgrade to plain 8 for me) i still would feel a bit miffed that i couldn't use my existing stuff.

i have to believe that the props are going to at least consider this fact. i mean, maybe i miss it, but it doesn't seem that the combo of live + reason + record allows for /any/ plugins... because as i said live rewired means no plugins, and since record seems like it wont host them, well then...

kinda sucks.

on the other hand though, if i could rewire record into live, then yeah, i'm there probably. i signed up for the beta and i'm amped up to try it out. i watched a video on youtube from keyboard magazine though that said the public beta wont start until a month from now.. perhaps as a reason owner i'll get a little bit earlier access to it, but i'm not holding my breath.

[koolkeys]

I'm not trying to prove a point. I've said the reasons why many times here. I like knowing that I can backup and recall my software licenses when need be. You can't do that with dongles. Once I purchase software, I like knowing that even if the dev disappears off the face of the earth I can still run what I purchased.

But you ALWAYS mention dongles and how against them you are. And it's rarely accompanied by what you just said.

PACE is owned by Digidesign, Syncrosoft is owned by Steinberg/Yamaha. Those are the major players. It's highly doubtful that either of those will go under, and they hold the ability in most cases to provide backup licenses.

You're not ALWAYS screwed if you lose your dongle. There are options, from insurance by the company itself(like iLok, which is very cheap), or the devs themselves, or home insurance(every dongle I have is added to the insurance policy for literally a few bucks a year total).

Some devs give you multiple authorizations to multiple dongles, such as VSL. Heck, VSL even have a policy in place for if you lose your dongle. Most of the dongle companies WILL replace your licenses at the cost of a new dongle, if you break one.

You run a risk a lot of software you buy these days. If you lose or break your disks, not all companies will replace those either. So it's about being responsible and careful. There ARE ways to do this, and thousands of studios(including almost every major pro studio) have and use dongles every day without issue.

Again, it's not cut and dry "lose it and you're screwed". But regardless, it's about the software itself for me, not the protection. I can't imagine fighting a battle like that at the expense of my own productions.

Brent

[Spookyrockstar]

I'm working on the *50* pages, but just wanted to chime in my *excitement* for ReCord.

Whether it's my use of the app, or the app itself. Songs that I have started in Reason have gained me more progress in my career than song created in my other DAWS. (latest versions of Cubase-Sonar-Pro-Tools-Ableton)

I don't really wanna explore *why* anymore and just wanna keep the accolades/business/money coming, so Reason is my scratchpad of choice. Some of the more high profile peeps I worked with didn't give a f**k. (Their gearhead engineers did, but they are not the ones signing my checks.)

My Guitar/bass/drum-kits almost always get replaced by the real thing, and I always tend to move the Reason projects into the other DAWS for use of external FX and UAD and stuff.

Being able to record guitar/vox/bass into my scratchpad of choice? Sold.

I've got my full featured DAWS for heavy lifting, but non-crashy-workflow-works-for-me-made-me-hit-almost-6-figures-in-2007-*songwriting* duties? Sold.

Now where's my BETA?

[John Vulich]

The only thing I don't like about dongles is that my primary computer is a laptop, not only is this inconvenient from the standpoint of it physically protruding from the computer, but my laptop only has two USB ports.

[djanthonyw]

I'm not trying to prove a point. I've said the reasons why many times here. I like knowing that I can backup and recall my software licenses when need be. You can't do that with dongles. Once I purchase software, I like knowing that even if the dev disappears off the face of the earth I can still run what I purchased.

But you ALWAYS mention dongles and how against them you are. And it's rarely accompanied by what you just said.

PACE is owned by Digidesign, Syncrosoft is owned by Steinberg/Yamaha. Those are the major players. It's highly doubtful that either of those will go under, and they hold the ability in most cases to provide backup licenses.

You're not ALWAYS screwed if you lose your dongle. There are options, from insurance by the company itself(like iLok, which is very cheap), or the devs themselves, or home insurance(every dongle I have is added to the insurance policy for literally a few bucks a year total).

Some devs give you multiple authorizations to multiple dongles, such as VSL. Heck, VSL even have a policy in place for if you lose your dongle. Most of the dongle companies WILL replace your licenses at the cost of a new dongle, if you break one.

You run a risk a lot of software you buy these days. If you lose or break your disks, not all companies will replace those either. So it's about being responsible and careful. There ARE ways to do this, and thousands of studios(including almost every major pro studio) have and use dongles every day without issue.

Again, it's not cut and dry "lose it and you're screwed". But regardless, it's about the software itself for me, not the protection. I can't imagine fighting a battle like that at the expense of my own productions.

Brent

It doesn't matter, I still don't like the idea of depending on the dev for my licenses after purchase. Regarding software that only requires a serial or key file, I make multiple backups of my licenses, that freedom is important to me.

[koolkeys]

The only thing I don't like about dongles is that my primary computer is a laptop, not only is this inconvenient from the standpoint of it physically protruding from the computer, but my laptop only has two USB ports.

Get a hub or a USB extender. I have both in my laptop bag. That way a dongle is NEVER hanging out the side of my laptop directly. And my wireless mouse and keyboard both will run from the hub if I need. I do have more than two ports, but a USB hub is the best purchase I've made to protect the dongles.

Brent

[Ubiety]

I'm not trying to prove a point. I've said the reasons why many times here. I like knowing that I can backup and recall my software licenses when need be. You can't do that with dongles. Once I purchase software, I like knowing that even if the dev disappears off the face of the earth I can still run what I purchased.

There's no such thing as a foolproof security system. There are always inherent weaknesses. The apparent weakness in yours is yourself. However, others exist regardless of your comfort level.

[koolkeys]

I'm not trying to prove a point. I've said the reasons why many times here. I like knowing that I can backup and recall my software licenses when need be. You can't do that with dongles. Once I purchase software, I like knowing that even if the dev disappears off the face of the earth I can still run what I purchased.

But you ALWAYS mention dongles and how against them you are. And it's rarely accompanied by what you just said.

PACE is owned by Digidesign, Syncrosoft is owned by Steinberg/Yamaha. Those are the major players. It's highly doubtful that either of those will go under, and they hold the ability in most cases to provide backup licenses.

You're not ALWAYS screwed if you lose your dongle. There are options, from insurance by the company itself(like iLok, which is very cheap), or the devs themselves, or home insurance(every dongle I have is added to the insurance policy for literally a few bucks a year total).

Some devs give you multiple authorizations to multiple dongles, such as VSL. Heck, VSL even have a policy in place for if you lose your dongle. Most of the dongle companies WILL replace your licenses at the cost of a new dongle, if you break one.

You run a risk a lot of software you buy these days. If you lose or break your disks, not all companies will replace those either. So it's about being responsible and careful. There ARE ways to do this, and thousands of studios(including almost every major pro studio) have and use dongles every day without issue.

Again, it's not cut and dry "lose it and you're screwed". But regardless, it's about the software itself for me, not the protection. I can't imagine fighting a battle like that at the expense of my own productions.

Brent

It doesn't matter, I still don't like the idea of depending on the dev for my licenses after purchase. Regarding software that only requires a serial or key file, I make multiple backups of my licenses, that freedom is important to me.

I'm not saying that I don't prefer that method myself. Of course I do. But that doesn't mean I'll miss out on great software just because it has a dongle. Some of what I have I just couldn't replace with anything else.

There are many forms of copy protection that you are screwed with if the dev goes out of business. But that's just a risk you take much of the time. Companies close. Even if you have great no-hassle copy protection, OSX may come out with a new update that breaks compatibility with some software, and having no dev around means no updates. It's just one of many risks that are taken.

I just think that there is more importance to the software than the copy protection. I just think that is the logical way of thinking. But as I said before, to each his own.

Brent

[djanthonyw]

I'm not trying to prove a point. I've said the reasons why many times here. I like knowing that I can backup and recall my software licenses when need be. You can't do that with dongles. Once I purchase software, I like knowing that even if the dev disappears off the face of the earth I can still run what I purchased.

There's no such thing as a foolproof security system. There are always inherent weaknesses. The apparent weakness in yours is yourself. However, others exist regardless of your comfort level.

This doesn't make any sense. I just said that what I'm concerned with is the ability to backup and restore my software licenses when need be. All of my purchased software lets me do this because it's either a serial number or a keyfile, with the exception of the Korg stuff, Ableton Live (I don't really care though since it's an NFR and hardly use it besides beta testing products), and the Synth Squad.

[nuffink]

Mods. Any chance of giving the generic copy protection shite its own thread? It deserves one.